OFFICIAL DSC SPORT DISCUSSION FORUM
#271
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Welcome to the DSC Sport community!
Sounds like you have some sorting out to do. Don't hesitate to email, PM, or call with any questions.
- Jordan
Sounds like you have some sorting out to do. Don't hesitate to email, PM, or call with any questions.
- Jordan
#272
Just wondering if there's anything else I need to know? Overall, based on what I've read, it seems like it's a pretty plug-and-play system. I've got the accelerometer oriented correctly (now) and the ground wire attached (now) and it seems I've figured out how to switch modes (just the button and count the blinks).
Does PSM (PSM, not PASM) have any effect? If I unplug the yaw sensor to disable PSM, will that cause issues with the DSC Sport system (on a car like mine, where I am using the DSC accelerometer)?
Is there any easy way to tell that the system is working? A diagnostic mode or some other sure-fire way to tell, "Yup it's definitely working"...?
#273
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Just wondering if there's anything else I need to know? Overall, based on what I've read, it seems like it's a pretty plug-and-play system. I've got the accelerometer oriented correctly (now) and the ground wire attached (now) and it seems I've figured out how to switch modes (just the button and count the blinks).
Does PSM (PSM, not PASM) have any effect? If I unplug the yaw sensor to disable PSM, will that cause issues with the DSC Sport system (on a car like mine, where I am using the DSC accelerometer)?
Is there any easy way to tell that the system is working? A diagnostic mode or some other sure-fire way to tell, "Yup it's definitely working"...?
DSC has no effect on PSM, and unplugging the yaw sensor to disable PSM should have no effect on DSC.
If the system isn't working (if there's a communication failure or faulty shocks) the system will resort to full stiff mode. There are also codes we can pull using the DSC tuning software. With regards to accelerometer, we can datalog or use seat-of-the-pants observations.
It may be a little late, but you should definitely consider starting a build thread on the car in the Cayman section. The DSC info could be very useful to some (and we'll be there to offer assistance), and by the sounds of it I'm sure there will be some other interesting projects involved with this build.
- Jordan
#274
I have read through this forum and the DSC/TPC websites and am having a hard time finding comparative specifications on the Billstein Damptronic, Tractive DDA and stock PASM (say 997.2) dampers. For instance, response time, dynamic range, effective spring rates (due to active dampers), etc.
Does anyone have such data?
Does anyone have such data?
#275
I have found some performance graphs for Billstein B16 (assume damptronic is on this platform and has the same adjustment range)
http://www.bilsteinus.com/uploads/tx...ro_7-10_12.pdf
and Tractive DDA:
http://www.tractivesuspension.com/pdf/Tractive_DDA.PDF
However I need assistance interpreting these graphs. They seem comparable on Rebound, but on compressive, Tractive appears to have a much wider range.
Am I interpreting this correctly? What is the practical relevance?
This does not show response time - does anyone have data on that (relative to the update speed of DSC or PASM controller).
db
http://www.bilsteinus.com/uploads/tx...ro_7-10_12.pdf
and Tractive DDA:
http://www.tractivesuspension.com/pdf/Tractive_DDA.PDF
However I need assistance interpreting these graphs. They seem comparable on Rebound, but on compressive, Tractive appears to have a much wider range.
Am I interpreting this correctly? What is the practical relevance?
This does not show response time - does anyone have data on that (relative to the update speed of DSC or PASM controller).
db
#276
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I have found some performance graphs for Billstein B16 (assume damptronic is on this platform and has the same adjustment range)
http://www.bilsteinus.com/uploads/tx...ro_7-10_12.pdf
and Tractive DDA:
http://www.tractivesuspension.com/pdf/Tractive_DDA.PDF
However I need assistance interpreting these graphs. They seem comparable on Rebound, but on compressive, Tractive appears to have a much wider range.
Am I interpreting this correctly? What is the practical relevance?
This does not show response time - does anyone have data on that (relative to the update speed of DSC or PASM controller).
db
http://www.bilsteinus.com/uploads/tx...ro_7-10_12.pdf
and Tractive DDA:
http://www.tractivesuspension.com/pdf/Tractive_DDA.PDF
However I need assistance interpreting these graphs. They seem comparable on Rebound, but on compressive, Tractive appears to have a much wider range.
Am I interpreting this correctly? What is the practical relevance?
This does not show response time - does anyone have data on that (relative to the update speed of DSC or PASM controller).
db
I think it is difficult to learn much from graphs and numbers, I had B16 Damptronics on before and now have Tractives/DSC and the difference is VERY obvious mine is just a street car but is has to control a lot of torque. The Bilsteins were good but quite "hard" all the time in contrast the Tractive/DSC set up is incredibly supple when pottering around, it soaks up potholes with aplomb and means a daily driven 800hp with full solid links everywhere and Cup 2s is a perfectly civilised reality, even my Mrs noticed how much better the ride is.
Of course the party trick is when you decide to lean on it, the suspension instantly tautens and the chassis is super responsive and planted, it really is quite amazing. Driving is the only way to appreciate it.
#277
....The Bilsteins were good but quite "hard" all the time in contrast the Tractive/DSC set up is incredibly supple when pottering around, it soaks up potholes with aplomb and means a daily driven 800hp with full solid links everywhere and Cup 2s is a perfectly civilised reality, even my Mrs noticed how much better the ride is.
