View Poll Results: Would you build a 996 Spec if this became a PCA Class?
Absolutely! I'm in!
39
25.16%
Interested, but not right now
69
44.52%
No
47
30.32%
Voters: 155. You may not vote on this poll
Would you build a 996 Spec?
#47
What John said about weight is really important. The Spec Boxsters run in the same run group with the 2 Spec 996's and we're all very close in times. Currently they're running Hossiers but if they switched to the R888's we're running we would beat them at their current weight. We're 2700 min w/driver, they're about 3200 w/driver and that's their achilles heel. John can fill you in more on the specs their testing and give some idea of the costs he's spent to date....
With the new cage, and some interior removed, but not enough to make it a V class car, I am interested to see what it weighs now and what my times are going to be at Laguna.
As far as money, I would need a bit to calculate that, the rowM030 springs and HD shocks saved me some money on the suspension. I have control arms and sway bars from a gt3, 245 and 285 tires, and the necessary safety stuff. The LSD should be considered. When I bought my car, it supposedly had one, but it was trashed. When I got it rebuilt with my transmission, I realized how necessary it is to have.
#48
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So John, you are not running Double Adjustable shocks? How about upper shock mounts, etc? My understanding is that you were running at 3200lbs, is that correct? Is 2850 #'s doable?
What wheels are you running?
What wheels are you running?
#50
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Actually, I run 235's on all 4 (RA1's). The Hankook Z214's I currently have are marked 245 but are the exact same width as the 235 RA1's that I used to use.
My car is ~2,950 with 1/2 tank of fuel but NO driver. Motor is stock except for cone filter + chip (10hp estimated) and header/no cats (5hp estimated). So, since 1997 M3 motors were rated 240 crank HP, I estimate that I am making ~255 crank hp. Stock torque was 240 lb/ft. I did lose some torque with the header, and it is noticeable. Not sure what the # is, though.
EDIT: oh yeah, and my car has zero aero...
My car is ~2,950 with 1/2 tank of fuel but NO driver. Motor is stock except for cone filter + chip (10hp estimated) and header/no cats (5hp estimated). So, since 1997 M3 motors were rated 240 crank HP, I estimate that I am making ~255 crank hp. Stock torque was 240 lb/ft. I did lose some torque with the header, and it is noticeable. Not sure what the # is, though.
EDIT: oh yeah, and my car has zero aero...
#51
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#52
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#53
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my last corner weight showed 3050# with 180 driver and 3/4 tank of gas... 2870 w/o driver. this is with a half cage, AC, bumper bars, sunroof, front half carpets, door panels and stereo w/ speakers.
#56
Three Wheelin'
We are talking about dropping the min. weight on Spec Box for next year 50-75 lbs. Lots of us are running that much ballast to make 2700 w/driver plus running fuel ballast & cool suits. You can get a Boxster below 2400 w/FG roof so I think you'll get a 996 down to 2700
Toyo has a good relationship w/POC & you guys already know you need to align yourselves w/them for this thing to fly. Just go with what they spec, tire wise & my bet is it will be Toyo. They make a 245/40/18 front & 285/30/18 for the rear which works well gearing wise. That's basically the same widths as what the cups run although we do run a taller rear. The cup sizes John posted earlier translate to 240 front, 280 rear.
#58
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Seriously.. just follow the NASA format for weight/HP for your classing system. Show up with a dyno readout and weight and that determines your class.
This keeps it simple and doesn't become all about I gotta have x or y to win.
Use a hybrid of this for the spec class to allow fertile comp amongst the 3.4/3.6 996s even some 997s should they want to play.
Basically set some baselines of what is allowable susp wise and then let the #'s determine where you play. A fast/light 996 can go beat up on the big boys and a heavier still more streetable 996 would have to dance with the boxsters. You will end up with a lot more people this way.
Also the formula that you have spelled out does not necessarily make for a fast 996. I see a rash of uneccessary and expensive parts that don't address the car's current limitations for speed and or add reliability.
my 2cts
imho the DA shocks are overkill as are all the control arm bits, you can gain serious speed w/o them and achieve the same level of susp tuning. I am currently at negative 2.7 up front and similar in the back w/o any of the items mentioned. You want to be below 3 and above 2.
the wheel/tire combo is vital for these cars to go fast. The car responds extremely well to a wide wheel/tire up front.
Cooling: the car needs much more capacity to be able to turn hot lap after hot lap. needs a 3rd radiator.
This keeps it simple and doesn't become all about I gotta have x or y to win.
Use a hybrid of this for the spec class to allow fertile comp amongst the 3.4/3.6 996s even some 997s should they want to play.
Basically set some baselines of what is allowable susp wise and then let the #'s determine where you play. A fast/light 996 can go beat up on the big boys and a heavier still more streetable 996 would have to dance with the boxsters. You will end up with a lot more people this way.
Also the formula that you have spelled out does not necessarily make for a fast 996. I see a rash of uneccessary and expensive parts that don't address the car's current limitations for speed and or add reliability.
my 2cts
imho the DA shocks are overkill as are all the control arm bits, you can gain serious speed w/o them and achieve the same level of susp tuning. I am currently at negative 2.7 up front and similar in the back w/o any of the items mentioned. You want to be below 3 and above 2.
the wheel/tire combo is vital for these cars to go fast. The car responds extremely well to a wide wheel/tire up front.
Cooling: the car needs much more capacity to be able to turn hot lap after hot lap. needs a 3rd radiator.
#59
Not sure the math on it, but my car was never 2910, and I am yet to see a 996 that was stock. Heavy items in my car would be myself at 180, rollbar, cool shirt, center radiator... that was the last time it was weighed.
When I weigh it next, it will be missing windows and door panels that needed to be removedfor the door bars, and some other parts, so that may give us a decent baseline.
As far as more cars in it, doesn't that take away from being spec? It would just be a MI car at that point, which my car was built to spec for. We only have 2 in POC, but it falls into the R6 race class which is big and competitive.
When I weigh it next, it will be missing windows and door panels that needed to be removedfor the door bars, and some other parts, so that may give us a decent baseline.
As far as more cars in it, doesn't that take away from being spec? It would just be a MI car at that point, which my car was built to spec for. We only have 2 in POC, but it falls into the R6 race class which is big and competitive.
#60
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I think a spec 996 class is a great idea. Weight with driver should be around 2950. It's pretty hard to get one of these under 2800 with cage. I'd include the 3.6 and make it run at 3000 with a warning that weight will be adjusted as needed. One idea for suspension might be to allow the Sachs dampers and factory spring rates that came on 996 cups (pick a year range). Every race shop in the country has a couple sets laying in the corner now that PCA (and every other series) allows upgrades on cups.
These cars are faster with big tires but work fine with 245s in front and either 275s or 285s in back.
These cars are faster with big tires but work fine with 245s in front and either 275s or 285s in back.