Draft: Visit Europe with your GT3
08-23-2012, 04:40 PM
#61
Advanced
Me neither...
It is surprising that it's so difficult. I guess one option would be to not actually drive on the public roads and use a rented trailer, transporter but.....
I do wonder what the difference is between intending to register a vehicle and not intending to, surely the insured risk is the same.
It is surprising that it's so difficult. I guess one option would be to not actually drive on the public roads and use a rented trailer, transporter but.....
I do wonder what the difference is between intending to register a vehicle and not intending to, surely the insured risk is the same.
08-23-2012, 06:13 PM
#62
A lot of it has to do with "we are not used to this kind of stuff". Banks and isurance companies like the stuff they did 100000 times before, following standard procedures. As soon as you ask something else things get more difficult. Probably because they think it isn't worth the hassle.
08-23-2012, 06:27 PM
#63
Rennlist Member
Me neither...
It is surprising that it's so difficult. I guess one option would be to not actually drive on the public roads and use a rented trailer, transporter but.....
I do wonder what the difference is between intending to register a vehicle and not intending to, surely the insured risk is the same.
It is surprising that it's so difficult. I guess one option would be to not actually drive on the public roads and use a rented trailer, transporter but.....
I do wonder what the difference is between intending to register a vehicle and not intending to, surely the insured risk is the same.
I am just glad I never had to call to use my insurance in the UK while there, as I am confident the fact that I had not yet registered it would be used to the insurance companies advantage!
A lot of it has to do with "we are not used to this kind of stuff". Banks and isurance companies like the stuff they did 100000 times before, following standard procedures. As soon as you ask something else things get more difficult. Probably because they think it isn't worth the hassle.
08-23-2012, 07:04 PM
#64
Advanced
Perhaps get in touch with a respected track day organiser. For example, bookatrack.com do a trip in February to Spain and Portugal. Ship your car to Lisbon and it could travel to Estoril, Potimao & Jerez by transporter then back on the boat. No need for any insurance for the public roads and you can buy track only 1st party insurance for a non road registered car from a few ins companies. No road driving but you can rent a car to commute between circuits. Did this in Feb this year, wonderful it was too.
2013 plans forming here. http://bookatrack.com/-p1blog?48
2013 plans forming here. http://bookatrack.com/-p1blog?48
08-23-2012, 08:02 PM
#65
Drifting
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Munich
Posts: 2,722
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Perhaps get in touch with a respected track day organiser. For example, bookatrack.com do a trip in February to Spain and Portugal. Ship your car to Lisbon and it could travel to Estoril, Potimao & Jerez by transporter then back on the boat. No need for any insurance for the public roads and you can buy track only 1st party insurance for a non road registered car from a few ins companies. No road driving but you can rent a car to commute between circuits. Did this in Feb this year, wonderful it was too.
2013 plans forming here. http://bookatrack.com/-p1blog?48
2013 plans forming here. http://bookatrack.com/-p1blog?48
R+C
08-24-2012, 06:28 AM
#67
Instructor
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Somewhere in Europe, usually...
Posts: 126
Likes: 0
Received 16 Likes
on
9 Posts
As mentioned, I'm making calls to Lloyds brokers (yes, Lloyds of London). Thusfar, they've got a willingness on Personal Property. The same kind of insurance you'd use when transporting a 1939 Bugatti to Concourse d´Elgance... or when you have a tank slapper on a mountain road without damage to others. I haven't yet found a Lloyds broker who will also underwrite the third-party liability (i.e. European Green Card). The obvious preference is to have one company underwrite a comprehensive policy, such that in case of significant accident, you aren't stuck mediating between policies. I could use some help, perhaps you've got more experience and contacts with Lloyds brokers?
08-24-2012, 09:47 AM
#68
Drifting
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Munich
Posts: 2,722
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Here is a list of Managing Agents of syndicates that offer "Overseas Motor" cover.
http://www.lloyds.com/The-Market/Dir...s?categoryId=7
Check with some of these agencies to find which brokers they prefer dealing with and contact the the broker directly.
