12v Nick

Glad to hear you're loving the Musicar system in your F80! We're hopefully revisiting our BMW offerings next year with some upgrades like these. Happy to answer your questions:

1.) Stage Two outperforms Burmester in nearly every way. Just like Bose, the Burmester system is a limited factory design that doesn't optimize the experience for the driver. We get better stereo separation, better overall frequency response and a more dynamic sound. Your decision to pick Bose was a solid one in my opinion. If you only went to Stage Two, you're still getting better performance for the same overall investment as the Burmester system.

2.) The Stage Two improves the bass output over the Bose system by a good margin. Stage Three just refines that sound and gives us more texture and control. The midrange is also vastly more pure and natural. We are working on a dedicated subwoofer option for 991 an 992 coupes at the moment that will be a direct retrofit to the Stage Three system(Stage Three PLUS). I wouldn't expect that to ship until late winter or early spring 2023.

3.) The goal is to have everything ordered before 11/30 to be shipped by the end of the year. If for some reason our speakers for the Stage Three upgrade aren't going to be ready by then, we'll ship the Stage Two out separately and then the Stage Three upgrade shortly after.

4.) I think my answer to the last questions covers this, but yes, it is a linear upgrade path. Stage One can be Stage Two can be Stage Three can be Stage Three Plus. We will walk you through loading a new tune on the DSP, but all that's needed is a laptop and a USB cable.

5.) I have a few acquaintances in AZ I will look into and circle back. If there are enough folks in the group buy from that area I wouldn't be opposed to making a trip for a group install.

Eventually, but the market for that version has been fairly low in the past. We won't put effort into developing that until after we get the Base Stereo versions handled.

Thanks for that — I'll get back to emails tomorrow morning and get you set up!

We still haven't found a local development partner with a Base Stereo 992. Every one of them through our shop has been Bose or Burmester. We do plan to make that happen sooner than later, we just need to connect with an owner.

Absolutely. We ship worldwide.

As stated above, I'll check into this and circle back, but wouldn't be opposed to flying to PHX to install if there was enough demand.

Our decision to move to a Morel driver was tough — we loved the Dynaudio, too! But, their North American importing made some shady decision with how they were handling accounts so we decided we needed to cut ties with them. We'd been working with Morel for more than a decade so it made sense to reach out. They built these tweeters with a specific sensitivity to help us balance out the factory system better. As for the sonic signature, the Morels have a more warm and sweet sound to them vs the neutral and unedited sound of the Dyns. Neither is better than the other, just different flavors. That said, we've had a good handful of folks that have the new versions now that also had the older versions in another car. They unanimously enjoy the Morels just as much if not more.

I do want to be clear with the 992 specifically —The tweeters will not make AS MUCH of a difference in the 992 as they did in the 991 platform. The new Bose system is just worse in more ways. What you hear in the top end of the volume is a combination of the midrange breaking up and the amplifier running out of steam. The BOSE midrange in the 992 are much lower quality than they were in the 991. They also mount to the back of the door panel vs having their own enclosure on the door itself. The result is a lot of break up above 2kHz. With the DSP in the Stage Two, we're able to use different crossover filters and EQ to correct the majority of those shortcomings. This is likely a lot of the distortion you hear. You could replace just the speaker, but the response is still going to peak due to it's location. This is why we upgrade the amp before those speakers.

Listening at higher volumes without distortion requires adequate power and speakers that can handle that power. I don't think you're going to get what you want from just the Stage One. For what you're looking for, the Stage Two should be your best value.

It's not available as part of the group buy, but PM me and I can get you set up with a kit.

I think I answered most of this above, but I'll recap.

1.) No problem shipping to Canada.

2.) As far as who is better than another, there's no objectionable metric to gauge that. Morel and Dyanudio have both been at the pinnacle of car audio for many many years. We could also include Focal, Audison, Scanspeak, Hybrid and Brax into that mix. They are all at the top of the industry and have a lot of great offerings.

3.) DO NOT SKIP THE SOUND DEADENING!!!! I can't stress this enough as it's a critical component in the final sound. Not installing that would cause more vibrations in the door and rob you of the sweet bass improvements. Trust me, you're not going to notice the extra 3lb per door on track day. What you will notice is how sloppy your bass sounds in your favorite music.

4.) Yes, it's a linear upgrade and the Stage Three speakers will be available separately down the road.

See #3 in the above comments

I feel the same way — not sure how they went backwards in quality but here we are.

The added weight is insignificant. It will not make a difference on track days, other than your happiness on the drive to and from!

threatZERO

Following

GT3Laguna

Nick, Thanks for the quick and thorough reply to my questions. You have my email to start the order process.

To the question about sound deadening: Do it. At least the doors. I have a 992 gt3. One of the many reasons I like this car is its weight. This car has less than most of the alternatives. And I’m a track guy. Advanced group. Fast lap times. Especially when you’re pushing cars hard around turns you feel added weight. No hiding it. Soooo, I generally don’t like any idea that involves more weight. BUT, I bet we’re talking way less than 20 pounds to do the doors. Literally insignificant. I was told for my car about 40 pounds, and I did the whole car (back and floor and doors). I love the sound of this engine. I drive all the time with the windows down sport exhaust on when I want to hear that glorious wail, but I also daily drive mine and it was just too loud for me inside going down the freeway at 85 windows up for long drives, and the drone kinda sucked. So for me the ~ 1% weight penalty was easily worth it. And of course now music sounds better coming from the doors (no rattles or crappy resonance) and generally inside the car. My $0.02.

