Maddie288

Updated for 1 month... no issues... several charges.

crazycanucck

I have more details. I booked an appointment and my SA said they aren't aware of the fix. We dove into it deeper with the shop foreman and PCNA. Turns out this "fix" is a software update to PIWIS tester to clear the code itself. It's a stop gap while they work on a longer fix. Dealers will happily help but no guarantees on issue not recurring. It's definitely an issue related to the onboard charging unit. E3S3U is apparently an internal bulletin code not a campaign code. Looks like we are back to waiting for an official recall.

daveo4porsche

hmmmm - interesting…

daveo4porsche

no CEL post software update - so far - 900+ mile trip completed - and various errand days - so far so good - will keep monitoring.

Ericson38

This CEL was only related to charging status, but had no impact on actual charging functionality, correct Dave?

You have the Turbo S E Hybrid, or the base V6 E Hybrid (non-S)?

What is your purchase date and build date again ?

thanks for documenting all of this.

daveo4porsche

2021 Cayenne TurboS eHybrid
delivery date April 2021
first occurrence of the issue was @ 645 miles driven - shortly after a vehicle start sequence.
build date? 8-12 weeks earlier it was a personal order so manufacturing to delivery delta is/was minimum porsche logistics time + PECLA delivery scheduling
7.2 kW charger - standard equipment on the TurboS eHybrid

• CEL appears to be only "informative" - it does not affect _ANY_ actual functionality that I or my local service advisor can detect - but it is a CEL
• in my case it has never cleared on it's own - I've either had to take it to dealership or clear it myself with an ODBII reader
• car drives fine with no apparent impact from the CEL
• car charges fine with no apparent impact from the CEL
• car switches between hybrid modes and behaves normal and expected with no apparent impact from the CEL
• in my experience it is loosely correlated with charging - but not exclusively - I have situations of this happens where there was no recent charging activity
• in my experience it is 100% correlated with "soon after" ignition "on" - I've never had it occur "out of the blue" after the vehicle has been "running" for a while - once you're beyond 1 or 2 min of "run time" I've never had this CEL occur "out of the blue" - unless the vehicle has been switched "off" and subsequently "restarted"
• it is 100% non-reproducible - I went all of the month of Feb. 2022 with _NO_ CEL with normal vehicle use & charging
• I had it occur 3 times in the first week in march 2022 (it was overdue from Feb.)
• I have however for example - unplugged the car from charging - started it - no CEL - driven somewhere - no CEL - parked - turn off the vehicle - return to vehicle - start it up - boom - CEL (no immediate charging session)
• the code is a communications "fault" with the vehicle dynamic's system - apparently it has to do with the charger's ability to immobilize the car when it's plugged in/and/or charging - apparently the vehicle dynamic's module is responsible for vehicle "immobilization" - the fault is logged when the vehicle dynamic's system is non-responsive to the charging system's attempts to establish communication shortly after vehicle startup…

based on my personal observations and 40+ years commerical/professional software experience - I'm calling text-book system startup communication software/communcaitons "race condition" - this is a common problem - commonly non-reproducible when it happens across the industry (it works most of the time but infrequently fails for no detectible reason) - but easily and reliably resolved once diagnosed with minor adjustment to software timings/parameters - i.e. this CEL is in response to a temporary delay around system start up where module "A" can not communicate with module "B" - because of random timing differences while all these systems are "brought online" during vehicle "start" sequencing

I have 100% confidence that changes to vehicle software can 100% resolve this issue and there is no data that indicates there is ANY actual problem here - some module in the 2021's is a bit impatient after being woken up in terms of communcating with it's peers - and if it would just "chill" for a bit - and wait a bit longer for a response this issue would/will never happen again- and it does not indicate an actual problem. It's a false positive - not an actual fault.