THERE IS A CAVEAT US folk are supposed to deal with US brokers
Some potential brokers -
ELLIOTT SPECIAL RISKS LP
130 Adelaide Street West,
Suite 810
Toronto
Ontario
Canada
M5H 3P5
Tel: +1 001 416 601 2475
Fax: +1 001 416 601 1150
Web: www.elliottsr.com
HANLEIGH MANAGEMENT INC
50 Tice Boulevard
Suite 122
Woodcliffe Lake
New Jersey
U S A
07677
Tel: +1 201-505-1050
Fax: +1 201-505-1051
Web: www.crump.com
HARMAN KEMP NORTH AMERICA LTD
Roman Wall House
1-2 Crutched Friars
London
United Kingdom
EC3N 2HT
Tel: +44 (0)20 7782 0537
Fax: +44 (0)20 7782 0538
Web: www.hknal.com
ROBERTSON LOW INSURANCES LTD
No 10 The Courtyard
Kilcarbery Park
Nangor Road
Dublin 22
Republic of Ireland
Tel: +353 1 461 1550
Fax: +353 1 461 1570
Web: www.robertsonlow.ie
http://www.robertsonlow.ie/car-insurance.html
WILLIS LIMITED
The Willis Building
51 Lime Street
London
United Kingdom
EC3M 7DQ
Tel: +44 (0)20 3124 6000
Fax: +44 (0)20 3124 8223
Web: www.willis.com
http://www.willis.com/Contact_Us/ (note NY phone number)
I suggest you make it very clear that you only need cover whilst the car is in Europe, not in transit from US to Europe. That you will have a European (accomodation) address whilst over, and a European mobile phonje number (prepaid).
Alternatively deal with Zurich in Zürich.
If you ship to Zuffenhausen for service, be nice to the folk there and entreat them to send the car through the TÜF and with that paperwork you can nip round to the car registration centre, pick up insurance and some German plates (for a year, not a shorter period, can have problems at the 'ring on short term plates).
R+C
http://www.lloyds.com/The-Market/Dir...s?categoryId=7
Check with some of these agencies to find which brokers they prefer dealing with and contact the the broker directly.
THERE IS A CAVEAT US folk are supposed to deal with US brokers
Some potential brokers -
ELLIOTT SPECIAL RISKS LP
130 Adelaide Street West,
Suite 810
Toronto
Ontario
Canada
M5H 3P5
Tel: +1 001 416 601 2475
Fax: +1 001 416 601 1150
Web: www.elliottsr.com
HANLEIGH MANAGEMENT INC
50 Tice Boulevard
Suite 122
Woodcliffe Lake
New Jersey
U S A
07677
Tel: +1 201-505-1050
Fax: +1 201-505-1051
Web: www.crump.com
HARMAN KEMP NORTH AMERICA LTD
Roman Wall House
1-2 Crutched Friars
London
United Kingdom
EC3N 2HT
Tel: +44 (0)20 7782 0537
Fax: +44 (0)20 7782 0538
Web: www.hknal.com
ROBERTSON LOW INSURANCES LTD
No 10 The Courtyard
Kilcarbery Park
Nangor Road
Dublin 22
Republic of Ireland
Tel: +353 1 461 1550
Fax: +353 1 461 1570
Web: www.robertsonlow.ie
http://www.robertsonlow.ie/car-insurance.html
WILLIS LIMITED
The Willis Building
51 Lime Street
London
United Kingdom
EC3M 7DQ
Tel: +44 (0)20 3124 6000
Fax: +44 (0)20 3124 8223
Web: www.willis.com
http://www.willis.com/Contact_Us/ (note NY phone number)
I suggest you make it very clear that you only need cover whilst the car is in Europe, not in transit from US to Europe. That you will have a European (accomodation) address whilst over, and a European mobile phonje number (prepaid).
Alternatively deal with Zurich in Zürich.
If you ship to Zuffenhausen for service, be nice to the folk there and entreat them to send the car through the TÜF and with that paperwork you can nip round to the car registration centre, pick up insurance and some German plates (for a year, not a shorter period, can have problems at the 'ring on short term plates).
R+C
08-25-2012, 05:44 PM
#69
I shipped my US spec 997.2 GT3 in February of this year to Germany. I may have missed something but I found the Touristfahren approach to not be a good fit for me on several levels. Unless you are active duty military or a USG contractor, IMO the best approach is full re-registration of the vehicle. Once I did this, everything normalized and I'm happy I went that route. Thanks in advance to Dan for starting this string and Nordschliefe for helping me when I reached out to him, both guys are class acts. The whole process from start to finish took about 6 weeks. Caveat: DO NOT USE CSI-MIAMI to ship your car, they are worthless. Make sure you take out full insurance coverage if you decide to do this on the transport. I am happy to answer specific questions via PM.
08-25-2012, 05:53 PM
#70
Rennlist Member
I shipped my US spec 997.2 GT3 in February of this year to Germany. I may have missed something but I found the Touristfahren approach to not be a good fit for me on several levels. Unless you are active duty military or a USG contractor, IMO the best approach is full re-registration of the vehicle. Once I did this, everything normalized and I'm happy I went that route. Thanks in advance to Dan for starting this string and Nordschliefe for helping me when I reached out to him, both guys are class acts. The whole process from start to finish took about 6 weeks. Caveat: DO NOT USE CSI-MIAMI to ship your car, they are worthless. Make sure you take out full insurance coverage if you decide to do this on the transport. I am happy to answer specific questions via PM.
08-25-2012, 06:10 PM
#71
Hello Larry,
I don't think re-registration is a good idea if you are not intending to stay on a long term basis as the EU has an importation tax of 19% of the value on the vehicle. One must meet several requirements in order to get around this. I may be missing one or two but the most important are as follows:
1.) Must have a long term visa and relocating to an EU country with proof of residence.
