Where are the Alonso detractors Pt 3
#31
NASA Racer
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I'm interested to see how well he does without TC.
Before he came to F1, this old Finnish rally driver (who lives in UK and who's name escapes me now) who is a driving coach had Hamilton with him to learn oversteering etc.
He said Hamilton sucked big time in slippery conditions, didn't have a clue really but after a lot of work he finally learned how to control the car. That might have an effect with new F1 cars & no TC.
Before he came to F1, this old Finnish rally driver (who lives in UK and who's name escapes me now) who is a driving coach had Hamilton with him to learn oversteering etc.
He said Hamilton sucked big time in slippery conditions, didn't have a clue really but after a lot of work he finally learned how to control the car. That might have an effect with new F1 cars & no TC.
#32
I think what seems to be true in many sports is that there are two extremes of techniques and drivers seem to fall somewhere between the two extremes. A great example would be Kimi on the one extreme who is very analytical. He is great because he is unemotional and very accurate. Calculating every move. The other extreme would be Massa who seems to thrive on emotion. Sure he has skill but he drives with pure passion. The problem is that passion drivers take longer to adapt to big change while the calculating, accurate drivers can adapt quickly. Alonso seems to be somewhere in the middle however, he pulls out his best performances when pissed off. Hamilton, on the other hand seems to falter when emotional. By the middle of the season, all drivers will have adapted and we will see the same mostly boring races akin to last year.... Unless it rains! I will be praying for rain every race weekend!
#34
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If you look at Alonso's driving style with the abrupt turn in at Renault, that seemed to work as his style was to have A LOT of understeer until the car hooked up. This goes hand in hand with the change in the way the engineers used ballast in the cars. In the past, they would want a neutral car. That shifted with the ballast then placed as far up the nose of the car as possible to make it as heavy as possible in front. A great illistration of this is when a car would have an off, the crane picks up the car at the roll hoop and the car goes into a nose dive with a corner worker supporting the front so it doesn't hit the ground. Basically the engineers wanted as much weight up front for turn in as possible and this was not exclusive to Renault.
If you look at the 2008 races, Alonso starts the season with this same abrupt turn in style, but slowly changed it and was more smooth with his imputs as the McLaren car was not condusive to that droving style. The first GP of the year will be telling if Alonso goes back to that style.
With respect to Hamilton, he has a driving style where he likes to slide the car in every turn. I wonder if the lack of tc in this years car will lead to prematurely wear out the tires. Once again, I can't wait for the 1st race of the year.
If you look at the 2008 races, Alonso starts the season with this same abrupt turn in style, but slowly changed it and was more smooth with his imputs as the McLaren car was not condusive to that droving style. The first GP of the year will be telling if Alonso goes back to that style.
With respect to Hamilton, he has a driving style where he likes to slide the car in every turn. I wonder if the lack of tc in this years car will lead to prematurely wear out the tires. Once again, I can't wait for the 1st race of the year.
Last edited by multi21; 02-08-2008 at 12:37 PM.
#35
Formula One Spin Doctor
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Name changed! Now I feel weird...
Mike,
Like I said, next week lunch here in Miami Beach would be great. Let me know
what day works. And as I said, you need to me able to take the punishment of looking hot girls in tight outfits...
Mike and I are already going, now we only need you to join. Any day next week, lunch at Lincoln Road or Ocean Drive, can you make it?
Mike,
Like I said, next week lunch here in Miami Beach would be great. Let me know
what day works. And as I said, you need to me able to take the punishment of looking hot girls in tight outfits...
Mike and I are already going, now we only need you to join. Any day next week, lunch at Lincoln Road or Ocean Drive, can you make it?
I saw something about the contrasting driving styles of Alonso, MS and someone else (I forget who). They talked about Alonso's abrupt initial steering input as a way to set the car in an understeering mode throughout the corner. Driver #2 had a smoother style with very neutral handling and MS was the fastest and smoothest on entry but had to deal with oversteer on corner exit. I wish I could remember where I saw that. It was quite interesting.
