Sebring DavidMurry Jan 29/30 and 48hours Jan31-Feb3
02-04-2013, 08:37 PM
#286
I was initially really surprised about their times. However after giving it some thought, they're running 218's in warmer weather on Hoosiers. Now put the most expensive race tires you can buy for a street car into the mix, crisp weather, and some talent.... Not as surprised now. They were both very fast before running full race slicks.
With that being said I wouldn't want to write a track insurance policy for either of them
With that being said I wouldn't want to write a track insurance policy for either of them
Still did 2:19s with 17 heat cycles on them. They are lighter than Hoosiers, and if you look that way also last longer, or maybe close to it to a few guys that run 20+ heat cycles on them.
They will go faster with just cleaner laps.
02-04-2013, 08:39 PM
#287
Two ways to do that, actually three.
1) Establish the "tight group" of times when you're driving at a high level and are very consistent. Then, plot the actual and then TBL lap and see where the difference is. Then, focus on those areas (generally not more than two or three). More often than not (which is what I'm seeing in the data you sent me), it's a result of imperfect, irrgular and erratic basic skills execution, a lack of discipline or a lack of patience, not a lack of "*****." If you're made aware of what skill set you need to focus on, how to control your entry speed and get the car turned and "clean it up," you go faster with less risk and less drama. Oh, and less effort, too.
2) Know what "optimum" skill execution looks like on the data. THIS is why you don't need Chris, Nigel or anyone else to "set a time" to compare to. If you execute properly, then the data will look like it. Most folks' data is far from optimal... This is where I am most often a resource, at the track. Working with Andrew Z last week, we got him doing :11 flat in a car he has little time in, at a track he's never been to, in a short period of time, with priorities he can use at every other track, in every other car he drives. THIS IS WHAT IS COOL!
3) Have somebody (Leh, Andrew, Patrick) do a "hell ride." Problem with that is that they aren't you. And their risk/benefit is difference, their confidence and their knowledge and comfort foundation is completely different.
This is why you need to look at what you're doing and break it down in the most granular operational parameters. Then optimize all the little pieces and put it together. Lo and behold, you're fast and within acceptable risk/benefit ratios. For you...
1) Establish the "tight group" of times when you're driving at a high level and are very consistent. Then, plot the actual and then TBL lap and see where the difference is. Then, focus on those areas (generally not more than two or three). More often than not (which is what I'm seeing in the data you sent me), it's a result of imperfect, irrgular and erratic basic skills execution, a lack of discipline or a lack of patience, not a lack of "*****." If you're made aware of what skill set you need to focus on, how to control your entry speed and get the car turned and "clean it up," you go faster with less risk and less drama. Oh, and less effort, too.
2) Know what "optimum" skill execution looks like on the data. THIS is why you don't need Chris, Nigel or anyone else to "set a time" to compare to. If you execute properly, then the data will look like it. Most folks' data is far from optimal... This is where I am most often a resource, at the track. Working with Andrew Z last week, we got him doing :11 flat in a car he has little time in, at a track he's never been to, in a short period of time, with priorities he can use at every other track, in every other car he drives. THIS IS WHAT IS COOL!
3) Have somebody (Leh, Andrew, Patrick) do a "hell ride." Problem with that is that they aren't you. And their risk/benefit is difference, their confidence and their knowledge and comfort foundation is completely different.
This is why you need to look at what you're doing and break it down in the most granular operational parameters. Then optimize all the little pieces and put it together. Lo and behold, you're fast and within acceptable risk/benefit ratios. For you...
02-04-2013, 08:44 PM
#288
Rennlist Member
I know how to construct plans and strategies that mere mortals can use to DO THE SAME THING as "those who are pros" do.
I know how to communicate that to mere mortals so it sticks, if not at that event, in future events. While the track knowledge required for competence to shine at particular tracks may be local, the concepts of going fast are global. Proper PRO coaches like VR, Seth and few others do this, although in differing levels of detail, different depths of data analysis and from differing perspectives... It ain't rocket science.
What IS in control of the driver is proper execution of fundamental skills, a reduction of ANY questions about where to place the car and where it should be when particular control inputs are executed. Do all that, and you're as fast as they are...
