Strip 237 pounds off an RS! ... end up with a 3014 pound car
08-16-2007, 08:07 PM
#61
Burning Brakes
i think the rs is nothing more than factory maximizing its profits. gt3 probably took big development $ to upgrade drivetrain, suspension, etc over std carrera. rs did not. its just business.
i still wish the rs was normal aspirated 450 hp/2500 lb killer
i still wish the rs was normal aspirated 450 hp/2500 lb killer
08-16-2007, 08:47 PM
#62
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Originally Posted by Flying Finn
I agree, GT3 RS is "just" a street car but IMO that doesn't mean you need a ton of sound deadening, big stereos, door panels etc.
In Turbo or other models maybe yes, but not in a model such as GT3 or GT3RS. They're the sportier models and therefore need to be sportier, and light weight & less "crap" goes with that.
Porsche RS models have always been like that, usually very little or no more hp but better supension etc. and less weight.
That always was the whole point of those macig two (RS) letters. Now IMO Porsche & buyers have "dropped the ball" a little by not following that 30 year old "rule". GT3 & GT3RS being "just a street car" is no excuse.
Also if someone has a cup car and only tracks it, but doesn't race, IMO that's little silly. Of course if someone has enough money they can do DEs in Formula 1 car all they want but still, if you have a full race car & race set-up, you need to race it.
In Turbo or other models maybe yes, but not in a model such as GT3 or GT3RS. They're the sportier models and therefore need to be sportier, and light weight & less "crap" goes with that.
Porsche RS models have always been like that, usually very little or no more hp but better supension etc. and less weight.
That always was the whole point of those macig two (RS) letters. Now IMO Porsche & buyers have "dropped the ball" a little by not following that 30 year old "rule". GT3 & GT3RS being "just a street car" is no excuse.
Also if someone has a cup car and only tracks it, but doesn't race, IMO that's little silly. Of course if someone has enough money they can do DEs in Formula 1 car all they want but still, if you have a full race car & race set-up, you need to race it.
what i am saying is the RS is the best street car PAG is willing to give up and that's that. until we can convince them otherwise, what can you and i do???
so all i can say is i bought one, keep it stock, drive it like i stole it 8800 miles. and if someone makes a nice light way no frill'd door card and some such wt reduction item of high qty, i would be in for it.
i looked at some CF hoods for 993 996 but they were pathetic. and the motorsports parts are scaring $$$$$
you know what i mean as we are on the same boat lamenting where the proper RS went.
08-16-2007, 08:51 PM
#63
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Originally Posted by Flying Finn
...(seats, c/f hood & decklid, no sound deadening, no trunk carpet, less speakers, lightweight wheels, door panels, lightweight exhaust etc.) without losing ANY streetability. .
seats: done
CF hood: saving money for those
no sound deadening: good idea, winter project
less speakers: we only have front one's. the rear is "fake"
door panel: i am waiting for someone to make something of quality
light wt exhaust: anyone makes one that's light and 92dB or quieter? i dont care how it sounds. but i need to pass sound chk at laguna seca
wheels: done
08-16-2007, 09:05 PM
#64
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Rennlines are nice. Ultimate makes heel-toe extensions as a monobloc instead of an add-on
http://www.ultimatepedals.com/catalo...?cPath=135_180
http://www.ultimatepedals.com/catalo...?cPath=135_180
08-16-2007, 09:36 PM
#65
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Porsche did at least add aluminum doors on the 997 GT3 and 997 Turbo this year, the front hood was aluminum on all 997 models from the beginning. I wonder why no aluminum front fenders?
I note that the Turbo has forged alloy wheels which look to be very well made and probably a few pounds lighter than the heavy cast GT3 wheels, why no forged wheels on the GT3?
There used to be a lot of magnesium used in the cars, my 964 cup has a lot of magnesium on the engine- the new engines use no magnesium anywhere I can see.
The 2.7 RS and 964 RS have absolutely no sound deadening sprayed onto the chassis. This stuff is very dense and probably adds over 100 pounds to the car, I don't think any sound deadening was removed from the latest RS.
