Originally Posted by Larry Herman

Agreed, it is a ridiculous argument. It's supposed lack of importance is propagated by those who don't know how to do it, and cannot or will not learn. All 3 of my boys have learned how to properly and smoothly do double-declutch downshifts. It's just a natural rhythm in the braking cycle.

Originally Posted by Larry Herman

It's one of those things that you have to pass on. I, on the other hand, had to learn it myself. I used to autocross a 1966 Spitfire in the '70s and the only way to get it back into 1st (straight cut) was to double-declutch. Won many an event with that car because I was one of the few who didn't have to lug 2nd coming out of the tight turns.

Originally Posted by race911

Now onto left foot braking. Anyone here with SRF experience? Better yet, when they were new and were Sports Renaults? Damn things had a piece of metal keeping your left foot over on THAT side, only to be used for clutching. Haven't been in one since about 1985, so maybe someone came to his senses and they removed that lame-*** "feature".

Originally Posted by MTosi

...... The difference was simply amazing compared to the other drivers. It has take me 2 and a half years of driving on the street both heel toeing and double clutching to feel that I am truly profficient at it. Also there is a reason Panizzi has never one a WRC championship... As Bryan said hes prob used to the sequentials in the wrc cars, also as he pointed out big dif between slow speed rallying and being at 150mph, a little slide at 60 is easily corrected, at 150mph its a whole different ball game.

Originally Posted by MTosi

It amazes me that this thread is 7 pages. Hell toe = essential . It is becoming a lost art though, I mean F1 drivers dont have to do it and they're the "best" so why should any of us? When you think about it, it's possible to get into formula one without knowing how to heel toe. Also there are plenty of people who "heel toe" but they are plain awful, just sit at turn one at lime rock and watch, very rarely do you see someone come into the braking zone smoothly transition from gas to brake, and then go through thier downshifts and have the attitude of the car does not change. Alot of cars you can see the nose lift off, and then plant again, lift off, plant, because when the go for the match they release pressure one the brakes. Ill never forget sitting at turn one at lime rock during the first rennsport and watching Jacky Ickx come into the corner with perfectly matched and smooth downshifts. The difference was simply amazing compared to the other drivers. It has take me 2 and a half years of driving on the street both heel toeing and double clutching to feel that I am truly profficient at it. Also there is a reason Panizzi has never one a WRC championship... As Bryan said hes prob used to the sequentials in the wrc cars, also as he pointed out big dif between slow speed rallying and being at 150mph, a little slide at 60 is easily corrected, at 150mph its a whole different ball game.

Originally Posted by srf506

Mooty, that's probably my problem, a torn ligment and a broken right ankle that's not that mobile anymore. By the way, in the early days of racing HT was described as Heel-Toe-Heel. The old guys used the heel of their foot on the brake and put their "toe" on the accelerator to blip it. I guess it was in the late sixties/early seventies when the common emergence of disk brakes made modulation of the brake pedal more important that most pro drivers started making the switch to that method we all know and love today. I guess the old drums were so ineffective/faded you didn't modulate, you just mashed them.

By the way, since we're talking advanced driving techniques does anyone teach left foot braking at DEs?

Originally Posted by John H

Mark,

Are you channeling Ray Calvo? BTW I copied that image to use (with your permission of course)

Originally Posted by MTosi

It amazes me that this thread is 7 pages. Hell toe = essential . It is becoming a lost art though, I mean F1 drivers dont have to do it and they're the "best" so why should any of us? When you think about it, it's possible to get into formula one without knowing how to heel toe. Also there are plenty of people who "heel toe" but they are plain awful, just sit at turn one at lime rock and watch, very rarely do you see someone come into the braking zone smoothly transition from gas to brake, and then go through thier downshifts and have the attitude of the car does not change. Alot of cars you can see the nose lift off, and then plant again, lift off, plant, because when the go for the match they release pressure one the brakes. Ill never forget sitting at turn one at lime rock during the first rennsport and watching Jacky Ickx come into the corner with perfectly matched and smooth downshifts. The difference was simply amazing compared to the other drivers. It has take me 2 and a half years of driving on the street both heel toeing and double clutching to feel that I am truly profficient at it. Also there is a reason Panizzi has never won a WRC championship... As Bryan said hes prob used to the sequentials in the wrc cars, also as he pointed out big dif between slow speed rallying and being at 150mph, a little slide at 60 is easily corrected, at 150mph its a whole different ball game.

Originally Posted by Larry Herman

Agreed, it is a ridiculous argument. It's supposed lack of importance is propagated by those who don't know how to do it, and cannot or will not learn. All 3 of my boys have learned how to properly and smoothly do double-declutch downshifts. It's just a natural rhythm in the braking cycle.

Originally Posted by Mark in Baltimore

BTW, I learned to heel-and-toe and double-clutch when I was a single-celled gamete. Here is a photo of me about to win my first DE: