DanaT

Well, motorcycle vs car = wife dont give a damn about statistics. She gives a damn that I am the one making 85% of the money for the house and she PERCEIVES the motorcycle to be dangerous and is now unacceptable. She was fine with the motorcycle 5 or 6 years ago , before we had a kid. Now, she says its irresponsible for me to put little boy toys in front of the family's good. Statistics do not matter when perception is involved. People generally have the most fear of the least possible dangerous thing happening.

I am need to go find a 966TT and take one out. The solution I would prefer, is to keep the 951 to play with and then just buy a non-turbo 996. It would be the same amount of money. But again, that is logic. I am dealing with a wife. 2 cars is worse than 1 car. I think the advice to take for a drive is good.

Doesn't 996 turbo use a slightly different engine than the 996 and I thought less susceptible to RMS failures and such?

-Dana

eclou

completely different engines. The turbo uses the M64/GT1 true dry sump split case motor. Each individual cylinder is bolted on and replaceable. This block is used in all the racing cars too. The regular 996/boxster motor is a wet sump unit prone to IMS, D-chunk, porous block, and slipped sleeve failures. Think of it as Facom or Snap-On quality vs Harbor Freight.

V2Rocket

I can still see a very good outcome from that situation.

V2Rocket

isnt the 996t motor based off the old aircoolers?

Ballistic-Chapman

Completely different car. If you can afford the repairs bills and won't miss the old school feel of the 951, I would shoot for the 996tt.
I placed a little more than 1k miles on a 2003 996tt w/ x50 (450hp) and it's a completely different animal. Pulls like no other, no more turbo lab, power everywhere, modern technology (obviously), steering more refined, different driving feel.

I missed the old school feel, character, looks, and power band of the 951. My 951 had 150less hp and only mild suspension upgrades.

DanaT

I don't know that I necessarily like "old school" in the cars. I know that I do like "old school" pricing. That is one good thing about the 951. It is not $15 to $20k more than the bike and 951. That is probably the biggest drawback to the 996TT.

-Dana

theedge

I will take a different route......

Keep the 951, take the engine out of the bike and put it into a Locost. Voila, no ugly 996, keep the 951, and you have a very fast summer toy with the bike engined Locost.

OntarioTurbo

I have owned many cars and motorcycles over my lifetime. I always wanted a Porsche (930), but couldn't afford the price of admission, until I found my 951. I never thought I'd like it as much as I do. I am totally satisfied and in love with the car. I still want a 911, and will get one some day, but I will not part with my 951.
To me it is like a member of the family or a dog. You don't just get rid of them. You keep them and love them until death.
My 2 cents...sell the bike, go with the 996, but keep the 951. They will look great in your garage together!

minho78

I have never driven a 996TT, but i love them. Yes I would take it over the 951. Although I heard that the 996TT engine it's garbage. That's why they are arround $40K. The 993TT kept it's price high since it's very reliable. But since idon't own one I don't know.

George D

Dana,

The 993/996/997 cars are great GT cars as stock. Many simply wanting the best from the Porsche parts bin, and willing to keep things as scrivined for worldwide sales, will be happy owners.

Once you begin the process of modifications with the 911tt cars, the cost becomes something that requires fairly fat budgets. Granted, Fast951 has shown from his posts, that his Vitesse upgrades will allow any 951 owner to keep up with stock 911tt's of any year of production. Want to keep up in the corners, less than 5K will take you above the stock 911tt capability with the proper driver, and nipping at their heels with a modded one. I'm amazed that the 951 can have 350 to 400whp with stock internals, intercooler, cooling, and still be able to compete in racing conditions. This is an amazing engineering feat, and it took much money to get it right from the onset over 20 years ago.

I have a friend with a 993TT and a client here in Tucson with a 997 Promotive tuned (stock turbos) 911tt. The 993TT had some mods done. Exhaust, new turbos, manifolds for the new turbos, engine management, and a few other items necessary for all to work cost about $50,000. The car felt overpowered, and he then removed the AWD, and completely upgraded the suspension, about $15,000. His 993TT is a great car. Granted, removing the FWD portion seems to be a silly upgrade, but he didn't like the way the car became unbalanced in corners with the new power from his engine upgrades. When the AWD hit the front wheels, he felt the car became unbalanced.

It's his car, and the cost to him wasn't an issue. Seems to me that he should have just purchased the factory deleted 993tt. He is a car nut, and we don't seem to like to get rid of our projects once started.

The guy that has the modded 993 loves driving my car. I suppose it's partly because I purchased it from him, and took his project to the NEXT level. Granted, this is my third 951, as I've realized that this particular Porsche is my favorite. I've simply given up trying other cars and modding them, only to be sold, looking to replace my first 951. I've realized that I'm a Porsche transaxle guy, and I'm building this particular car for me.

I'm stating that it depends on what you want. I happen to think that the Nissan GT-R is the ticket for a great road racing car to take someone from Maine to LA. But then again, I'd do this in my LS series Lexus prior to anything I enjoy at the track, and would be willing to race my LS against most in any long distance highway race from Maine to LA. Silly race, but hope you get my point. Most modern luxury rides can handle insane straight line speeds with good conversation, or tunes heard well.

I like my 951. Granted, it's not the same car as designed back in 1989. It's got over twice the HP, much better suspension and brakes, and we are now spending a few bucks to make it more reliable at 500whp, but I'm a nut, and like the Porsche transaxle cars better than the others.

I've been looking at the new Panamera. This might be something that I'd own to have and enjoy. Porsche is getting back to the 928/944/968 engineering that simply made great cars. Not to take anything away from the 911, love these cars, but I just never fell in love with them.

Good luck with your decision. You can't really make the wrong choice. Just make the right one for you.

Happy Holidays to all you Porsche fans. This list is truly a good intentioned place for us car guys. I'm grateful for all the help you give to me and other folks over the world.

Rob if you read this, thanks for being a good moderator. You must be good at the work you do for money. If you do this well when not getting paid, I can just imagine your competence when you actually get paid.

Hats off to you! You help make this community valuable.

Happy Holidays to all reading my long *** post.

George

333pg333

As observed previously, the 996tt motor isn't garbage. There were problems with the 986 and 996n/a motors though.

RolexNJ

George, great post and thanks for sharing all of that information. We know you have had a lot of cars in your life.

Dana: Listen to what eclou has to say too, he really knows these cars.

George D

I suppose this is why the 993 cars sell for more than the 996 and soon the 997 cars. But is this really Snap-On Quality vs Harbor Freight? If this is true, this is really depressing.

Please elaborate, as I've got friends modding these cars thinking they are up to the task.

G

333pg333

I'm sure the GT2, GT3, and tt cars have a different motors than the 996 n/a , Boxter etc. George.

Those motors have had many problems that eclou touches on and they (Porsche and dealers) have been trying to keep this quiet for a long time.

eclou

George to summarize:

Professional grade motors (M64/Gt1 "Metzger")- 964, 964 turbo, 993, 993tt, 996tt, 996Gt3, 997tt (MY07-09), 997Gt3, 997Gt3RS, 997GT2, Gt1. These motors have a replacement cost from Porsche of ~$35-50k, and are brothers of the actual factory racing Cup/RS/RSR motors.

Consumer grade motors (9A1 "grenade")- 986, 987, Cayman, 996, 997.1, 997.2, 997tt (MY2010). The 2010 997tt motor is an improved 9A1. These motors have a replacement cost from Porsche of ~$10k (not sure of 2010 997tt motor). Porsche has never deemed these motors worthy of campaigning in their factory racing efforts.