20v 5cyl turbo 944 project

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01-21-2009, 11:34 PM

#196

kevincnc

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

one thing i can think of is welding steel stringers inside the frame walls of the engine block, i'm sure this would help.

I just looked at this thread and didn't take the time read far back, but I have to ask: Are you going to weld "steel stringers" to the "frame walls" in an aluminum block or a cast iron one? Or are you talking about a building?

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01-21-2009, 11:36 PM

#197

CPR

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

if you cant even systematically list the exact deficiencies then you can't say if it can or can't be done, you are just parroting what other wannabes (yes i'm a wannabe too) like 99% of those on this board say, it takes someone like norwood to do this.

Please do not lump me in your "wannabes" category...because I am damn sure not like you.

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01-21-2009, 11:37 PM

#198

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Quote:

Originally Posted by kevincnc

He is going to make 1000hp out of a NA

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01-21-2009, 11:38 PM

#199

944J

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Norwood's $500,000 Porsche creation made its appearance in 1995 - the racer DOOM. It was a supercar with ultra-high-tech fabrication utilizing components, of Indy cars and other radical cars put to use in a new way. The 3.6 supercharged engine designed to last 24 minutes did the job beating every competitor. The record remains unbroken. DOOM, named after the biggest selling computer game of all time that helped to finance it, disappeared on July 31, 1995 - stolen from outside Norwood's fabricating shop and not seen since.

this is a little pricey

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01-21-2009, 11:41 PM

#200

944J

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Quote:

Originally Posted by kevincnc

i admit i know nothing about cars compared to you all, but it doesnt take a genius to figure out how to brace something

i did see a 928 where they decked it (filled it with a stringer and cement)

how would you do something like this for the block?

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01-21-2009, 11:45 PM

#201

Bri Bro

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Doom and Doom II were about as far removed from a 944 platform as you can get, did have the 4 banger Porsche engine in it. I love the Turbo sticking out the back. I read the car just about lapped every car in its first race. and thus the ban.

Here is another pricey four banger, 4,000HP
http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/02...gra/index.html

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01-21-2009, 11:45 PM

#202

kevincnc

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

You just take off the head, mix up some Quick-krete, and pour it in. Don't forget a good trowel, and let it cure for 48 hours before you start it.

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01-22-2009, 12:14 AM

#203

Lorax

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

Why don't you do a little research and not post here sounding like a total know-it-all and getting in flame wars with people who know more than you.

That is my job.

There are people out there who have been doing the kinds of things you are talking about for 20+ years. 100's of thousands of dollars invested.

The problems with the 944 motor are pricey to fix, but as they say with "Enough" money, I could even make that 928 in your avatar fast, although it would be a lot of work.

944 has an open deck aluminum block with oiling problems, an inefficient head design, annoying alusil, and I'm sure a few things I am forgetting.

It's not really THAT bad of a motor, with a bit of money it is stout but saying that building up a 944 motor to 800hp would be more cost effective and easier than this audi swap, or ESPECIALLY a v8 swap... that's crazy.

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01-22-2009, 04:15 AM

#204

333pg333

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Quote:

Originally Posted by anders44

a dry sumped solid lifter 3.5liter steel lined 16v engine will be cool, but at an insane price, and unknown reliability. have you got 20-40k to drop on an engine?

WoW have you heard of such a fabled item? Seems like a pipedream to me.

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01-22-2009, 10:45 AM

#205

anders44

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 333pg333

WoW have you heard of such a fabled item? Seems like a pipedream to me.

not really, but in theory doable, probably to thin walls to run boost though.

I guess I'm just annoyed at the 944engine because of its price/bad availability. fly your car over to .de once you are done building so i can test it

just sold my boxster and my evo... so finally got some $$ now, but.. new evo should come shortly, as should a new Dailydriver when I figure out what i want.. voila broke again.

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01-22-2009, 12:24 PM

#206

944J

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 333pg333

WoW have you heard of such a fabled item? Seems like a pipedream to me.

norwood's doom was a 3.6 liter 968 engine that made 1000hp and btw it was supercharged, the next DOOM cars were said to be turbo charged.

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01-22-2009, 02:09 PM

#207

Tms951

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

my unprofessional opionon is that the problem is that we are all "tuning" the 944 engine instead of making structural changes, re-engineering changes that really address the problems and make it a better, stronger, more capable engine.

This is not cost effective or it would be done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

still no one has addressed the reason why a 20v audi engine is better than a 16v 944 engine that has more displacement, they just say it is because the bottom end is strong... nothing specific. everyone is going on trial and error instead of a systematic approach.

to me most of the stuff that has been done to the 944 2.5 & 3.0 L engines is just bolt-on and lightning bandaids, not really making the engine itself any different.

Part 1, you did not read the whole thread, I beat to death why the 5cyl. engine is better than even a 16v porsche engine in this thread.

Part 2, Not true, on this forum yes people tend to do the basic bolt ons that have the best returns. Some people on this forum have gone past this, as have I and we can all tell you the returns quickly diminish and are not really worth it at the end of the day. One exception being if you want to race PCA. Off of this forum people have gone to great lengths, and based on the displaement/boost of thier engines they are still not that impressive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

here is an example of a 4,000HP 4 cylinder ALUMINUM block engine, so you can't say the problem is because the 944 block is aluminum:

http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/02...gra/index.html

Sure some aluminium blocks are better than others, but in the 944 the main problem with the block is that it is aluminium. It is easier more cost effective to make a stout iron block than aluminium.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 944J

yes, i never said modify, i said re-engineer (which is a sort of SMART and SYSTEMATIC modification, but not the typical bolt on modification i'm talking about) its cheaper to wrap the 944 block in solid gold than to cut and hack and peice together any type of engine transplant.

find the problems then the solutions become obvious

Part 1 is just a dumb comment and not true.

Part 2 some problems don't have solutions or don't have solutions that are worth while.

and you posts made my head hurt.

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01-22-2009, 02:13 PM

#208

anders44

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no engineblock is 100% aluminum, its a mix of misc stuf giving different possibilities. the 944 is alusil and requires special bore honing etc. on other other alu composite engines you dont have do this.

the ls and lsX is a good indictor though, for the really high hp boosted numbers.. you use the lsx, "same" block as ls alu series, but cast iron and rigid as .. yeah

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01-22-2009, 05:23 PM

#209

DVC

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It speaks volumes about a car, that people would continue to make almost obscene investments in the motor, or even switch to an alternate source of power like this Audi