#278
In considering a DSC installation on my SPASM car (for primarily HPDE use), what disadvantages does the active system have relative to a more traditional n-way adjustable (damping) coilover system? Put another way, are there material advantages to the more traditional n-way adjustable coilover system over DSC type active system?
(Let's ignore potential complexity arguments)
db
(Let's ignore potential complexity arguments)
db
#279
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In considering a DSC installation on my SPASM car (for primarily HPDE use), what disadvantages does the active system have relative to a more traditional n-way adjustable (damping) coilover system? Put another way, are there material advantages to the more traditional n-way adjustable coilover system over DSC type active system? (Let's ignore potential complexity arguments) db
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TPC Racing stats:
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup Am Champion
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge GT4 Pro-Am Team Champion
2022 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup & 991 Cup Champion
2020 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2018 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2016 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2013 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2006 Rolex-24 @ Daytona GT Champion
2004 Grand-Am SGS Class Champion
PCA National Instructor
TPC Racing stats:
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup Am Champion
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge GT4 Pro-Am Team Champion
2022 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup & 991 Cup Champion
2020 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2018 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2016 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2013 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2006 Rolex-24 @ Daytona GT Champion
2004 Grand-Am SGS Class Champion
#280
It has no disadvantage. It is a technology that offer to users that previously wasn't available. DSC stiffens the corner of the car only when it is needed to keep the car stable. When you're not leaning on the front end during braking or leaning on the outside during a high g corner there's no reason to keep that all 4 corner stiff. DSC makes the chassis fully dynamic, which is the direction all the higher end sportscars are heading. We are offering this technology as plug and play on applicable vehicles such as yours. Traditional manual adjustable shocks have to compromise by using the same static setting around the entire track. Many racers would love to have stiffer/softer setting for different corners and g-force levels.
For the stock PASM system, have you mapped the range of damping (i.e, output in ma) that the stock controller will send to the dampers compared to the range that the DSC controller is able to send (which appears to be the full hardware range of the dampers from looking at the software and other info on this forum)?
Same question for update rate from the stock controller v. the DSC controller?
I have PASM with the Sport/lowered suspension option (SPASM) which I believe has stiffer springs than regular PASM; is the same mapping used for both in the DSC controller?
I note that the only Tractive mapping on the download site is for the 991. Will the same map work (i.e., not just work but be the proper general map) on the 997 if I were to install the Tractives?
db
#281
Can you also clarify whether there is any hardware difference between versions? Can the firmware/software be updated for alternate models? One of your team was nice enough to clarify that the 987.2 and 997.2 boxes were the same and that with the proper downloads they could be interchangeable. Is that true for other models in the series (I.e. 7.2 turbos and gt3s).
#282
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Can you also clarify whether there is any hardware difference between versions? Can the firmware/software be updated for alternate models? One of your team was nice enough to clarify that the 987.2 and 997.2 boxes were the same and that with the proper downloads they could be interchangeable. Is that true for other models in the series (I.e. 7.2 turbos and gt3s).
All .2 987/997 - Same firmware and hardware
All .1 987/997 - Same firmware/hardware
All 997 Turbo - Same firmware/hardware as 9x7.2
All 991/981 - Same firmware/hardware
Stand Alone systems have their own firmware/hardware
PDTS (calibration files) files are interchangeable for all.
#283
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For the stock PASM system, have you mapped the range of damping (i.e, output in ma) that the stock controller will send to the dampers compared to the range that the DSC controller is able to send (which appears to be the full hardware range of the dampers from looking at the software and other info on this forum)?
PS- Since you referenced you have SPASM, I have assume your car is a 997.2 Carrera S or GTS. This particular thread is in GT2/GT3 forum, so you'll find the answers that are more relevant to your model in the 997 forum. There are many DSC users on the 997 forum who have lowering springs for all sorts with stellar reviews. Some of the users in the 997 forum have been sharing custom maps that they've made.
We have just started populating the DSC Sport website with maps. There will be more very soon. You could also contact us directly for map(s).
#284
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Tom, do you run anti sways on your race cars? If so why? Since your tractive and DSC setup could keep the car flat in turns electronically with input from the CAN yaw, pitch, roll sensors I'd think they'd be redundant, dead weight. Similar to McLaren's setup. I'd think DSC/tractive would be even better that cockpit adjustable sways when tracks have both bumpy and smooth sections.
#285
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Tom, do you run anti sways on your race cars? If so why? Since your tractive and DSC setup could keep the car flat in turns electronically with input from the CAN yaw, pitch, roll sensors I'd think they'd be redundant, dead weight. Similar to McLaren's setup. I'd think DSC/tractive would be even better that cockpit adjustable sways when tracks have both bumpy and smooth sections.
In my opinion, to truly be able to achieve extreme level track performance without bars a purposely designed chassis from ground up with integrated hydraulic system is necessary, like on the McLaren, see image below.
Please excuse me for describing the layout of this hi-tech system in the most basic term, its a large diameter damper on top of a damper...
At this point in time, I don't think its cost effective nor weight effective to add a separate hydraulic system on a 997. Sway bars do offer advantages on the 997 as stated above. Especially with 10+ years of successful racing history on the TPC 997 adjustable sway bars.