Asquared

FWIW, I'm still a noob here, but I find RL to be incredibly informative and the people here incredibly helpful. You do have to have a sense of humor and some humility, but I've become an addict here because the people are so knowledgable and willing to share their knowledge at length for nothing.

I'm guessing the people that you've talked to all drive flat out, but they think riding with an instructor will ruin their reflexes.

utkinpol

i have a tendency to believe that so called 'flat out people' to biggest degree is an imaginary product of such conferences to most point. 2 folks from those 4 are in black running group, one is green, one is yellow, for what it matters but i do not think it does.

people here are extremely knowledgeable, no single doubt about it. based on that really high representation level within PCA may be I expected a bit better communication skills, or less hostility, frankly, for me it all does not matter that much as i spent almost half of my life in forums or chats of some sort so i am pretty much used to anything (and as all you do know now i DO like to talk a lot - and i do believe that any communication, even if people mistreat you to some degree, still helps usually ) - but some regular folks are not.

People here probably forgot a simple rule that to be able to ask a proper question one has to know at least 60% of an answer. and not knowing the answer is not the reason to shut up and not ask questions until an enlightenment will come as to some it simply never comes and they have to learn all their way though, hard way. still, it is going someplace else again here and i do not want to go there. i already said what I wanted to say before.

TedA

fast_freddy

Somebody has a case of the butthurt.

Based upon your comments in this post, if I were an instructor I would refuse to drive with you as it sounds like you are barely in control and need a track with rubber walls. Additionally, you dont even have the slightest grasp of 95% of the constructive comments herein. If I were the Grand Poo Bah of a DE event, you wouldnt be driving in it thats for sure, you are dangerous.

Gary R.

I stand by my original post to you. Your question was not silly nor did I think badly of you for asking. I could clearly see in your post that your problem wasn't what RPM would work in a corner and tried to say, in a very factual though not condescending way, you need to worry about perfecting a lot of other techniques before seeing what the limit of the car is. YOU attacked me for taking the time to try and explain that to you. You have attacked a lot of very good people here that have seemingly wasted their time and effort trying to help you, many I have met and respect. You are either too stupid, stubborn, or egotistical to let any of this sink in and I for one will pay you the ultimate compliment of ignoring anything you post for a bit. "to ask a proper question one has to know at least 60% of an answer"? If that's the case you should have posted nothing to begin with..

utkinpol

nope, not really. not dangerous and not barely in control, if it was so i would be pulled off track. you just feel entitled to respond some form of crap back to me but it hardly matters.

plus you were not an instructor in my car and that matters most, does it not?
you are just like some other people here rush to make accusations based on your perception alone which is not based on any actual facts, and in real life it has a tendency to fail people quite often.

kinda same point i tried to make when i said why some people do not come here. makes sense?

utkinpol

you see - that is exactly what I am talking about. that is your immediate reaction. i do not get it. simply don`t get it. why not to ask about somethng you do not know? is it a mortal sin?
all i was told in whole thread was to have thick skin - still i am accused on 'insulting people'? whom did i insult and where?

i did not attack you or 'any very good people'. i provoked you in the beginning, that is totally correct. and i am sorry for that as it was done too harsh but it sort of was where i was going.
this rpm question was something i spoke to instructor on my first day and i got perfect calm explanation of what and how happens on a track, why it does not matter, how it should be assessed and what we should work on instead of looking at tachometer.

it was pretty much same info you tried to communicate, but gosh, in completely different way. so i am sorry you felt i offended you, and made you mad over this, but, well, it was not the point.

instead of finding out reasons you started accusing me - 'concentrated on speed', not working, and i just said back - man, you do not know that, right? you were not with me in my car for those 2 days, right? makes sense so far?

Larry Herman

You are right about RL being a rather tight community, but that is because most of the people here are knowledgeable, respect each other and have the patience to listen to one another.

I seem mainly 3 types of new people coming into RL:

1) Noobs who do not know much, but will lurk and listen until they need something, and then ask in a way that everyone wants to help. They tend to stay here and grow.

2) Noobs who think they know a lot, and need to be taken down a notch so that they can start learning. Some of them hang around, and some leave.

3) "Experts" who just want to sound their own horn and show everyone how much they know and great they are. People here take perverse pleasure in chewing them up and spitting them out.

For example one guy came here posting "here's what a 1:xx:xx lap looks like in my Turbo something at XYZ track". What a bunch of egotistical nonsense, and he was slow too; at least 5 seconds off of the pace for that car.

Most here will post a lap saying "here's my lap at XYZ, what do you think?" or "Can you suggest any improvements?".

Who do you think will get better treatment?

J richard

...and I would add to that that there are many who realize they know what it is they do, or don't know, what it is that others need to know and it's just impossible to know everything there is to know about it all, and as you have to know what it is that you want to know before you go about wanting to know it then you really already know everything it is you know you need to know Bedford you need to ask to know it and because you know what you need to know better than those that don't know what it is you need to know they don't know anything at all and you know it all anyway, so it really doesn't matter anyway... The more you know....

Bob Rouleau

utkinpol

If the folks who have been driven from RL come in with the same attitude you did, I'm not surprised. Perhaps they have gone back to www.myhuge_ego.net where they are happiest?

You arrived asking question which the many Instructors on this forum immediately recognized as a red flag. They offered sound advice - the same advice any of us would have given had we been sitting in the car with you. And, yes, we've seen it before time and time again.

You are a Green driver, needing instruction. You have established that on a short track you are still not confident about lines and admitted that you can't manage traffic.

When the answers you got did not please you, you resort to calling people A-holes.

Maybe your instructor was too busy trying to keep you safe to manage the traffic for you? That happens sometimes, especially with people determined to go fast without the slightest idea of how to do it properly.

In sum, the responses you got in this thread are a direct result of your incorrect attitude.

Lastly, if you make another post insulting the people in this thread, I will arrange for you to spend a few days cooling off on a "vacation" from Rennlist.

Regards,

utkinpol

i may be totally naive but when i come on site to meet with company execs who have no clue of what they need to get build and all they know is time an a budget they have i do not give them different treatment based on what level of knowledge they have of our product or anything else.

like i said - it is all about communication. i am just observing all this, do not get me wrong. it is not a job for me, i just like my car and find some pleasure in learning how to drive it right. i just say what i see. i was curious why i had disbalance in a turn, did not know how to ask about it and started with silliest way possible to see where it will go. as you could see - it was all the spectrum of answers include perfect ones and etc, etc.

i am really surprised to find people find themselves offended by what i wrote here, well, other than Gary to whom i do sincerely apologize, but, again, what`s done is done.

Brian A.

Paul,

I think that's a great way to end this thread.

I suggest you now lock it and step away from the keyboard. That way we can all get back to work.

Regards

TedA

Larry

Spot on. People in 1 and 2 have never been treated poorly on this forum. 3 will get you 20+ pages.

Larry Herman

So in your analogy, what would you do with the exec who has an impossibly small budget, an unreasonable time frame, and is unwilling to listen to reason, no matter how nicely you try to explain it?

utkinpol

yep, i know... It was definitely stupid to stir the pot to such very high degree level but still quite educational.

perhaps i expected people to be less suggestive and more open minded, but, still, it was truly great deal to see all those responses.

sorry for all the trouble.