Pointless/Unobtanium Car
03-25-2022, 01:28 AM
#46
I get plenty of emotion and connection from a car that is well sorted chassis/suspension wise and gives you confidence when pushing it on roads that are less than great and in the real world. That to me is a great drivers car.
That is where the GT4 failed to deliver for me. It is an amazing back road carver and smooth pavement car, it is not a great car for CA broken pavement roads. It got far too unsettled and the chassis moves around way too much for my liking.
To each their own. We can agree to disagree
Last edited by TRZ06; 03-25-2022 at 01:35 AM.
03-25-2022, 01:36 AM
#47
I get plenty of emotion and connection from a car that is well sorted chassis/suspension wise and gives you confidence when pushing it on roads that are less than great and in the real world. That to me is a great drivers car.
That is where the GT4 failed to deliver for me. It is an amazing back road carver and smooth pavement car, it is not a great car for CA broken pavement roads. It got far too unsettled and the chassis moves around way too much for my liking.
To each their own. We can agree to disagree
That is where the GT4 failed to deliver for me. It is an amazing back road carver and smooth pavement car, it is not a great car for CA broken pavement roads. It got far too unsettled and the chassis moves around way too much for my liking.
To each their own. We can agree to disagree
Sounds like a Bentley might be more up your alley
03-25-2022, 01:56 AM
#48
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Here we go again:
- Porsche a builds the car everyone was looking for.
- Porsche says its the most fun car they worked on and they make it sound like everyone who wants one can get one
- Every dealer I talked to pretty much speaks from a previously agreed “script” : “We are getting only 1 car” “We reserve it for our special customers” “We are asking double MSRP”
What a sham. What kind of bull**** is this? Why cant Porsche solve this?
I am going to personally enjoy when car market tanks next time like 2008 and remind the show these guys were putting on last year and a half. Disgusting.
The amount of negative Karma these dealership people are attracting is enormous that I believe it will eventually catch up with them at some point.
- Porsche a builds the car everyone was looking for.
- Porsche says its the most fun car they worked on and they make it sound like everyone who wants one can get one
- Every dealer I talked to pretty much speaks from a previously agreed “script” : “We are getting only 1 car” “We reserve it for our special customers” “We are asking double MSRP”
What a sham. What kind of bull**** is this? Why cant Porsche solve this?
I am going to personally enjoy when car market tanks next time like 2008 and remind the show these guys were putting on last year and a half. Disgusting.
The amount of negative Karma these dealership people are attracting is enormous that I believe it will eventually catch up with them at some point.
So you can buy more toys.
03-25-2022, 02:00 AM
#49
Advanced
In 2015 I found similar difficulties ordering a 981 GT4. Several Philadelphia dealers almost seemed annoyed by my queries. I had pretty much given up the search when I lucked into a Delaware dealer that had allocation available and sold at MSRP. But it took both perseverance and LUCK. Mostly they know it's a sellers' market and they plan to profit from it.
That said, I was on the verge of trading in my '05 C6 manual Z51 convertible when I realized they weren't even going to give me the price of a Miata for it. So I kept the C6, and I am SOOO glad. I am amazed to find myself with these two cars in my garage--it almost compensates for also finding myself to be this old!
The physical data for both cars is surpizingly close but they are very different driving experiences. The C6 is just raucous good fun, a muscle car with a chassis that won't kill you. The GT4 is...oh right, I'm preaching to the choir here.
But I don't know which one I'd keep if I had to choose. They are both great cars and this thread seems a bit like debating how many angels could dance on a pin. The C8 Z06 is one of the few cars that I look at with interest, but it's lack of stick shift and smallness will keep me from coveting my neighbors goods. But seriously, if you can't have a great time with either of these cars you should be frittering away your money on some other pursuit.
That said, I was on the verge of trading in my '05 C6 manual Z51 convertible when I realized they weren't even going to give me the price of a Miata for it. So I kept the C6, and I am SOOO glad. I am amazed to find myself with these two cars in my garage--it almost compensates for also finding myself to be this old!
