LVDell

Thanks Chris. I'll be in contact in the coming months. Cheers.

rmag

Just an FYI, I use WSIB and so does a friend. He had an unfortunate indicent at VIR and banged his car up. WSIB is paying (after a bit of negotiation)

BobbyC

I too have WSIB...good to hear they're paying. This is the kind of info, about an insurer when actual claims are filed, we all need to know. Thanks...

s997gt3

dito............

Giacomo

I have forwarded Chris an email inquiring about the particulars of the club racing program. Does anyone else have information on this end of the new insurance offerings? Something for dedicated track cars (that do not have conventional street coverage) in non-professional racing environments would be interesting.

David Danhof

Curious about wsib covering a number of events Vs an annual premium. I contacted them and was quoted on an annual basis regardless of the number of events. When questioned about it they said that is the only way they have it available.

Also I just requesteda copy of my State Farm polocy and I could not find the language I see quoted on this thread anywhere regarding the DE exclusion. Anyone cite chapter & verse?

I keep hearing that St Farm is dropping DE coverage elswhere, maybe it hasn't made it to the south.

Bull

It is usually State specific, with many States being like mine where there are significant bureaucratic hurdles to get over before an insurance company can change anything in an approved form of insurance policy. I'm sure they are trying everywhere.

HarryD

My State Farm Policy in Oregon says in just aboput every place possible:

"...There is no coverage while the vehicle is:

a. off public roads and being prepared for, used in practice for or operated in any racing, speed, hill climbing, jumping, or other similar contest; or

b. on a track designed primarily for racing or high speed driving. This does not apply if the vehicle is being used in connection with an activity other than racing, high speed driving, or any type of competitive driving"

looney2n

I have State Farm as well in NC.

I just got my Porsche 2 month ago, so it is fresh in my agents mind. I have been trying to "hint" about taking a look at the small print in my policy.

I have contacted him on 2 occasions and have saved his emails where he states, "have fun, you are completely covered" for Driver Education on a privately owned track. I think that should cover me for at least the first issue that may occur.

I do pay around $1200 a year just to cover the Porsche and another $1200 to cover the other 3 vehicles.

LVDell

Sure, State Farm will cover you here in NC (as I have talked to several people that have it) but the problem you face with STREET POLICY's is that if you ball up the car and they have to pay out then good luck getting that policy renewed and if it is, you don't even want to know what the premiums will be. Remember, here in NC we also have a LAW that requires the ins companies to add a % on top of your premium based on tickets, accidents, etc..

Just not worth it in my opinion since you are not just risking your track car but ALL of the cars in your garage. That is why I have track coverage so it doesn't get reported to my STREET POLICY company.

Here you go:
The automobile liability insurance rates which are paid by licensed drivers in North Carolina are determined by five factors:
The basic North Carolina automobile insurance rates which are set out in the North Carolina Personal Automobile Manual. Also see the NC Rate Bureau.

Insurance points which they have accumulated during the past three years for moving violations and accidents.

Whether their insurance company has transferred their coverage to the reinsurance facility.

What region of North Carolina they live in.

Whether that have three years or less driving experience.

Whether that have three years or less driving experience.

North Carolina drivers will be assessed insurance points if convicted of a moving violation or if they have an at fault accident during the three-year period immediately preceding the date of application or renewal of insurance. Each household may receive one Prayer for Judgment Continued (PJC) every three years without it counting as a conviction.

Table of Insurance Points
12 Points - Manslaughter (or negligent homicide) resulting from the operation of a motor vehicle. (Felony) Prearranged highway racing or knowingly lending a motor vehicle to be used in a prearranged race. (Felony) Failure to stop and render aid when involved in an accident resulting in bodily injury or death (hit-and-run driving) (Felony) Impaired driving, including driving a vehicle while under the influence of an impairing substance; driving a vehicle with an alcohol concentration of 0.08% or more; and driving a commercial vehicle with an alcohol concentration of 0.04% or more (a revocation pursuant to G.S. ¤¤20-16.5 is not a conviction). (Misdemeanor) Transportation of intoxicating liquors for the purpose of sale. (Misdemeanor)

10 Points - Highway racing (not prearranged) or knowingly lending a motor vehicle to be used in the race. Speeding to Elude.

8 Points - Operating a motor vehicle during a period of revocation or suspension of either the driver's license or vehicle registration. (Misdemeanor)

4 Points - Failure to stop and report when involved in a motor vehicle accident resulting in property damage only (hit-and-run). (Misdemeanor) Reckless driving. (Misdemeanor) Passing a stopped school bus. Speeding in excess of 75 miles per hour (mph) when posted limit is less that 70 mph. (Misdemeanor) Speeding in excess of 80 mph when limit is 70 mph or greater Driving by a person under 21 after consuming alcohol or drugs.