I know how to communicate that to mere mortals so it sticks, if not at that event, in future events. While the track knowledge required for competence to shine at particular tracks may be local, the concepts of going fast are global. Proper PRO coaches like VR, Seth and few others do this, although in differing levels of detail, different depths of data analysis and from differing perspectives... It ain't rocket science.
What IS in control of the driver is proper execution of fundamental skills, a reduction of ANY questions about where to place the car and where it should be when particular control inputs are executed. Do all that, and you're as fast as they are...
-observe (preferably from the passenger seat) exactly what you are doing in every location on track, write it down, and use it as the baseline of your performance
-develop specific measurable and achieveable objectives for each session you are on track, based on these observations
-articulate in language YOU can understand (which is different with each drover) what you are doing well & what you need to do to meet each of the objectives where you can do better
-narrate the above in car
I do this. I know Peter and Seth do this, and likely a few others. It is not about laying down a lap 12 seconds faster than theirs, as Dez correctly says. It is about communicating ways of getting the drover closer to the coach's level of performance.
Eddie, if we ever work together, I would (for example) pick 3 segments to work on, where I believe there is low hanging fruit that would allow you to achieve your objective without adding any extra drama or danger. And then we would work through each one until success is achieved. Other things may pop up while working on these segments--so be it!
02-04-2013, 08:52 PM
#289
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A proper coach should do 4 fundamental things
-observe exactly what you are doing in every location on track through microscopic and exhaustive examination of the video and data, write it down and use it as the baseline of your performance
-develop specific measurable and achievable objectives for each session you are on track, based on these observations, duplicate optimal segments and skill executions that YOU HAVE DONE and not more than three
-articulate in language YOU can understand (which is different with each drover) what you are doing well & what you need to do to meet each of the objectives where you can do better
-measure the result and communicate this result and these observations off-track, when you have time and the undivided concentration required to absorb abstract concepts and adopt them as your own.
-observe exactly what you are doing in every location on track through microscopic and exhaustive examination of the video and data, write it down and use it as the baseline of your performance
-develop specific measurable and achievable objectives for each session you are on track, based on these observations, duplicate optimal segments and skill executions that YOU HAVE DONE and not more than three
-articulate in language YOU can understand (which is different with each drover) what you are doing well & what you need to do to meet each of the objectives where you can do better
-measure the result and communicate this result and these observations off-track, when you have time and the undivided concentration required to absorb abstract concepts and adopt them as your own.
People look at me and say "you don't look like a race car driver." And I don't, at least not like anyone short of Gerry Marshall, Tony Stewart or Tiny Lund!
I can count on one hand in over two decades cars that I have not been quicker in than the client... But as VR and Dez aptly say, that is NOT the point.I think there is terrific value in many of the various approaches endemic to each recognized professional coach.
VR, Seth, David Tuaty, Chris Hall and others are immensely valuable, but at some point, we all need to step back and get the client to a point where they have the knowledge and confidence that the pros do. That's part of the problem, IMO, of many a recognized "pro driver/coach." For many, it's the pro driver part that is more important, not the coach.
Comfort, knowledge and confidence. 99 percent of the battle, right there.
Sorry for the diversion... Back to Sebring.
__________________
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
02-04-2013, 09:00 PM
#290
Rennlist Member
02-04-2013, 11:17 PM
#291
couldnt help but post following trakcar before video cable disconnected wondering what he was doing in t 17 LOL
that 914 was a good example of almost every lap where people probably from out of town never on track were " lost" not even looking in rear view mirror....i think later in day point bys were optional amongst the de cup crew........David Murray track day was definitely a great experience though....
that 914 was a good example of almost every lap where people probably from out of town never on track were " lost" not even looking in rear view mirror....i think later in day point bys were optional amongst the de cup crew........David Murray track day was definitely a great experience though....
02-05-2013, 10:32 AM
#294
Drifting
couldnt help but post following trakcar before video cable disconnected wondering what he was doing in t 17 LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCkffubMSMo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCkffubMSMo
02-05-2013, 10:38 AM
#295
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02-05-2013, 11:12 AM
#296
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Sometimes, but the nose always stays roughly pointed in the right direction. Took a while to get back in line, I dont remember doing it, so it was not that eventful I think.
Messing with 17 based overhearing others LOL.
Messing with 17 based overhearing others LOL.
02-05-2013, 12:15 PM
#297
Nordschleife Master
02-05-2013, 12:51 PM
#299
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