ASK THE COACH
#1291
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
Basic Site Sponsor
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Durham, NC and Virginia International Raceway
Posts: 19,116
Received 3,299 Likes
on
1,874 Posts
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
On the Test Day drivers meeting, the Track Operations manager TOLD the assembled group that they had had issues with that section and EXPLAINED the prevalent geometry of the accidents seen in previous events. So much so, he pointed out that they were on the process of extending the soft barriers further towards the bridge.
Anyone looking from the support paddock could see the crest that coincides with the direction change back to the left.
There's a lot of information out there to raise concentration to avoid this sort of thing. Most folks could stand to be open to more of it...
__________________
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
#1293
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
Basic Site Sponsor
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Durham, NC and Virginia International Raceway
Posts: 19,116
Received 3,299 Likes
on
1,874 Posts
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
We would have had a good time trading notes at dinner!
#1294
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Yessir. Indeed.
I assume you will be at the Glen in 2 weeks?
EDIT: by the way, I enjoyed chasing down your main man Chris M in the enduro yesterday, until I got pushed way off track exiting 1 by a lapped car. Oh well, no contact so that's good!
I assume you will be at the Glen in 2 weeks?
EDIT: by the way, I enjoyed chasing down your main man Chris M in the enduro yesterday, until I got pushed way off track exiting 1 by a lapped car. Oh well, no contact so that's good!
![Big Grin](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
Last edited by Veloce Raptor; 05-13-2013 at 12:18 PM.
#1295
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I'm not trying to gloat, but I was very pleased with my driving T3-T4. The rest, however, needs a lot of work. COTA exercises skills not really used at other tracks like TWS and MSRH. Definitely found some holes in my driving resume.
One other note, is I was impressed with the Airfence wall. I was standing on the T3 bridge when the yellow 911 lost it under the bridge. The car rotated left and went into the wall at very high speed hitting the right rear. He hit it hard enough to blow the foam almost to the paddock access road. There was a collective gasp and silence for the second or so it took between the car's obvious destination and the impact. That car was back on the track racing the next day. No doubt had that been Armco or concrete the car would have been totaled and the driver maybe hurt.
-Mike
Last edited by TXE36; 05-13-2013 at 12:57 PM. Reason: Fix David Murry's name
#1296
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Airfence is amazing...as it should be at a replacement cost (billed to each driver who hit it) of $1,000 per linear foot. And you saw them out there with tape measures every time it was hit. ![Frown](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif)
The challenge folks had in 3, in addition to point to point, was not adjusting their timing when they bent the car into 3 as they started going faster through 1 and into and out of 2. As speeds increase, that bend-iin needs to begin sooner & sooner.
![Frown](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif)
The challenge folks had in 3, in addition to point to point, was not adjusting their timing when they bent the car into 3 as they started going faster through 1 and into and out of 2. As speeds increase, that bend-iin needs to begin sooner & sooner.
#1297
Race Car
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
The downside on an autocross course is the driver hits a cone or spins. A road course has a different return on mistakes that often ends with a bent car or worse. The slip angle and traction limits of a stock car versus race/track car are very different by intention. Leaving a window of slide/slip and tires screaming at the driver is a good thing for a novice. Driver's progress at different rates/ tiers so a conservative approach is more expensive, but definitely safer.
Scott
#1298
Burning Brakes
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Would love constructive criticism on how to SAFELY improve at Lime Rock from the resident coaches. My PCA instructors tell me what I already know; I brake too soon and too hard and that I have been taught the "DE line" for years. I am transitioning to the race line but that is a work in progress.
I will be the first to admit I am being overly cautious as I can't "win" DE and I am not trailering, so I need to be able to drive home at the end of the day. I was given an opportunity to hire Simon Kirkby to coach me this coming weekend so hopefully that helps as well. Thanks for any insights/feedback provided!
I will be the first to admit I am being overly cautious as I can't "win" DE and I am not trailering, so I need to be able to drive home at the end of the day. I was given an opportunity to hire Simon Kirkby to coach me this coming weekend so hopefully that helps as well. Thanks for any insights/feedback provided!
#1299
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
Basic Site Sponsor
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Scott, you may be the exception and are crediting others for skills that they have not yet developed. A softer sprung car with street tires has a very large operating window of adhesion, is very tolerant of imprecise inputs, and literally shouts at you when it is at the limit of grip. As you stiffen the suspension and upgrade the tires, that window gets smaller, the speeds get higher, things happen faster and now the car just talks to you. 1500 lbs springs and race rubber make that window a slit, the steering wheel inputs have to be made quickly in response to the constantly changing levels of grip, events happen immediately and now the car just whispers to you. If you haven't developed the skill to listen carefully, you'll never hear it (or see it coming). That's why you need to start slowly and softly, to develop your ability to "listen" to what the car tells you. A handful have it right away, most do not, and quite a few never get it, ever.
__________________
Larry Herman
2016 Ford Transit Connect Titanium LWB
2018 Tesla Model 3 - Electricity can be fun!
Retired Club Racer & National PCA Instructor
Past Flames:
1994 RS America Club Racer
2004 GT3 Track Car
1984 911 Carrera Club Racer
1974 914/4 2.0 Track Car
CLICK HERE to see some of my ancient racing videos.