2.) You must import the car within 12 months of your visa issuance date.
3.) You must have owned the car out right for at least one year.
4.) You can not sell the car for at least one year after importing it as "personal goods".
The re-registration process is timely and costly. I had to spend hours at the TUV where they went through my car with a fine tooth comb. I removed ALL aftermarket items prior to the shipment and still had to change out both head lights and tail lights to conform with EU standards which as you can imagine was costly (around 4.000 Euros). Hope this helps.
I don't think re-registration is a good idea if you are not intending to stay on a long term basis as the EU has an importation tax of 19% of the value on the vehicle. One must meet several requirements in order to get around this. I may be missing one or two but the most important are as follows:
1.) Must have a long term visa and relocating to an EU country with proof of residence.
2.) You must import the car within 12 months of your visa issuance date.
3.) You must have owned the car out right for at least one year.
4.) You can not sell the car for at least one year after importing it as "personal goods".
The re-registration process is timely and costly. I had to spend hours at the TUV where they went through my car with a fine tooth comb. I removed ALL aftermarket items prior to the shipment and still had to change out both head lights and tail lights to conform with EU standards which as you can imagine was costly (around 4.000 Euros). Hope this helps.
08-25-2012, 06:38 PM
#72
Rennlist Member
Hello Larry,
I don't think re-registration is a good idea if you are not intending to stay on a long term basis as the EU has an importation tax of 19% of the value on the vehicle. One must meet several requirements in order to get around this. I may be missing one or two but the most important are as follows:
1.) Must have a long term visa and relocating to an EU country with proof of residence.
2.) You must import the car within 12 months of your visa issuance date.
3.) You must have owned the car out right for at least one year.
4.) You can not sell the car for at least one year after importing it as "personal goods".
The re-registration process is timely and costly. I had to spend hours at the TUV where they went through my car with a fine tooth comb. I removed ALL aftermarket items prior to the shipment and still had to change out both head lights and tail lights to conform with EU standards which as you can imagine was costly (around 4.000 Euros). Hope this helps.
I don't think re-registration is a good idea if you are not intending to stay on a long term basis as the EU has an importation tax of 19% of the value on the vehicle. One must meet several requirements in order to get around this. I may be missing one or two but the most important are as follows:
1.) Must have a long term visa and relocating to an EU country with proof of residence.
2.) You must import the car within 12 months of your visa issuance date.
3.) You must have owned the car out right for at least one year.
4.) You can not sell the car for at least one year after importing it as "personal goods".
The re-registration process is timely and costly. I had to spend hours at the TUV where they went through my car with a fine tooth comb. I removed ALL aftermarket items prior to the shipment and still had to change out both head lights and tail lights to conform with EU standards which as you can imagine was costly (around 4.000 Euros). Hope this helps.
In the UK, you avoid import and VAT/GST taxes if you have owned the vehicle for more than 6 months prior to importation, and you have not been a UK resident for 2 years prior, apart from that (1,2, 4) above also apply.
my take is that this is not really viable (for me) if all you want to do is tool around europe for somewhere between 1 week and 6 months...
08-25-2012, 07:49 PM
#74
Rennlist Member
08-25-2012, 07:51 PM
#75
Rennlist Member
Hello Larry,
I don't think re-registration is a good idea if you are not intending to stay on a long term basis as the EU has an importation tax of 19% of the value on the vehicle. One must meet several requirements in order to get around this. I may be missing one or two but the most important are as follows:
1.) Must have a long term visa and relocating to an EU country with proof of residence.
2.) You must import the car within 12 months of your visa issuance date.
3.) You must have owned the car out right for at least one year.
4.) You can not sell the car for at least one year after importing it as "personal goods".
The re-registration process is timely and costly. I had to spend hours at the TUV where they went through my car with a fine tooth comb. I removed ALL aftermarket items prior to the shipment and still had to change out both head lights and tail lights to conform with EU standards which as you can imagine was costly (around 4.000 Euros). Hope this helps.
I don't think re-registration is a good idea if you are not intending to stay on a long term basis as the EU has an importation tax of 19% of the value on the vehicle. One must meet several requirements in order to get around this. I may be missing one or two but the most important are as follows:
1.) Must have a long term visa and relocating to an EU country with proof of residence.
2.) You must import the car within 12 months of your visa issuance date.
3.) You must have owned the car out right for at least one year.
4.) You can not sell the car for at least one year after importing it as "personal goods".
The re-registration process is timely and costly. I had to spend hours at the TUV where they went through my car with a fine tooth comb. I removed ALL aftermarket items prior to the shipment and still had to change out both head lights and tail lights to conform with EU standards which as you can imagine was costly (around 4.000 Euros). Hope this helps.