The physical data for both cars is surpizingly close but they are very different driving experiences. The C6 is just raucous good fun, a muscle car with a chassis that won't kill you. The GT4 is...oh right, I'm preaching to the choir here.
But I don't know which one I'd keep if I had to choose. They are both great cars and this thread seems a bit like debating how many angels could dance on a pin. The C8 Z06 is one of the few cars that I look at with interest, but it's lack of stick shift and smallness will keep me from coveting my neighbors goods. But seriously, if you can't have a great time with either of these cars you should be frittering away your money on some other pursuit.
03-25-2022, 10:22 AM
#50
Rennlist Member
This has absolutely been my experience with Porsche and the GT4 as well. For all the hype that surrounds it, the real world driving experience does not match, especially for the price of entry. I fell for this with BMW and the M3 "Ultimate Driving Machine" as well.
I will be going back to lonely GM that Porsche fans love to raise their noses at, but the driving experience in much better and rewarding in the real world after you strip away the hype and brand name BS.
I have made my GT4 as good as I can and will not be putting anymore money in it, and will just live with it until my number comes up for the C8 Z06. I know it will be awhile, but I think my GT4 and myself have come to an understanding of what it is capable of and what it does not do so well at and I will just try to optimize my driving to the roads that it excels at. I have already alters some of my commute routes to make the GT4 feel more happy and to have a more enjoyable time while driving it.
I will be going back to lonely GM that Porsche fans love to raise their noses at, but the driving experience in much better and rewarding in the real world after you strip away the hype and brand name BS.
I have made my GT4 as good as I can and will not be putting anymore money in it, and will just live with it until my number comes up for the C8 Z06. I know it will be awhile, but I think my GT4 and myself have come to an understanding of what it is capable of and what it does not do so well at and I will just try to optimize my driving to the roads that it excels at. I have already alters some of my commute routes to make the GT4 feel more happy and to have a more enjoyable time while driving it.
Lord have mercy
03-25-2022, 03:45 PM
#52
Rennlist Member
Here we go again:
- Porsche a builds the car everyone was looking for.
- Porsche says its the most fun car they worked on and they make it sound like everyone who wants one can get one
- Every dealer I talked to pretty much speaks from a previously agreed “script” : “We are getting only 1 car” “We reserve it for our special customers” “We are asking double MSRP”
What a sham. What kind of bull**** is this? Why cant Porsche solve this?
I am going to personally enjoy when car market tanks next time like 2008 and remind the show these guys were putting on last year and a half. Disgusting.
The amount of negative Karma these dealership people are attracting is enormous that I believe it will eventually catch up with them at some point.
- Porsche a builds the car everyone was looking for.
- Porsche says its the most fun car they worked on and they make it sound like everyone who wants one can get one
- Every dealer I talked to pretty much speaks from a previously agreed “script” : “We are getting only 1 car” “We reserve it for our special customers” “We are asking double MSRP”
What a sham. What kind of bull**** is this? Why cant Porsche solve this?
I am going to personally enjoy when car market tanks next time like 2008 and remind the show these guys were putting on last year and a half. Disgusting.
The amount of negative Karma these dealership people are attracting is enormous that I believe it will eventually catch up with them at some point.
I have announced/leaked/hinted the GT4RS almost 3 years ago to the day here. Before any press got wind of it.
If anyone actually wanted it since back then, they could have already placed a deposit at their dealer to start the line back then, literally be the first in line. Waiting for the car to be announced and/or tested and/or reviewed are just asking for trouble, as by then everyone will know and will want one.
The following 3 users liked this post by Whoopsy:
03-25-2022, 04:03 PM
#53
I understand the following may be perceived as a tone-deaf elitist POV but hear me out...
When I look at these types of purchases (Porsche, Rolex, Patek, AP, Ferrari, etc) I understand that the demand far outweighs the supply and I choose not to look at the MSRP and instead look at the market price when making a decision to buy or not.
The 992 GT3 is currently a 250-300k car based on the current market price (MRSP+ADM). So I just have to decide if I'm willing to pay that price for that car or if I would rather have something else.