my bet on a "fix" is a simple change to various systems to tolerate a longer period after startup before declaring a "communcations" fault - increase the retry count/time to allow for congestion and non-responsiveness with moduels communicating on the CANBUS - i.e. change a retry count from 8 to 24 times, and timeout period from 15 seconds to 45 seconds before declaring a "fault" - THIS IS 100% RANDOM SPECULATION ON MY PART - I HAVE ZERO/NO/NONE ACCESS TO THE INTERNALS OF PORSCHE'S SOFTWARE SYSTEMS

this is an avoidable software fault and in my experience does NOT indicate any underlying hardware defect or manufacturing problems - or even design issue with the underlying system - I'm fairly confident this is a software "tolerance" issue - and once the parameters are adjust the system should be in line with the expected MTBF of any consumer automotive system - there is not a hardware fault here - it's a software problem pure and simple and an innocuous one at that in terms of actual impact to vehicle behavior.

it based on my experience is not an actual fault, the underlying systems quickly actually do communicate with each other - but once the CEL is "posted" it can't be removed and must be recorded by the vehicle reporting system…

this particular CEL code is functionally inert - but you can not sell/transfer/register/pass-inspection/smog a vehicle with a recorded and unresolved CEL in the system - and until recently Porsche had no resolution for these CEL's that would prevent future recurrence - the CEL review registration/transfers/sales/legal infrastructure has no "system" for acknowledging that a CEL is an annoyance and not an actual underlying problem. It therefore depreciates the value of the vehicle on the used market, with this problem the vehicle is in fact legally defective, and failure to disclose this defect to a potential buyer would be grounds for a successful lawsuit in the future once the future buyer determined the status of the vehicle and your failure to disclose your knowledge of the situation (i.e. you knew it had a "CEL" problem that was unresolved and unresolvable).

it's a non-issue when the CEL is on for this code - but it makes the vehicle legally meet the criteria of defective which obviously materially affects it's value on the used market - rendering it zero values as in many juristicions in North America you can not successfully title/register a vehicle that is "defective" and can not pass inspection. You can not pass inspection with an active CEL - regardless of it's actual functional impact. Until Porsche has/will-have a fix - all Cayenne's experiencing this issue are legally lemon's and defective since they can not legally be sold or pass state inspection regulations - and Porsche factory service had/has no viable resolution to resolve future occurrences of this particular CEL activation.

it's a functionally trival problem with serious fleet wide implications.

Failure to resolve this by Porsche prior to the expiration of the warranty period for the vehicle could be grounds for a complete buy back as the vehicle is unsellable and does not meet minimum requirements and expectations of a road legal automobile.

daveo4porsche

it's not an actual functional problem (other than most people don't want a $100k++++ SUV that throws CEL's all the time)

but it is a material/legal problem because CEL's are "a thing" for registration/ownership - and must be resolved or the vehicle can't be driven on the highway.

Ericson38

Are all these posts related to the E hybrid turbo configuration, or is it all E hybrids of the 9Y0 platform?

Miggytosh

Good question, I think it is all e-hybrid turbos. My '19 e-hybrid hasn't been hit with it but been monitoring this thread just in case.

TXSchnee

I believe it is just 2021 model E Hybrids. My 2020 has never thrown this particular CEL. It is the standard V6 hybrid with the 7.2kW charger upgrade. 13,677 miles in, original owner.

daveo4porsche

so far data indicates all 2021 hybrids w/7.2 kw chargers - service manager says 2022 has fix -2021’s have a fix that can be applied by service - there is conversation on this thread as to if this fix is complete or a work around and more changes are forth coming

so far with my 2021 unit - no CEL post "fix" at this time - but given the lack of reproducibility - we're not out of the woods yet, but so far so good.

rajatparihar

Pls keep us posted if the CEL comes back again (I genuinely from bottom of my heart wish that it should not return). I am going to get MY23 e hybrid base with 3.6KW onboard charger in September 2022. The specd are locked hence hoping no CEL.

daveo4porsche

no CEL so far.

Maddie288

Same... 2+ months since the software update... numerous charges and no CEL.

JArnald

I have had MY22 hybrid since April 12th, with a 7.2 kw charger. No issues whatsoever. Trust your Service Manager that he told you this was fixed for 2022.

The most wonderful Cayenne ever, just puts a smile on my face, in my happy place.