Dr. G

Nick, for a GT3 where ambient cabin noise is an issue, would the perceived delta between stage two and stage three become smaller? Although I’m an audiophile, my primary goal with the upgrade is to maintain clarity at higher volumes to overcome cabin noise.

12v Nick

The Stage Two is probably the best "value" for a GT or Cab since the additional clarity and resolution won't be as easily appreciated with the ambient noise levels. That said, playing at high volumes makes the midrange response more critical, and having a quality version would give you a better experience when you're cranked to 11, even with the compromised environment. The better woofers would just be a bonus at that point, though you would still benefit there, too.

Rxpert

Thanks for your fast response to my questions Nick! Appreciate it. Please put me down for a Stage 2 kit. I’ll fire you an email as well tomorrow to get the ball rolling.

I’ll most likely end up upgrading to the Stage 3 or 3+ down the line, but this is probably a good baseline starting point.

A couple last follow up questions:

What brand of DSP/Amplifier are you using in the kit?

How easy is it to remove the Sound Shield if I want to get rid of it later? Does it stick permanently/make a mess, or can it be peeled off quite easily & cleanly?

Is it possible to request a different brand of sound deadening material?

AlterZgo

I’m leaning heavily towards stage 2. I‘m looking for more bass and to get rid of rattles in the door and I know how much of an impact adding a good, clean amp and DSP can add to even stock speakers and how much better woofers sound with the door properly sealed w/ sound dampening. The price is also fits my budget… cheaper than burmester upgrade while sounding cleaner and louder… exactly what I’m looking for.

Dr. G

Nick, thanks for the info.

OliverK68

Nick, is there ext control of the DSP functions? Not that I want to endlessly tweak, but it would be nice to move the soundstage for when there is a passenger.

Kram

He's mentioned the added weight is extremely minimal, nothing to stress over. I too am looking forward to this as a side project. Those rattles you've mentioned are also the target of this upgrade for me.

Well said. After speaking with Nick a little further about this I have decided to opt for the stage 2 as well. I am greatly looking forward to this upgrade for precisely the reasons you've mentioned. And at this price point like you said, cheaper than burmester and better performance, a win win.

AlterZgo

Question on the sound damping... In your much more elaborate install for the Oslo blue 992, it appears you use more sound damping material in the doors. Is there a significant benefit with going with the additional sound damping beyond the pre-cut Soundshield material you include in these kits? Personally, I value increased bass and less rattles and wouldn't mind adding 10 lbs of sound damping if it would help.

Also, is the install fairly straightforward plug and play? If there are enough people in AZ and you guys can make a trip out here I'd pay for you to install, but otherwise, just curious how easy it would be to DIY install the stage 2 kit in particular. Thanks again.

12v Nick

The DSP Amp is a partnership project with Audiotec-Fischer in Germany. It's a variation of their UP10 platform.

The Sound Damping is there to stay. You CAN remove it but it's a PITA. Honestly, there's no need to do so. The damping won't hinder any future serviceability of the door/window components and having it is not going to affect resale in any negative way.

Curious why you'd want a different sound damping brand — we've found this combo to be more then adequate for this application. You could obviously go your own route and do more extensive damping if you wanted.

You're on the right track then for sure. Stage Two improves the bass output and I couldn't hear a single rattle when I was done tuning — even on bass heavy music.

Yes and no — there's an external controller that can be used to cycle between presets, but it requires custom integration and we don't have a simple setup for that. The passenger still has a great sonic experience in the car, it's just not optimized for them to get the same imaging or soundstage.

What we include in the kit is what we feel is the "sweet spot" for these cars. You can definitely do more, but the improvements become more insignificant and the added weight goes up at the same rate. For that Signature project we didn't really care about weight as much as we cared about extracting the most performance we could from a $3k pair of woofers.

The install is fairly simple DIY. If you're able-bodies with basic tools and some mechanical ability, it will be a breeze. I will do my best to have a true install guide up in the next couple of weeks for reference. I'm also more than happy to offer local install for 3 or more vehicles(travel and labor costs apply).

12v Nick

I've updated the queue in my original post with a list of who is in so far. I have deposits from most of you, but if not, please send me your email so I can get you taken care of.

I also have a lot of emails and PMs coming in so it's taking a lot of time but I should be able to respond to everyone within 24 hours.

Thanks!

Nick

Dr. G

Nick,

I'm going to ask a few questions about the upcoming subwoofer here for the benefit of anyone else interested:

1. In the GT3 with LWBs, will the passenger seat need to come out to install it?

2. Will the sub have its own volume control? I know sometimes bass can get boomy rather than fast, accurate and seamless. I'm going to assume you're not going for loose bass, but still thought I'd ask.

Go Bruins

I'm in for Stage 2.

Thanks, Nick!