Stone859

Hello:

I have an early 2005, 987 (Boxster) and on 10/10/16 I had an IMS failure. Here are the details:
- Purchased the car new on June 21, 2005, now i- has 21,466 miles.
- Do my own oil changes and treat them like a ritual... every year. Use Mobile One 0-40, cut filter open check with a magnet. On 4/9/14, at 17,037 miles, I installed a LN magnetic plug and their Spin-on-Filter.
- Last oil change was on 4/15/16 at 19,862 miles... I still have the cut-open "clean" filter.
- Driving habits are spirited, but respectful...long trips mostly...always get the car warmed up.
- Received paper work for the Class Action Law Suit...my car fit the parameters. However, I don't know if I'm in the Class Action or not. I never filed a IMS claim and got a letter from the lawyers that said I don't get any money because I had no claim. The car is just over 11 years old...if this failure would have happened on June 20, 2015 (making it under 10 years old), I believe it would have been fully covered.
- Failure happened on the highway, I sort of felt something in my butt...parked the car not knowing there was a problem, saw oil under it when I came out, but didn't really think it was mine...went to start the car and heard a terrible "rattle"! I shut it down immediately and called a tow truck.
- Car is at the dealer, the drain plug looks like a "Chia Pet", only with metal hair. Not 100% sure that it is an IMS failure but everybody thinks so...I think it is too. Waiting for Porsche's top mechanic to look at it and confirm.

I know this thread is for 996/997 owners but I'm thinking they both have the same IMS as my 987, and are experiencing the same problem. This thread is really detailed, and has gotten good responses from some pretty smart people so I though I'd throw the problem out to you guys. Let me know if there's anyplace else I might post it.

What should I do? I'm just sick about this! I've always owned at least one Porsche since I came back from overseas in 1975 (four 911's and a 914...I tend to hold onto them for a while...the 914 I had for almost twenty years), and have always done most of my own work. However, this is my first new Porsche. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Flat6 Innovations

- Purchased the car new on June 21, 2005, now i- has 21,466 miles.
Classic low mileage example of IMS Bearing failure.

Unfortunately that's not frequent enough... Despite what the owner's manual says, and now you know that after experiencing what you have.

- Last oil change was on 4/15/16 at 19,862 miles... I still have the cut-open "clean" filter.
>>>>Classic, this is why a filter inspection alone is NOT enough. This further proves what I have been stating for a decade; that an IMS Bearing can fail, progressing through all 4 stages of failure in a single oil service interval.

But too long of a warm up period keeps the engine on "cold start enrichment" longer, dumping excess fuel in the cylinders. A portion of that goes by the rings, and into the oil, where it ends up as fuel intrusion into the oil supply.

Thats a shame.. You are one of the few that had a perfect case.

NONE of my customers that were truly eligible have received anything from the case, since the settlement was later challenged by Porsche.

If it happened at speed you can expect all the exhaust valves to be bent, one, or both scavenge pumps to have failed 9from debris ingestion) and the IMS shaft to be toast. All pistons will have experienced valve contact. Collateral damage from foreign object debris will be extensive.

BUT, it can be saved, and I am saving one today. Full disassembly and ultrasonic cleaning, and its back together in 4 days.

I'll bet that it is... BUT don't let them disassemble it until you are sure that you want them to do the repairs.. Other shops (including mine) won't touch it if they pull it apart, BUT if they take it apart, you must also pay them to reassemble it before you can get the car back. This is true even if they reassemble all the blown up parts with our repairing it. Thats something you learn later- not now.

Exact same components.

I know a guy you can call.. He can repair this blindfolded, and at 21K miles, don't let that engine get away!:bigeye:

Dealing with a failure like this is nothing around here... It cost some money, but put it back together with my IMS Solution, and you'll not be making a post like this one in the future.

I found a broken M96 powered Porsche for my Mother- in law a couple of months ago. It was also a classic low mileage car that had an IMS Bearing failure. I pulled the engine apart last Wednesday, and I am re- installing the cylinder heads today after the full repair has been done. Here's some pics of her failure. This isn't the end of the world, unless you let it be......


















Reassembly started on Friday, all components cleaned of debris via ultrasonics, and all collateral damage taken care of. Fitted with an IMS Solution.



Where it stands this morning... Waiting on my cylinder head tech to finish the heads, they should be on before midnight, tonight.... Should be running Wednesday...

Stone859

Thanks for the response:

Well the dealer says they want $630 to take the trans out so they can tell if it's an IMS failure or not...then double it if I want to them to put it back together. If it's an IMS failure they present the information to Porsche and I try to get some "Goodwill" which would be a percent of parts off. I just hate having, the manufacture of what is clearly a defective engine, gain more business rebuilding their mistake...good business if you can get it. Here's my thinking:

- Not sure if it's worth the gamble to have them tell me it's IMS and ask for the "Goodwill". If they told me..."If IMS, this is what we'll do for you"...that would give me a lot more info. Lets say they give 50% off a new engine...that would give a bit more info.

- If they take it apart I might tell them..."just keep the trans out...I'll bring the car home and remove the engine myself ( it will take me more time then them, but I don't charge $135 and hour). Then my options spread out a bit:

Option A) Buy a good used engine.