I've gotten lucky with brands like Porsche, Rolex, AP, and I have paid MSRP from a dealer. Other times I have not gotten lucky and had to pay ADM or miss out on a model completely. The bottom line is that life is too short to play the dealer games and if you do play the games, you probably are paying just as much as you would have but in different ways. A couple of depreciated Cayennes/Macans and some crappy lease deals will quickly equal the ADM you would have paid if you would have just bought that car you wanted.
I get that not everyone has the luxury of paying 50-100k over for a car. I understand that puts the car out of the budget for a lot of buyers. But my point is that it's a mistake to look at MSRP (the suggested retail price) as the price of the vehicle when the market says otherwise. It just creates mental stress and unnecessary frustration with the brand.
I know if I want a ceramic Daytona, I'm either paying 45k on the secondary market or I'm handing my AD 30k in BS purchases I don't even want and then still waiting 12 months to get the watch at MSRP.
Again, I get that the website says MSRP 141k for a GT4. I get that some people have 10+ year relationships with their dealers and are getting them at MSRP. But trust me when I say to stop comparing your experiences with those people. They have either spent way more with their dealer than you would ever be willing to spend or they basically got lucky and won the lottery with their allocation.
In the end, the GT4 RS will likely be a very collectible car and over time the value will likely far exceed the ADMs that will be charged to obtain one from a dealer or secondary market seller.
When I look at these types of purchases (Porsche, Rolex, Patek, AP, Ferrari, etc) I understand that the demand far outweighs the supply and I choose not to look at the MSRP and instead look at the market price when making a decision to buy or not.
The 992 GT3 is currently a 250-300k car based on the current market price (MRSP+ADM). So I just have to decide if I'm willing to pay that price for that car or if I would rather have something else.
I've gotten lucky with brands like Porsche, Rolex, AP, and I have paid MSRP from a dealer. Other times I have not gotten lucky and had to pay ADM or miss out on a model completely. The bottom line is that life is too short to play the dealer games and if you do play the games, you probably are paying just as much as you would have but in different ways. A couple of depreciated Cayennes/Macans and some crappy lease deals will quickly equal the ADM you would have paid if you would have just bought that car you wanted.
I get that not everyone has the luxury of paying 50-100k over for a car. I understand that puts the car out of the budget for a lot of buyers. But my point is that it's a mistake to look at MSRP (the suggested retail price) as the price of the vehicle when the market says otherwise. It just creates mental stress and unnecessary frustration with the brand.
I know if I want a ceramic Daytona, I'm either paying 45k on the secondary market or I'm handing my AD 30k in BS purchases I don't even want and then still waiting 12 months to get the watch at MSRP.
Again, I get that the website says MSRP 141k for a GT4. I get that some people have 10+ year relationships with their dealers and are getting them at MSRP. But trust me when I say to stop comparing your experiences with those people. They have either spent way more with their dealer than you would ever be willing to spend or they basically got lucky and won the lottery with their allocation.
In the end, the GT4 RS will likely be a very collectible car and over time the value will likely far exceed the ADMs that will be charged to obtain one from a dealer or secondary market seller.
Last edited by phow; 03-25-2022 at 04:47 PM.
03-25-2022, 04:27 PM
#54
You are free to pass over my posts. I would think and hope you have better things to do with your time than criticize other members posts and thoughts. Last time I checked this was an open forum.
Go to Russia or N. Korean if you value censorship.
03-25-2022, 04:28 PM
#55
03-25-2022, 04:35 PM
#56
Rennlist Member
I understand the following may be perceived as a tone-deaf elitist POV but hear me out...
When I look at these types of purchases (Porsche, Rolex, Patek, AP, Ferrari, etc) I understand that the demand far outweighs the supply and I choose not to look at the MSRP and instead look at the market price when making a decision to buy or not.
The 992 GT3 is currently a 250-300k car based on the current market price (MRSP+ADM). So I just have to decide if I'm willing to pay that price for that car or if I would rather have something else.