If you look at Alonso's driving style with the abrupt turn in at Renault, that seemed to work as his style was to have A LOT of understeer until the car hooked up. This goes hand in hand with the change in the way the engineers used ballast in the cars. In the past, they would want a neutral car. That shifted with the ballast then placed as far up the nose of the car as possible to make it as heavy as possible in front. A great illistration of this is when a car would have an off, the crane picks up the car at the roll hoop and the car goes into a nose dive with a corner worker supporting the front so it doesn't hit the ground. Basically the engineers wanted as much weight up front for turn in as possible and this was not exclusive to Renault.
If you look at the 2008 races, Alonso starts the season with this same abrupt turn in style, but slowly changed it and was more smooth with his imputs as the McLaren car was not condusive to that droving style. The first GP of the year will be telling if Alonso goes back to that style.
With respect to Hamilton, he has a driving style where he likes to slide the car in every turn. I wonder if the lack of tc in this years car will lead to him over use the tires. Once again, I can't wait for the 1st race of the year.
If you look at the 2008 races, Alonso starts the season with this same abrupt turn in style, but slowly changed it and was more smooth with his imputs as the McLaren car was not condusive to that droving style. The first GP of the year will be telling if Alonso goes back to that style.
With respect to Hamilton, he has a driving style where he likes to slide the car in every turn. I wonder if the lack of tc in this years car will lead to him over use the tires. Once again, I can't wait for the 1st race of the year.
Disagree with the analysis guys, If you look at Alonso in the michelin shod renault that was the style required to get the most out of his tires , he never drove the bridgestone shod mclaren in that manner. If you are new to the game go back and watch him at minardi or renault in the first year , he did not driver like that. He was credited for getting the most out of the michelins due to his ability to catch the car on rotation on turn in putting more bite into the tires . Remember, Kimi had more tire failures than Alonso and more than Montoya who was driving the same car and tires, hamilton also moves the car around alot, we will see how his tires last without TC.....
Here is alonso jerking the wheel pass schumacher ON THE OUTSIDE OF 130R IN Japan ja,ja,ja,ja,
www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLZLxT1ZEPA
Finn call or pm the date and location for lunch ......
#36
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#37
Instructor
While looking for F1 driving styles on youtube, found this oldie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uk2p2nRK-p4
fascinating analysis using telemetry of Schumi's throttle control vs his teammate in Benetton.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uk2p2nRK-p4
fascinating analysis using telemetry of Schumi's throttle control vs his teammate in Benetton.
#38
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Ahhh, the master at work. It never gets old
#39
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Larry Herman
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Larry Herman
2016 Ford Transit Connect Titanium LWB
2018 Tesla Model 3 - Electricity can be fun!
Retired Club Racer & National PCA Instructor
Past Flames:
1994 RS America Club Racer
2004 GT3 Track Car
1984 911 Carrera Club Racer
1974 914/4 2.0 Track Car
CLICK HERE to see some of my ancient racing videos.
#42
Formula One Spin Doctor
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All those videos where posted here last year and atthe time we had discussed the differing driving styles , well before the 3 amigos started littering the post with their negative conjectures..... Nice to see we can now get back to content.........
#43
King of Cool
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Thread Starter
I think what seems to be true in many sports is that there are two extremes of techniques and drivers seem to fall somewhere between the two extremes. A great example would be Kimi on the one extreme who is very analytical. He is great because he is unemotional and very accurate. Calculating every move. The other extreme would be Massa who seems to thrive on emotion. Sure he has skill but he drives with pure passion. The problem is that passion drivers take longer to adapt to big change while the calculating, accurate drivers can adapt quickly. Alonso seems to be somewhere in the middle however, he pulls out his best performances when pissed off. Hamilton, on the other hand seems to falter when emotional. By the middle of the season, all drivers will have adapted and we will see the same mostly boring races akin to last year.... Unless it rains! I will be praying for rain every race weekend!
Can't tell how well he sets the car up since I have no info on that but if it's raw talent & feel of what car is doing, I think he's the best of the current drovers.
Done.
#44
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Needs More Cowbell
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What happened?
I take a few days off to go to FL karting with my son (A. Wayne didn't show up at the paddock....I knew I shouldn't have wasted the money buying all those cardboard Alonso cutouts) and Alonso#2 is closed/gone?
I take a few days off to go to FL karting with my son (A. Wayne didn't show up at the paddock....I knew I shouldn't have wasted the money buying all those cardboard Alonso cutouts) and Alonso#2 is closed/gone?
#45
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He might have been drinking with the Finn