Larry Herman
2016 Ford Transit Connect Titanium LWB
2018 Tesla Model 3 - Electricity can be fun!
Retired Club Racer & National PCA Instructor
Past Flames:
1994 RS America Club Racer
2004 GT3 Track Car
1984 911 Carrera Club Racer
1974 914/4 2.0 Track Car
CLICK HERE to see some of my ancient racing videos.
#1300
Rennlist Hoonigan
which cost no drachmas
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Rennlist
Site Sponsor
which cost no drachmas
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Rennlist
Site Sponsor
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Would love constructive criticism on how to SAFELY improve at Lime Rock from the resident coaches. My PCA instructors tell me what I already know; I brake too soon and too hard and that I have been taught the "DE line" for years. I am transitioning to the race line but that is a work in progress.
I will be the first to admit I am being overly cautious as I can't "win" DE and I am not trailering, so I need to be able to drive home at the end of the day. I was given an opportunity to hire Simon Kirkby to coach me this coming weekend so hopefully that helps as well. Thanks for any insights/feedback provided!
I will be the first to admit I am being overly cautious as I can't "win" DE and I am not trailering, so I need to be able to drive home at the end of the day. I was given an opportunity to hire Simon Kirkby to coach me this coming weekend so hopefully that helps as well. Thanks for any insights/feedback provided!
I think it was Ross Bentley who pointed out lots of pages ago that you have to step outside the comfort zone and push yourself sometimes. That means get the car to slide. You don't want to go in 150%, but go 101% - then you have a small slide or line change that is managable and a "teaching moment."
#1301
Rennlist Member
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Scott, you may be the exception and are crediting others for skills that they have not yet developed. A softer sprung car with street tires has a very large operating window of adhesion, is very tolerant of imprecise inputs, and literally shouts at you when it is at the limit of grip. As you stiffen the suspension and upgrade the tires, that window gets smaller, the speeds get higher, things happen faster and now the car just talks to you. 1500 lbs springs and race rubber make that window a slit, the steering wheel inputs have to be made quickly in response to the constantly changing levels of grip, events happen immediately and now the car just whispers to you. If you haven't developed the skill to listen carefully, you'll never hear it (or see it coming). That's why you need to start slowly and softly, to develop your ability to "listen" to what the car tells you. A handful have it right away, most do not, and quite a few never get it, ever.
#1302
Race Car
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Scott, you may be the exception and are crediting others for skills that they have not yet developed. A softer sprung car with street tires has a very large operating window of adhesion, is very tolerant of imprecise inputs, and literally shouts at you when it is at the limit of grip. As you stiffen the suspension and upgrade the tires, that window gets smaller, the speeds get higher, things happen faster and now the car just talks to you. 1500 lbs springs and race rubber make that window a slit, the steering wheel inputs have to be made quickly in response to the constantly changing levels of grip, events happen immediately and now the car just whispers to you. If you haven't developed the skill to listen carefully, you'll never hear it (or see it coming). That's why you need to start slowly and softly, to develop your ability to "listen" to what the car tells you. A handful have it right away, most do not, and quite a few never get it, ever.
For example, let's use an old air-cooled 911SC or Carrera. Going with street tires and a 21mm/30mm torsion bar setup with anti-roll bars and good shocks is not going to make it a diabolical monster on the big track. Set the anti-roll bars soft and you have reasonable platform that won't be a wallowing pig.
Scott
#1303
Rennlist
Basic Site Sponsor
Basic Site Sponsor
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Like I said, street tires make sense. I am not suggesting someone get a stiffly sprung Cup Car on day one. I am talking about a reasonably well setup street car. Not a well setup race car. We are talking DE events here.
For example, let's use an old air-cooled 911SC or Carrera. Going with street tires and a 21mm/30mm torsion bar setup with anti-roll bars and good shocks is not going to make it a diabolical monster on the big track. Set the anti-roll bars soft and you have reasonable platform that won't be a wallowing pig.
Scott
For example, let's use an old air-cooled 911SC or Carrera. Going with street tires and a 21mm/30mm torsion bar setup with anti-roll bars and good shocks is not going to make it a diabolical monster on the big track. Set the anti-roll bars soft and you have reasonable platform that won't be a wallowing pig.
Scott
#1304
Race Car
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
With the stock 997, I could not believe how long you had to wait for something to happen when you made an input. Both on normal inputs and corrective inputs. This was before I ever drove a purpose built race car too.
Scott
#1305
![Default](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Airfence is amazing...as it should be at a replacement cost (billed to each driver who hit it) of $1,000 per linear foot. And you saw them out there with tape measures every time it was hit. ![Frown](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif)
The challenge folks had in 3, in addition to point to point, was not adjusting their timing when they bent the car into 3 as they started going faster through 1 and into and out of 2. As speeds increase, that bend-iin needs to begin sooner & sooner.
![Frown](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif)
The challenge folks had in 3, in addition to point to point, was not adjusting their timing when they bent the car into 3 as they started going faster through 1 and into and out of 2. As speeds increase, that bend-iin needs to begin sooner & sooner.
That car was racing the following day.
-Mike
Last edited by TXE36; 11-12-2013 at 06:42 PM.