View Poll Results: Would you build a 996 Spec if this became a PCA Class?
Absolutely! I'm in!
39
25.16%
Interested, but not right now
69
44.52%
No
47
30.32%
Voters: 155. You may not vote on this poll
Would you build a 996 Spec?
07-14-2008, 02:46 PM
#61
Rennlist Member
And def allow the 3.6 cars.
07-14-2008, 02:57 PM
#62
Rennlist Member
I for one am all for the biggest tires, especially up front. But for a spec class I would vote for a square setup front to back to allow for maximum tire swap and longevity.
I have been trying out a 275 R6 in the front and have been flat out amazed at the improvement. Just happened to have the 275s and the wheel to fit them on up front and thought I would try it... Amazing level of turn in and grip. And no the stock rear 18x10 ET65 won't fit unless you add a 20mm spacer. Unless someone knows different.
I have been trying out a 275 R6 in the front and have been flat out amazed at the improvement. Just happened to have the 275s and the wheel to fit them on up front and thought I would try it... Amazing level of turn in and grip. And no the stock rear 18x10 ET65 won't fit unless you add a 20mm spacer. Unless someone knows different.
07-14-2008, 04:03 PM
#63
Ironman 140.6
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
07-14-2008, 07:44 PM
#64
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
07-14-2008, 08:50 PM
#65
Ironman 140.6
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
07-14-2008, 08:59 PM
#66
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: The right side of Leftville
Posts: 1,445
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
So I must admitt that I am somewhat confused. 
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
07-14-2008, 09:11 PM
#67
Rennlist Member
So I must admitt that I am somewhat confused.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
To that end, why a wing? Why big tires? Why crazy shocks?
It seems to me that you want to strip as much weight out as possible, put in safety gear, lockdown the engine and transmissions from tampering/adjustment, find a strut setup that allows for required track-tire camber, and pick a reasonably firm spring rate that will allow good drivers to have fun (if I'm remembering correctly, I think the spec Boxster rates sounded too soft). That's it.
07-14-2008, 09:30 PM
#68
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
So I must admitt that I am somewhat confused.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
There have been lots of useful and interesting input and perspectives.
Maybe we need to go back to your opening post & look at what the objectives of the spec are. At the risk of putting words in your mouth, I'd propose that this is what you're after:
- Rear engine platform
- Relatively low entry price ~$45k
- Reasonable operating costs -- (mostly tires)
- Success differentiated by driving skill rather than depth of wallet
- Reliable
- Safe
- Greater performance than Boxster Spec
It's easy to get sucked into the "if we do this, it will be faster" frame of mind. If everyone were to be directed by a common set of objectives, it might help. We shouldn't be after creating the fastest 996 possible. Rather the one that meets the above goals best.
07-14-2008, 10:04 PM
#69
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: The right side of Leftville
Posts: 1,445
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Agreed, folks have to look at the spec class not as a way to make the cars faster or look cooler, but be safe, reliable, and as cheap as the sport reasonably allows.
To that end, why a wing? Why big tires? Why crazy shocks?
It seems to me that you want to strip as much weight out as possible, put in safety gear, lockdown the engine and transmissions from tampering/adjustment, find a strut setup that allows for required track-tire camber, and pick a reasonably firm spring rate that will allow good drivers to have fun (if I'm remembering correctly, I think the spec Boxster rates sounded too soft). That's it.
To that end, why a wing? Why big tires? Why crazy shocks?
It seems to me that you want to strip as much weight out as possible, put in safety gear, lockdown the engine and transmissions from tampering/adjustment, find a strut setup that allows for required track-tire camber, and pick a reasonably firm spring rate that will allow good drivers to have fun (if I'm remembering correctly, I think the spec Boxster rates sounded too soft). That's it.
Jupe, my intent of the thread was, if you could build a car with these specs for this price would you be interested?
Now, trying not to interfere with the Boxster Spec class, while at the same time providing a next logical step in performance is a good thing. Simply changing to Double Adjustable shocks would differntiate the two classes from a tuning perspective. This is one step on the growth curve to learning how to race: car set up. Everything else should stay the way the Boxster Spec guys laid it out.
And yes, allowing a higher spring rate(s) is also a part of tuning and performance, but goes back to the shocks. Lock down everything else, and viola! you have a Spec class. Simple and easy. Hell, the Boxster Spec guys have already picked a tire supplier, so that's a done deal.
07-14-2008, 10:08 PM
#70
Rennlist Member
gotta have a HUGE wing, Bill...you know that 
07-14-2008, 10:19 PM
#72
Rennlist Member
It is a hoot and I have no interest in moving on. At some point, if a 996-based class became popular, I could see trying it if I couldn't get into another spec 911 class (a la GT3 Cups). What would attract me is free availability of parts, "cheap" engines, lower tire running costs, etc.
07-14-2008, 10:26 PM
#73
Burning Brakes
So I must admitt that I am somewhat confused.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
Here's what I am hearing:
1) keep costs down
2) Add all sorts of mods to make the car faster, but see #1
3) Don't allow expensive shocks, but let's put a $2,000 wing on it.
4) Safety is important, but why do we need GT3 control arms?
5) Keep costs down for tires, but lets run the biggest most expensive tires we can find
6) Balance for these cars is critical, but Porsche screwed up when they went with 245's up front and 285's out back on the Cups
See my confusion. This is why rule making is so difficult.
The question should be, if you started with a stock car (not necessarily the car you currently own) what would be the best, safest and most cost efficient modifications you could make to it to turn it into a Spec Race car?
I'll direct everyone to the Koni rules for some insight.
Bill
One easy way to control suspension is to limit ride height. It costs nothing but eliminates people going crazy. I would say yes to the GT3 arms, atleast in the front, Cup wing is more bling...., pick a standard size tire and manf., use stock wheels or if people want aftermarket they have to be same size and WEIGHT as stock. Keep LSD's factoy, they have put a lot of R&D into them and it will also control different ramps etc.
Chris
07-14-2008, 10:27 PM
#74
Rennlist Member
07-14-2008, 11:14 PM
#75
Nordschleife Master
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Vacuuming Cal Speedway
Posts: 7,306
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes
on
5 Posts
Shock adjustability is overrated IMHO.... I would suggest choosing your spring rates first and then ask Bilstein to valve their fixed HD shock to match. This should save significant costs, assure a steady supply of shocks, and keep the playing field level. I wish they had done that with the Spec Boxster instead of the PSS9's which really need new valving and revised spring rates....