cosmosm3

Dave, my fault entirely. I kept seeing people going out with you each session and it still didn't cross my mind that I would have been able to catch a ride after lunch.

BTW, 4,XXX posts since '06? DAMN!

Dat

Veloce Raptor

No, I actually PAID in 2006...been posting here (not as a member) longer than that.

Steve Watkins

It's those scrubbing bubbles that get me every time in the toilet bowl.

himself

Got some video up. I can see 5 seconds already...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNDc1PKqT7M

-tom

Veloce Raptor

Hey, man! We need to do that again. Most fun I have had in a DE in a LONG time!

David 23

Nice video. While I also still have lots of room for improvement, I can humbly offer a couple suggestions. You might try earlier full throttle in 1, and then using all your track out, giving you higher exit speed and higher speed down the straight. I also think you might try turning in earlier for both 13 and 14. I find it faster thru 13 if you turn in early enough so you go over that "hump", then track out more left, and don't go all the way back over right before the left turn in for 14. Come back only to mid track, turn into 14 earlier and it works pretty well. Looks like you might be able to keep in the throttle longer going over the crest before 9. It sounded like some coasting or feathering as you were still going up toward the crest. It takes a little nerve, but you may be able to be flat all the way up. However, the car will be seriously light coming over the crest. You might be overslowing for 7, I think it can be taken faster than most of us think (including me).
Your driving looks great, hope I see you out at MSR soon. If you see me, come introduce yourself.

George A

Tom,

Here are my suggestions: First, stop trying to threshold brake, it's messing up your entry (making it inconsistent from lap to lap). Second, you need to attack the corners. I don't hear any tire noise, except under braking (and maybe through Tombstone). You goal should be to hear the tires squealing from corner entry to track out. That's what makes street tires so useful. Also, I don't hear you get on the gas until after track out. You need to be floored by or before the apex. Remember, every additional mph that you increase your exit speed gets carried the entire length of the straight. That's really important for corners like Tombstone and Big Bend. Finally, you need to stop focusing on lap times and start concentrating on the fundamentals. I see you trying to be fast, but sometimes that makes you slow. I know all about that........

Anyway, please don't take the above as a criticism, I'm just trying to offer some help.

BTW, my neighbor was there and got solo'd. He was in a bone stock 996 on street tires and running in the 38's.

Steve, are you going to Hallett?

G.

Veloce Raptor

I just watched the video. +1, George.

David 23

George knows MSR, +1.

George A

Thanks David's..... I really think MSR is one of the most difficult tracks to master because of all of the non-conventional corners, ie. off-camber down-hill left-hander (Rattlesnake, my favorite). I don't think there are two corners on the track that are the same. I think it really takes a lot track time to get it right. Now the good part is that once you've got it down, it makes other tracks seem easy.

G.

himself

George,

Thanks for feedback! Braking is the hardest thing for me to get right, and it's where I spend most of my "concentrated efforts." It's not so much threshold braking, just braking in general. If I over brake, I turn in early and miss the apex. If I under brake, I turn in late and miss apex. Sometimes, I'll over brake and just coast a car length to the turn in. But all these situations affect my ability to WOT properly.

As for the tires, I'm trying to maximize their work load, but my inability to get them to "talk" every corner is a function of the things you mentioned -> excessive braking (slow) and not WOT (not fast). But, lack of noise is arguably "good" news, since it shows that there is more work the tires can do in their operating "zone." AKA more go.
I do realize that I'm not on WOT early enough. This is on my list of bad habits I'm trying to fix. Seems like it should be an easy fix, i.e. push on pedal. But for some reason my head won't tell my foot to push. Or my foot won't listen. Stoopid foot.
I'm not really interested in the lap times and I really didn't even keep track of it until two weeks ago. I understand that the times are an imperfect measure of driving the course and can be affected by many things. But I like to use it as a tool (in connection with video) to set my baseline and also to compare it with other folks. It's a simple test to see how much faster other drovers are over the whole track. For example, I have video of the last club race at MSR. Cars running slicks in full F-stock setup were driving between 2:25-2:35 per lap. You have to believe they are running at 10/10ths. I know it's not apples to apples, but at least I can see where a stock 996 on mediocre street tires compares to a race set up f-stock running hoosiers.

I realize that I'm hooked on the track and need to develop new tools. Problem is, there is only a limited amount of time on the track. So what I really need is a better a way to maximize my learning time at the track. I tend to try too fix too many things at once, and end up getting nothing "right."

Again, thanks for the tips!

-tom

George A

Tom,

You are on the right path. The first step is to realize what you are really doing as opposed to what you think you are doing. Video is a great tool for that. I can't tell you how many times I watch my stuff and realize that I was doing things I shouldn't. Lap times are also a great tool, but if you get too focused on them, you lose the big picture. BTW, I've got a huge collection of MSR videos I can share with you. I guess I'll try to upload them this weekend.

You know I'm a member of MSR, as is David (23). If you ever get the bug to go out there on a non event weekend, shoot me an email and I'll see if I can work it out. My neighbor is building a G car and constantly haggling me to go out there with him (I think he is about to be a member). Finally, I also joined Eagles Canyon, so there's also another option.

G.

David 23

I completely agree. That is why I joined, I figured I would always feel challenged by the track. So far that has been true. Each time I go out, I find new subleties to deal with, even with the 1.7.

David 23

Tom,
I am always interested in having someone come out to MSR with me as a guest. It is more fun than going out alone. You can shoot me an email also and we can hook up.
A ride with George will open your eyes a bit. As I mentioned, he has MSR dialed, and is quite talented.

TR6

David, when you guys run member days out there, is it always the 1.7? I really, really, really wish I wasn't going to be out of town every weekend in October til the DE...

Speaking of the Oct DE, I just got an email from MavRegion that they are planning to run the 1.7 for the Oct 27 DE instead of the 3.1. That's kind of frustrating because I was looking forward to working on turns 8, 9, and 10 again. Much improvement still needed there.