4carl

over the years ive seen so many times a manufacturer compromise on a low production run. in this case it could be they simply didnt want to spend the money for a different shock and didnt test the impact because of a short production run.

i always remember the story of Ford and the Pinto . They discovered it would cost $.90 per car to change to a shorter bolt on the back of the car so the gas tank wouldn't get punctured in a rear end crash and explode. They decided it would be cheaper to settle lawsuits for people that died . carl

okie981

Interesting post in another thread from a GT4 owner who had two bent rims from hitting curbing on track, apparently with no shock tower issues resulting:

https://rennlist.com/forums/987-981-...l#post13812006

Buteo

I'm not surprised.

The more and more I read this thread, the more of a witch hunt it seems to be for some specific issue. I think it is more than likely Joe (the only gt4 with the problem that I'm aware of) is an outlier. It definitely is a bummer and I feel for him, but at this point I don't see it as a gt4 platform issue. With as hard as these cars are driven, we would be seeing many more events. I'd be up for removing this thread as a sticky.

okie981

It's puzzling how so many GT3/4 cars have taken extensive hard use with no shock tower issues, and why failure has occurred at all.

There was at least 1 other GT4 that had a shock tower failure. It occurred as a result of an off track excursion at a track day event at Thunderhill. There have been 991 GT3 cars with this failure, but not sure how many or of the circumstances behind those. The 991 cars share common shock towers and shocks/struts.

Sticky or no sticky, makes me no difference.

I'm curious and concerned enough to continue efforts to understand the cause(s).

stout

Good perspective.

I think it's down to a handful of GT4s? 2-3 plus other 981 and 991 vehicles? That's a tiny percentage. The things about it that are alarming is a) the cars are still quite new, 2) the cost to rectify after failure ($30,000~), and the lack of warranty coverage so far. Is it like the 3rd gear thing—possibly the result of a bad batch of parts from a supplier? I don't know, but the severity of the failure mode makes it worth trying to understand.

I don't think anyone wants to name this as a widespread problem, but try telling the GT4 owners who it happened to that it isn't a big deal. At least one of them states he made no driving errors at the time of failure.

Marine Blue

This is a very good point and to me the part that really stands out is the fact that these cars are new. Will failure rates increase as these cars age and the metal has been stressed numerous times? For someone who intends to hold on to the car for many years it is definitely worth pursuing the cause to establish if it is:
A. Poor choice of material / design
B. A manufacturing defect
C. Due to severe impact
D. Nothing at all, just a fluke

Or perhaps a combination of the above. Either way as a possible future buyer of one of these I am definitely interested in establishing if its an issue or not.

stout

I think Buteo raised a really good point, asking about whether this should be a sticky or is a witch hunt.

However, I think Marine Blue's points—and the severity of the failure mode as well as Joe Weinstein's experience with Porsche—merit keeping this a sticky until the matter is better understood.

Structural failures are a big deal, and I am trying to think of any examples in 986/996 or 987/997 vehicles.

Petevb

My money is on:
E. Lowering the car plus an impact.

This isn't the first Porsche to have ugly things happen when lowered. The balljoints on 944 A-arms tended to try and fall off. Bump-steer kits were needed to correct ill-handling 911s, etc. Porsche has given us ***** (height adjustment, camber adjustment, etc) but in the spec book they've generally told us not to use them...

texasviany

As a side note....I picked up my GT4 from a dealer in Mississippi and then "cannonballed" it back to Austin. I was hitting some dips in the HW that would get the car very light...nearly airborne. I was pissed about how stiff the suspension was. The suspension was thunking all the time to the point were I was concentrating on avoiding any dip or hole in the road. Then I got home and I see that the dealer left in the plastic spring locks. Nice....

So my feeling is that if the strut was going to break, it would have broken on that trip for sure.

4carl

Leaving the spacers in raises the ride height and would reduce impact to the strut tower. Just the opposite of what you would think. Carl

Yargk

I think the thread is useful and the exchange of information doesn't constitute a witch hunt.

This doesn't seem to be an issue encountered with previous models and specifically what Joe experienced didn't seem to be that big of a hit compared to the damage caused.

Though the number of incidents is still low, I won't jump to conclusions that there is nothing wrong or nothing to keep an eye out for. I'd say keep the sticky and we'll know more as these cars accumulate miles.

Joe Weinstein

It's been disassembled, and parts ordered. Looking like $25k.

Mech33

Collision insurance I assume?

okie981

If you can snap and share any photos of the structure of the car in disassembled state, that would be interesting. For example, where the rivet holes and bonding areas are, how far disassembled the car has to be for the repair, etc..

Joe Weinstein

Yes, collision, but not at-fault. I will see about photos.