Option B) Buy a rebuilt motor already.

Option C) Have my current engine rebuilt. Who would do this (I'm located in Southwestern Ohio). Who's the person I should to call that would do the rebuild? I'm afraid rebuilding the engine myself is above my pay grade.

Option D) Which of the IMS solutions do you believe will keep this from happening again? I believe my engine, an early 2005 is a single row type...which solution is the way to go with this?

Thanks again for your help

Flat6 Innovations

Classic. Straight from the script.

The engines were supposed to be used, and thrown away. Like a Bic lighter.

I can pretty much tell you exactly what you will be told. It comes from the next paragraph of the script I mentioned earlier.

Once they remove it, then they have you... Like a fish hooked on the line.

Good luck, thats an M96.25 and is very hard to find. A good used engine really does;t exist these days, most have been patched up by dismantlers, sold as used.

Maybe from RND Engines www.rndengines.com on an exchange basis.

Ship the whole car to Georgia...

There's only one IMS Solution
www.theimssolution.com

Its the one that has the wear parts removed... But, the Inventor is an *******. :-)

Sure... We should set up a time to chat. There's lots of info that I can't share here.

Josiah Erikson

2001S. No failure. Upgraded to LNE IMS at around 140K. 151K now.

digs

Just picked up a 2003 2.7 with 38000 mi . No known ims history ? Car is getting the upgrade as I type . Existing bearing looked fine , clutch has 10% remaining . LN bearing going in with new clutch . Off I go !

Jim 'n' SC

Replaced the clutch on my 2003 2.7 with 75,000 miles and the IMS was in good shape, replaced it with the new double row bearing.

drmindbender

I have a 2001 2.7 and it has 110k miles. The original IMS has not been replaced. No signs of wear in the oil, RMS and IMS seals are dry.

Tim Lawton

I have an '04 "S" that the IMS retired itself at 38800 mile doing 80mph on an open stretch of road....
It was a disaster....
I bought a total M-96.24 rebuild from a Porsche Performance shop in Ca (I live on the Ms Coast). It came with the LN bearing in it.
It was not fun....

I had a '99 Box before the S. I bought it with 68k miles. Around 80k it needed a clutch so I went ahead and changed the IMS out. The original was just fine with seals in good shape and grease in the race. Because of that, I delayed changing the IMS when I bought my S which had just turned over 36k miles....That was a huge and very expensive mistake....

tim

ZzzTime

I just bought a '98 with a month ago with 58,000 miles on it. It is the original IMS from what I can tell reviewing the history. I plan to have it changed out when the clutch needs to be replaced.

ZzzTime

I found an excellent explanation of the IMS bearing failure on YouTube (2014). The retrofit kit at the time was $800. I just went to the website (flat6innovations) and it is now $1800. Adding in labor makes this almost cost prohibitive. Is it really necessary to replace the IMS bearing in a '98 Boxster since they were still using the dual row bearing? Thanks!

ZzzTime

Hi Tim. When you changed the IMS out, which aftermarket part did you use? Did you opt for the retrofit kit from flat6innovations? Thanks!

Skaanning

Bought a 1998 2.5 6 months agp. As a part of the deal the IMS was changed to a new double ceramic. Clutch and much more was done too.
The guy who sold me the car is a porsche mechanic and he has changed a lot of IMS. Funny thing is that he told that in almost sll cases the old IMS was fine.
I saw the one from my car and it was in good shape.
The mechanic also told me that the few times something had been wrong it was on 2.7 and 3.2 cars with the single row bearings.
However, the most interesting thing he told me was that to him it was a complete mystery how garages charge you 10 - 12 hours of labour to change the IMS.
He went as far as calling it either 1) lack of knowledge and experience or 2) downright robbery.
It took him 4, 5 hours to change the IMS, the RMS and the clucth. And that is a fact because I was present most of the time.

Despite what I just wrote I would advice anybody who wants to buy an older Boxster to have the IMS changed. But have it done as part of the whole deal. As long as you have the money in your pocket, you have the upper hand. Sure you will pay a bit more for the car, but certainly not as much as a change "outside" the deal will cost you. Have clutch done in the same manner.
And demand to ser the bill for the parts, the old parts and also to have a few photograhps taken of the actual work. I also had the IMS change and all the other things written in the signed sales contract.
So I sleep fine at night!

ZzzTime

I spoke with a PCA member who is also a shop owner and mechanic. He’s estimating the IMS change in my ‘98 Boxster with a new clutch to be $3500-$4000. Does this seem reasonable (as far as Porsche’s go)?

Skaanning

It serms insane! 3500 - 4000 dollars? The mechanic I just wrote about takes what equals 1100 - 1200 including the parts for IMS and clutch. And labour is not cheap in Denmark, where I live.
Eventhough the IMS problem is (to a degree) real, we all know that there is an industri trying to talk it up and make money out of it. The same could be true for mechanics. 10 - 12 hours to take out a gearbox on a Boxster, change bearing and fit it together again?
I used to own a 996 manual. I am quite ok with spanners, but no expert. It took maybe 6 hours to switch the clutch which is also gearbox out and in.
I think you should look around for better offers...