I've gotten lucky with brands like Porsche, Rolex, AP, and I have paid MSRP from a dealer. Other times I have not gotten lucky and had to pay ADM or miss out on a model completely. The bottom line is that life is too short to play the dealer games and if you do play the games, you probably are paying just as much as you would have but in different ways. A couple of depreciated Cayennes/Macans and some crappy lease deals will quickly equal the ADM you would have paid if you would have just bought that car you wanted.
I get that not everyone has the luxury of paying 50-100k over for a car. I understand that puts the car out of the budget for a lot of buyers. But my point is that it's a mistake to look at MSRP (the suggested retail price) as the price of the vehicle when the market says otherwise It just creates mental stress and unnecessary frustration with the brand.
I know if I want a ceramic Daytona, I'm either paying 45k on the secondary market or I'm handing my AD 30k in BS purchases I don't even want and then still waiting 12 months to get the watch at MSRP.
Again, I get that the website says MSRP 141k for a GT4. I get that some people have 10+ year relationships with their dealers and are getting them at MSRP. But trust me when I say to stop comparing your experiences with those people. They have either spent way more with their dealer than you would ever be willing to spend or they basically got lucky and won the lottery with their allocation.
In the end, the GT4 RS will likely be a very collectible car and over time the value will likely far exceed the ADMs that will be charged to obtain one from a dealer or secondary market seller.
When I look at these types of purchases (Porsche, Rolex, Patek, AP, Ferrari, etc) I understand that the demand far outweighs the supply and I choose not to look at the MSRP and instead look at the market price when making a decision to buy or not.
The 992 GT3 is currently a 250-300k car based on the current market price (MRSP+ADM). So I just have to decide if I'm willing to pay that price for that car or if I would rather have something else.
I've gotten lucky with brands like Porsche, Rolex, AP, and I have paid MSRP from a dealer. Other times I have not gotten lucky and had to pay ADM or miss out on a model completely. The bottom line is that life is too short to play the dealer games and if you do play the games, you probably are paying just as much as you would have but in different ways. A couple of depreciated Cayennes/Macans and some crappy lease deals will quickly equal the ADM you would have paid if you would have just bought that car you wanted.
I get that not everyone has the luxury of paying 50-100k over for a car. I understand that puts the car out of the budget for a lot of buyers. But my point is that it's a mistake to look at MSRP (the suggested retail price) as the price of the vehicle when the market says otherwise It just creates mental stress and unnecessary frustration with the brand.
I know if I want a ceramic Daytona, I'm either paying 45k on the secondary market or I'm handing my AD 30k in BS purchases I don't even want and then still waiting 12 months to get the watch at MSRP.
Again, I get that the website says MSRP 141k for a GT4. I get that some people have 10+ year relationships with their dealers and are getting them at MSRP. But trust me when I say to stop comparing your experiences with those people. They have either spent way more with their dealer than you would ever be willing to spend or they basically got lucky and won the lottery with their allocation.
In the end, the GT4 RS will likely be a very collectible car and over time the value will likely far exceed the ADMs that will be charged to obtain one from a dealer or secondary market seller.
The following users liked this post:
phow (03-25-2022)
03-25-2022, 04:39 PM
#57
Rennlist Member
I have bought a car I didn't like, know what I did? I sold it. I didn't spend the next 3 years complaining to anyone that will listen about why I didn't like it, and how maybe one day I will buy something else that's going to be the best car ever.
The following users liked this post:
Prime (03-26-2022)
03-25-2022, 04:45 PM
#58
Your welcome to have what ever opinion you like. However you bomb multiple threads a day posting the same opinion constantly (suspension, GM is the best thing ever etc.) which kills any actual interesting discussion about the original thread topic.
I have bought a car I didn't like, know what I did? I sold it. I didn't spend the next 3 years complaining to anyone that will listen about why I didn't like it, and how maybe one day I will buy something else that's going to be the best car ever.
I have bought a car I didn't like, know what I did? I sold it. I didn't spend the next 3 years complaining to anyone that will listen about why I didn't like it, and how maybe one day I will buy something else that's going to be the best car ever.
