After-Market Turbos
03-01-2007, 04:27 PM
#106
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Originally Posted by SoloRacer
I am all for vendor honesty. I am also all for customer honesty too. You can't just offer conjecture and supposed experience with other vehicles to call a vendors product junk. John's results are well known and well published. Porschefile and Fishey haven't published any other results for a 951 with GT series turbos or any other turbo for that matter. So for them to declare that a GT series turbo is better is pure speculation too. Then all this fantasy about building things better than factory pro's as if they are pro's themselves is almost laughable - especially since there is no substance to it.
Originally Posted by SoloRacer
Since you are a competing vendor I don't see you as being completely neutral either - after all finding out what John uses on his turbos could help you bypass all the research that may have been involved in testing different products to see what works well.
If guys want to buy a proven product - awesome! More power to you. Just remember, not everyone wants that. There is a large degree of satisfaction that comes with modifying your car yourself as opposed to buying someone's kit. Two different trains of thought here - what you consider to be better depends on who you are.
Originally Posted by SoloRacer
So if you or Porschefile or Fishey want to report on actual findings instead of vendor bashing I say go for it. Let us know real world numbers and performance results and not just "it can't be that good because I've seen better on my Nissan, etc." Not one thing that Porschefile or Fishey has said or done has raised the performance level of the 951. Porschefile doesn't even have a running car for crying out loud. His comments about XYZ turbo performing better based on what he claims to have seen elsewhere doesn't mean anything because they are on a different vehicle. All he can make are generalizations or theorize but until someone actually puts one on a 951 there are no known results. Once there are known results then we can begin to discuss what the differences in each set up are to get a true indication of how well something works compared to another. Everything else is just the usual internet chest thumping/bench racing B.S.
I believe that we are lucky to have outspoken guys like Porschefile and Fishey. The performance car world doesn't revolve around the 951. Having someone with experience from other marques doesn't mean they're experience doesn't count for anything here. That's the type of stupidity that is bred here. I, for one have learned much from the Honda, DSM, Dodge crowd. If the 951 crowd would open their eyes a little wider and accept that the 951 isn't some radical design that's unlike any other turbocharged 4 cyl, we'd all probably have more toys for our cars.
03-01-2007, 04:31 PM
#107
Originally Posted by Pauerman
I, for one have learned much from the Honda, DSM, Dodge crowd. If the 951 crowd would open their eyes a little wider and accept that the 951 isn't some radical design that's unlike any other turbocharged 4 cyl, we'd all probably have more toys for our cars.
So lets talk about the AEM EMS... I have tried numerous times on numerous occasions to ask you about it publicly and privatly. I know its good, lots of my buddies use it on thier imports.... But you are the only one that has it on a 951 to my knowldge.
03-01-2007, 04:33 PM
#108
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Don't you guys love this. The truth always comes out. People with a hidden agenda can't hide it but for so long.
03-01-2007, 04:40 PM
#109
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Originally Posted by hot-J
So lets talk about the AEM EMS... I have tried numerous times on numerous occasions to ask you about it publicly and privatly. I know its good, lots of my buddies use it on thier imports.... But you are the only one that has it on a 951 to my knowldge.
What do you want to know?
Here's little breakdown:
24 tooth custom crank trigger using Hall effect sensor
PNP cam pickup for full sequential operation.
COP using LS1 coil packs
WB oxygen sensor
Electronic boost control
Fully custom wiring harness using Tefzel wires and Raychem DR-25 insulation
You can PM me and I'll let you know if there is anything more.
03-01-2007, 04:53 PM
#110
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Originally Posted by fast951
Don't you guys love this. The truth always comes out. People with a hidden agenda can't hide it but for so long.
Was that directed at me John?
If it was, I will say that my only agenda is to squash misinformation and whole truths.
03-01-2007, 04:56 PM
#111
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Originally Posted by Pauerman
Was that directed at me John?
If it was, I will say that my only agenda is to squash misinformation and whole truths.
If it was, I will say that my only agenda is to squash misinformation and whole truths.
Don't you mean half truths?
03-01-2007, 04:57 PM
#112
Originally Posted by Pauerman
Was that directed at me John?
If it was, I will say that my only agenda is to squash misinformation and whole truths.
If it was, I will say that my only agenda is to squash misinformation and whole truths.
So from this post I take it to mean that you are going to test turbos, post results and provide all the necessary information needed for us to spec out our own turbos and buy them from a vendor - even if that vendor is not you as there may be a vendor elsewhere that charges less money. Is this correct?
03-01-2007, 05:06 PM
#113
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I will say this once again, if one doesn't have actual information then where does one get off calling it "misinformation"? That is simply intellectually dishonest and more than a bit foolish.
03-01-2007, 05:09 PM
#114
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03-01-2007, 05:18 PM
#116
Originally Posted by ehall
http://www.pauertuning.com/turbos.htm
So where are your dyno sheets? How about customer reviews? Has one of these ever been installed and tested on a 951? How can you sell a product for a 951 if you never tested it on one?
