After-Market Turbos
03-01-2007, 09:59 PM
#138
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Originally Posted by Tms951
Before I responded I went back and read our 35 page email correspondence based on the chip, in which you told me I would need the piggy back because of the cam I had. When I asked you why you clearly stated I would need it to get a "clean idle", there was no mention of other rpm and loads. Idle and WOT was the times the car ran the best.
It is not that the software does not work "now". It has always worked the same and it always worked. It just did not work as well as I thought a chip that cost 895$ should have. I am not unhappy that you did not give me a discount, I do however think that a retail price of 895$ is very high for what I got. The fact that every one else’s software works still does not effect the fact that mine while able to run the car was sub par.
I did not continue to contact you with my problems because the ones I had asked you questions about I did not get great responses too. I basically got the feeling you only wanted give me support if I bought the piggy back, at which point I would not have needed your support because I could have fixed it all my self with the piggy back, the thing was I did not want to use a piggy back of any type. I come from a sector of the car industry that sells chips for cars that you install and it runs great does not use a piggy and only cost 395$, this is from a company considered an industry leader, these cars also use bosch motronic system.
So basically I got to point where I just walked away from a situation because I was sick of dealing with it.
It is not that the software does not work "now". It has always worked the same and it always worked. It just did not work as well as I thought a chip that cost 895$ should have. I am not unhappy that you did not give me a discount, I do however think that a retail price of 895$ is very high for what I got. The fact that every one else’s software works still does not effect the fact that mine while able to run the car was sub par.
I did not continue to contact you with my problems because the ones I had asked you questions about I did not get great responses too. I basically got the feeling you only wanted give me support if I bought the piggy back, at which point I would not have needed your support because I could have fixed it all my self with the piggy back, the thing was I did not want to use a piggy back of any type. I come from a sector of the car industry that sells chips for cars that you install and it runs great does not use a piggy and only cost 395$, this is from a company considered an industry leader, these cars also use bosch motronic system.
So basically I got to point where I just walked away from a situation because I was sick of dealing with it.
TMS951, Your car had many mods (cam, injectors, AFPR,..), I worked with the information you gave me. I also made it clear that you might need a PB. Your response was that you will deal with the tuning later and that you just want to get the car running. I never mislead you, and you know it!
Again without the PB you could get good idle, (based on your earlier post thread #205626 Page 3 post #43), but it ran lean up top. You used the FPR to richen the top end (I would have used the FQS), then idle and light load was rich. Which brings us back why I recommended the PB in the first place (you could have fixed idle in a second). I did mention potential idle problems before you purchased.
You purchased a "chip" for a heavily modifed car, and you were warned of the potential problems (Idle issues due to CAM etc..). Many factors can cause the car to run lean or rich, I did not build nor did I modify the car. All your mods came from somewhere else, were they all tested to work as a system? You were able to run the car on the track without a problem, is this a bad chip? Your list of modifications is huge, you slap a chip and you run on the track, your idle, due to your hardware, was rough (which you were told it could be the case prior to your purchase).
As far as support, you just went back to a 35 page email. You don't think email is good support?
I did everything I could to assist you, you gave up not me. I cannot fix your car from 1000 miles away, I rely on your feedback. One more reason why I recommend the PiggyBack as I can get data logs and know what the car is doing.
Again, I'm sorry you were not pleased with the results, in hindsight I should have insisted on providing you the PB or not sold you the software at all.
Based on this episode, if a car is heavily modified with non-Vitesse products, Vitesse will no longer offer custom software unless a PiggyBack is provided. I will no longer agree to cut corners just to help out a customer.
Last edited by fast951; 03-01-2007 at 10:41 PM.
03-01-2007, 11:08 PM
#139
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Originally Posted by Duke
There are some mixed up things in this thread. First, why can't just people accept that John doesn't want to share his information about the turbo's? If you don't understand why he keeps the specs to himself you're obviously lacking fundamental business common sense.
Originally Posted by Duke
Try calling up RUF or (even Evolution Motorsports for that matter) and asking about compressor maps for their tuning kits.... See what I'm getting at?
03-02-2007, 12:47 AM
#140
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by theedge
Wait a minute here.... Youre ragging on Vitesse for keeping the results of his R&D quiet.... Then you pull the move you mention in #2?
So far you pretty much just seem to be jumping up and down going "HEY SCREW JOHN FOR NOT TELLING ALL!" followed by "HEY I HAVE UBER SECRET INFO AND SKILLS GUYS! LOOKY LOOKY!". Puhlease
So far you pretty much just seem to be jumping up and down going "HEY SCREW JOHN FOR NOT TELLING ALL!" followed by "HEY I HAVE UBER SECRET INFO AND SKILLS GUYS! LOOKY LOOKY!". Puhlease
2. I have more then a few reasons I keep my parts secret and most of those reasons only get you introuble here on rennlist.
03-02-2007, 01:05 AM
#141
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Originally Posted by Fishey
1. I am not selling parts
2. I have more then a few reasons I keep my parts secret and most of those reasons only get you introuble here on rennlist.
2. I have more then a few reasons I keep my parts secret and most of those reasons only get you introuble here on rennlist.
03-02-2007, 01:41 AM
#143
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This is stupid. If you really want a comparison spend the cash, time and effort to do it and quite sniping. I understand and relate to confidentiality in products. If you want the info then spend the money to get it and stop bitching. Yes confidentiality is selfish but necessary for vendors to stay in busness.
As for technical input I have seen CAD drawings on how a GT turbo fits on a 951 (no I will not share or post them because they are PROPRIOTARY. Meaning the company that did them does not want to have a cometitor profit from them). Unless you have some access to a mill you will have a hell of time because the cartige is about 1 inch shorter than a KKK making it unable to fit over the pedistal mount. And IIRC the bolt pattern for the oil drain is different. Yes a GT can fit but with a lot of modification.
As for technical input I have seen CAD drawings on how a GT turbo fits on a 951 (no I will not share or post them because they are PROPRIOTARY. Meaning the company that did them does not want to have a cometitor profit from them). Unless you have some access to a mill you will have a hell of time because the cartige is about 1 inch shorter than a KKK making it unable to fit over the pedistal mount. And IIRC the bolt pattern for the oil drain is different. Yes a GT can fit but with a lot of modification.
03-02-2007, 06:07 AM
#144
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What the heck is wrong with you guys??????
You don't see this on other forums, do you??
Seriously, if you don't like a vendor's prices, then just go to another vendor, or do the work you'reself. There is NO need to start another thread like this, there are a lot of threads like this in the archives.
There were some very nice threads that started, with lots of good and valueable info, let's not spoil this fourm with another thread like this, unless you see that you're $18 membership is worth starting a thread like this, it is just another can of worms.
You don't see this on other forums, do you??
Seriously, if you don't like a vendor's prices, then just go to another vendor, or do the work you'reself. There is NO need to start another thread like this, there are a lot of threads like this in the archives.
There were some very nice threads that started, with lots of good and valueable info, let's not spoil this fourm with another thread like this, unless you see that you're $18 membership is worth starting a thread like this, it is just another can of worms.