I post when relevant to the thread discussion. If the info. is repeated , so what. Seriously, that bothers you???
Are you the forum police?
I very highly doubt that me posting stops anyone from posting their thoughts.
Last edited by TRZ06; 03-25-2022 at 04:46 PM.
03-25-2022, 04:48 PM
#59
Rennlist Member
I understand the following may be perceived as a tone-deaf elitist POV but hear me out...
When I look at these types of purchases (Porsche, Rolex, Patek, AP, Ferrari, etc) I understand that the demand far outweighs the supply and I choose not to look at the MSRP and instead look at the market price when making a decision to buy or not.
The 992 GT3 is currently a 250-300k car based on the current market price (MRSP+ADM). So I just have to decide if I'm willing to pay that price for that car or if I would rather have something else.
I've gotten lucky with brands like Porsche, Rolex, AP, and I have paid MSRP from a dealer. Other times I have not gotten lucky and had to pay ADM or miss out on a model completely. The bottom line is that life is too short to play the dealer games and if you do play the games, you probably are paying just as much as you would have but in different ways. A couple of depreciated Cayennes/Macans and some crappy lease deals will quickly equal the ADM you would have paid if you would have just bought that car you wanted.
I get that not everyone has the luxury of paying 50-100k over for a car. I understand that puts the car out of the budget for a lot of buyers. But my point is that it's a mistake to look at MSRP (the suggested retail price) as the price of the vehicle when the market says otherwise It just creates mental stress and unnecessary frustration with the brand.
I know if I want a ceramic Daytona, I'm either paying 45k on the secondary market or I'm handing my AD 30k in BS purchases I don't even want and then still waiting 12 months to get the watch at MSRP.
Again, I get that the website says MSRP 141k for a GT4. I get that some people have 10+ year relationships with their dealers and are getting them at MSRP. But trust me when I say to stop comparing your experiences with those people. They have either spent way more with their dealer than you would ever be willing to spend or they basically got lucky and won the lottery with their allocation.
In the end, the GT4 RS will likely be a very collectible car and over time the value will likely far exceed the ADMs that will be charged to obtain one from a dealer or secondary market seller.
When I look at these types of purchases (Porsche, Rolex, Patek, AP, Ferrari, etc) I understand that the demand far outweighs the supply and I choose not to look at the MSRP and instead look at the market price when making a decision to buy or not.
The 992 GT3 is currently a 250-300k car based on the current market price (MRSP+ADM). So I just have to decide if I'm willing to pay that price for that car or if I would rather have something else.
I've gotten lucky with brands like Porsche, Rolex, AP, and I have paid MSRP from a dealer. Other times I have not gotten lucky and had to pay ADM or miss out on a model completely. The bottom line is that life is too short to play the dealer games and if you do play the games, you probably are paying just as much as you would have but in different ways. A couple of depreciated Cayennes/Macans and some crappy lease deals will quickly equal the ADM you would have paid if you would have just bought that car you wanted.
I get that not everyone has the luxury of paying 50-100k over for a car. I understand that puts the car out of the budget for a lot of buyers. But my point is that it's a mistake to look at MSRP (the suggested retail price) as the price of the vehicle when the market says otherwise It just creates mental stress and unnecessary frustration with the brand.
I know if I want a ceramic Daytona, I'm either paying 45k on the secondary market or I'm handing my AD 30k in BS purchases I don't even want and then still waiting 12 months to get the watch at MSRP.
Again, I get that the website says MSRP 141k for a GT4. I get that some people have 10+ year relationships with their dealers and are getting them at MSRP. But trust me when I say to stop comparing your experiences with those people. They have either spent way more with their dealer than you would ever be willing to spend or they basically got lucky and won the lottery with their allocation.
In the end, the GT4 RS will likely be a very collectible car and over time the value will likely far exceed the ADMs that will be charged to obtain one from a dealer or secondary market seller.
If you want track insurance, most insurers top out at sub $200k so even if you buy it to use as a track tool you are carrying a ton of risk.
I know that if I could get one at MSRP I'd buy one tomorrow.