3 - Points Each at-fault accident that results in bodily injury (in excess of $ 1800.00) or death or total property damage (including the insured's property) of $ 3000.00 or more.

2 - Points Illegal passing Speeding more than 10 mph over the limit, if total speed was in excess of 55 mph but less than 76 mph. Speeding 10 miles or less in excess of limit in speed zone of 55 or greater.* Following too closely. Driving on the wrong side of the road. Each at-fault accident that results in total damage to all property which is in excess of $1 ,800.00 but less than $ 3000.00 3-4-2005.

1 - Point Speeding 10 mph or less in excess of a speed limit of less than 55 mph.* Any other moving violation. Each at-fault accident that results in total damage of $ 1,800.00 or less.

*Points are not assigned for these violations unless the same driver has been convicted of at least one other moving violation during the three years prior to this event. The number of insurance points a driver receives will determine the surcharge which will be added to their insurance costs.

Insurance Surcharge Table

One 25%
Two 45%
Three 65%
Four 90%
Five 120%
Six 150%
Seven 180%
Eight 220%
Nine 260%
For 1 point accidents ($1800.00 or less) there is no surcharge assessed if:

The operator was not convicted of a moving traffic violation in connection with the accident.

No licensed driver in the owner's household has a conviction for a moving traffic violation or other at fault accident during the three-year period immediately proceeding the date of application or the date of preparation of renewal of the policy.

There was no personal injury.

ShaunATL

I've been emailing back and forth with Chris about the new policy at Furman, and he said it was fine for me to post the Q&A's on this thread. I think I've covered most if not all of the questions previously discussed below. Please let me know if you guys think of anything else.

For people who haven't read this whole thread - these answers pertain to the "new" (as of June of 2008) policy offered by Furman Insurance/Chris Maume:

How is contact between cars handled in both cases? How is fault determined (if that is a factor in paying)? Would the other car be covered? Fault does not need to be determined. Only the insured vehicle is covered.

Are instructor sign offs required? No

Any other pre-reqs on the actual weekend for coverage to be valid (such as an instructor needing to be in the car at the time of incident for it to be covered)? No

Is coverage allowed for smaller clubs (such as http://www.autosportevents.com/) Yes, as long as the event is a "DE or HPDE", we do not provide coverage for lapping days or open track days on this policy.

How is coverage handled if oil/antifreeze spillage causes me to lose control and damage the car? It is covered.

How is coverage handled if I hit debris on track and do significant damage? It is covered.

In the event of a total loss, is agreed value what is paid? If not, is this an option? No, MSRP plus the value of modifications if you choose.

If not, how is the value determined? The MSRP needs to be determined by places such as Edmunds.com.

Which Edmunds number would be used? Trade In, Dealer Retail, or Private Party? Dealer Retail

If I get another car can the policy be transferred? Yes.

Is the car covered while in the paddock area or on a trailer? No, we provide off-track coverage on a separate policy.

If the car is already covered by a "street" policy, does this policy only pay if the street policy will not? In other words, is this policy a "first dollar" policy? These policies are designed to be used for all on-track accidents. It is an assumption that you are buying this policy so you would not make a claim on your standard auto policy. We advise against making such a claim since it could have serious consequences. Our policies will not cover a gap in a claim where your standard company will not cover 100%. We will only cover the accident when claimed under this policy. The claim will be paid up to the full MSRP that we insure. That is why we require the limit noted on the application-that is your insured limit.

Is there any medical coverage, or just the car? Just the car.

Is coverage limited only to HPDE students and not instructors (so if I am instructing, would my car still be covered on track)? No, the insurance follows the car.

Are crashes due to mechanical failure (such as a tire blowout) covered? Yes.

What is the percentage threshold of total value that when exceeded results in the car being totaled vs repaired? 85%

Is damage to the track covered (armco, dividers, etc)? No, that is liability.

Can I have my preferred body shop do any work for a claim? Yes.

If I have aftermarket track wheels that are less than the cost of factory wheels, would they need to be listed explicitly or would that fall under the normal policy provisions for repair/replacement? They are not covered under the policy. Wheels, tires and brakes are not covered.

LVDell

Tires and brake (pads I assume) I can understand but not wheels being excluded if they are damaged in the accident makes no sense. Can this be explained further?

jrok

We have all switched our insurance to Oswald Motorsports and Ryan Mcmanus. He is writing insurance for both DE's and NASA Time Trials in the same policy. Tell him I sent you, He's a nice guy and a fellow Track Junkie.
http://www.oswaldmotorsports.com/

mjb

ShaunATL, thanks for putting this together. Now this is a policy a could live with. Seems to address the shortcomings of the other offerings that had me concerned.
Did I miss the premium?

Still a little risky given the lack of claim history (AFAIK) but might be worth a shot.

DogInBlack