P.S. Fishey - the compressor maps section is not working. Also he has absolutely no feedback on how these work on a 951. His site is far less informative than Johns despite the fact he posts some simple information. Any one of us could go to turbonetics site and get the exact same data. What he doesn't give us is exactly what we need - information on how will these perform on our cars. That is what John gives by providing dyno sheets. I especially like the highlighted "polished compressor housing" - really nice.....seeing as how our turbo's are buried out of sight under the intake manifold. *lol*
03-01-2007, 05:30 PM
#117
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Originally Posted by SoloRacer
A better link might be this one:
http://www.pauertuning.com/turbos.htm
So where are you dyno sheets? How about customer reviews? Has one of these ever been installed and tested on a 951? How can you sell a product for a 951 if you never tested it on one?
P.S. Fishey - the compressor maps section is not working. Also he has absolutely no feedback on how these work on a 951. His site is far less informative than Johns despite the fact he posts some simple information. Any one of us could go to turbonetics site and get the exact same data. What he doesnt' give us is exactly what we need - how will these perform on our cars. That is what John gives by providing dyno sheets.
http://www.pauertuning.com/turbos.htm
So where are you dyno sheets? How about customer reviews? Has one of these ever been installed and tested on a 951? How can you sell a product for a 951 if you never tested it on one?
P.S. Fishey - the compressor maps section is not working. Also he has absolutely no feedback on how these work on a 951. His site is far less informative than Johns despite the fact he posts some simple information. Any one of us could go to turbonetics site and get the exact same data. What he doesnt' give us is exactly what we need - how will these perform on our cars. That is what John gives by providing dyno sheets.
03-01-2007, 05:35 PM
#118
Originally Posted by Fishey
Actually, just knowing exactly what the turbo is made of gives me a good idea of its performance and map. Now, its nothing detailed but atleast its some information about the actual turbos.
Are you saying that you couldn't find this information elsewhere? That these details are all hidden from you? That you couldn't go to Turbonetics and get this information? So what exactly is he doing that is special? All he does is list a turbo and give specs. Big deal. If you like I'll give a link for a ton of specs for other turbos if you weren't able to find them for yourself. Not saying that they will be any good for our cars but at least you have the specs.
Ok wise guy, show me the power curve and spool up for his ball bearing turbo on a 951? Without that information what he is selling isn't worth dirt and can be found on any turbo suppliers site. What we need to know is how one responds on a 951. I could also post a list of specs for a set of KKK turbos but that doesn't indicate that it would be a good match for my car. He is the vendor specializing in our cars. Make him do the work of figuring out what works and what doesn't. That is what he is being paid for after all.
Edit: If all you want are turbo specs go here:
http://www.turboneticsinc.com/turbo_overview.htm
They have much more information and the majority of what is sold comes from them anyway. Good luck choosing one that works as you hoped though.
03-01-2007, 05:41 PM
#119
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Originally Posted by SoloRacer
And to sell your products and services to people. There is nothing wrong with that but it is important to for you to acknowledge that you may have something to gain in all this.
So from this post I take it to mean that you are going to test turbos, post results and provide all the necessary information needed for us to spec out our own turbos and buy them from a vendor - even if that vendor is not you as there may be a vendor elsewhere that charges less money. Is this correct?
So from this post I take it to mean that you are going to test turbos, post results and provide all the necessary information needed for us to spec out our own turbos and buy them from a vendor - even if that vendor is not you as there may be a vendor elsewhere that charges less money. Is this correct?
My goal from the outset of my little business venture has been to provide the "best bang for the buck" for people looking for a better deal. Too often, the Porsche badge is related to inflated prices. Should this be the case for a 20 year old car that is no longer produced?!?
There are many enthusiasts that don't have the time or background knowledge needed when looking into modding their cars. I would rather allow enthusiasts the opportuninty to educate themselves on what is available even if that is at the expense of profit. So far, it's been my experience that when I've taken the time to explain available options to guys, they end up feeling more confident in their purchase and are ultimately very satified with the performance results.
03-01-2007, 05:51 PM
#120
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Originally Posted by Fishey
1. I am never going to build a 951 with a 2.5L 8v motor. To me it seems self defeating I rather use my efforts to do something that will yield better results.
2. The major information I have learned about the S2 motor will never be published on this board for a few reasons.
3. Money is the limit to everything because eventually you need money to make it all work. I don't have the money (Poor college student) to do a lot of things I would like to do on my own car let alone a 951 project (and I don't even own a 951)
4. I agree with pole position.
2. The major information I have learned about the S2 motor will never be published on this board for a few reasons.
3. Money is the limit to everything because eventually you need money to make it all work. I don't have the money (Poor college student) to do a lot of things I would like to do on my own car let alone a 951 project (and I don't even own a 951)
4. I agree with pole position.
So far you pretty much just seem to be jumping up and down going "HEY SCREW JOHN FOR NOT TELLING ALL!" followed by "HEY I HAVE UBER SECRET INFO AND SKILLS GUYS! LOOKY LOOKY!". Puhlease