Also the earlier RS cars have no padding under the carpet, the GT3 I inspected had thick padding under the carpet in the back of the car.
A lot of weight could be saved just by doing what they used to do, but this really limits the market for the car- note how the average GT3 is loaded with optional stuff that adds weight.
Sad fact is, most people don't care how much it weighs just so long as it says Porsche on it and one really doesn't appreciate a light car unless it is taken to the track- where the difference is astounding.
I note that the Turbo has forged alloy wheels which look to be very well made and probably a few pounds lighter than the heavy cast GT3 wheels, why no forged wheels on the GT3?
There used to be a lot of magnesium used in the cars, my 964 cup has a lot of magnesium on the engine- the new engines use no magnesium anywhere I can see.
The 2.7 RS and 964 RS have absolutely no sound deadening sprayed onto the chassis. This stuff is very dense and probably adds over 100 pounds to the car, I don't think any sound deadening was removed from the latest RS.
Also the earlier RS cars have no padding under the carpet, the GT3 I inspected had thick padding under the carpet in the back of the car.
A lot of weight could be saved just by doing what they used to do, but this really limits the market for the car- note how the average GT3 is loaded with optional stuff that adds weight.
Sad fact is, most people don't care how much it weighs just so long as it says Porsche on it and one really doesn't appreciate a light car unless it is taken to the track- where the difference is astounding.
08-16-2007, 10:14 PM
#66
King of Cool
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Originally Posted by tcracing
Re: 993 RS CS
I brought 2 into the country. These are REALLY more, much more track cars than every day cars. No a/c, lack of carpet, etc. Both cars are now full time PCA C class racers, that is where they belong.
I brought 2 into the country. These are REALLY more, much more track cars than every day cars. No a/c, lack of carpet, etc. Both cars are now full time PCA C class racers, that is where they belong.
Making the most extreme street model (in this case GT3 RS) washed out and not really extreme at all is a shame and this is where I disagee.
If you want to make/make an extreme/sporty/track worty model, make it like you mean it.
"Brought 2 into the country"... Lucky dog, well done!!
08-16-2007, 10:16 PM
#67
King of Cool
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Originally Posted by mooty
seats: done
CF hood: saving money for those
no sound deadening: good idea, winter project
less speakers: we only have front one's. the rear is "fake"
door panel: i am waiting for someone to make something of quality
light wt exhaust: anyone makes one that's light and 92dB or quieter? i dont care how it sounds. but i need to pass sound chk at laguna seca
wheels: done
CF hood: saving money for those
no sound deadening: good idea, winter project
less speakers: we only have front one's. the rear is "fake"
door panel: i am waiting for someone to make something of quality
light wt exhaust: anyone makes one that's light and 92dB or quieter? i dont care how it sounds. but i need to pass sound chk at laguna seca
wheels: done
I knew I can count on you.
08-16-2007, 10:20 PM
#68
King of Cool
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Originally Posted by mooty
...what i am saying is the RS is the best street car PAG is willing to give up and that's that. until we can convince them otherwise, what can you and i do???...
Or what you've already started, modifying it so that it will be like it should.
08-16-2007, 10:53 PM
#69
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by Cupcar
I note that the Turbo has forged alloy wheels which look to be very well made and probably a few pounds lighter than the heavy cast GT3 wheels, why no forged wheels on the GT3?
Sad fact is, most people don't care how much it weighs just so long as it says Porsche on it and one really doesn't appreciate a light car unless it is taken to the track- where the difference is astounding.
Perhaps a few went to Cowboys. But with 300 in country, probably most will go to "good" homes.
Hey, I like slender women too, but sometimes a woman of slightly larger proportions can be quite a turn-on
08-17-2007, 08:39 AM
#70
King of Cool
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Originally Posted by allegretto
...Hey, I like slender women too, but sometimes a woman of slightly larger proportions can be quite a turn-on
08-17-2007, 12:13 PM
#71
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by allegretto
on the wheel thing the TT wheels are quite heavy. my HRE C-21's were 12 lbs lighter rear and >8 lbs front!:
08-17-2007, 12:50 PM
#74
Ironman 140.6
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Originally Posted by Alan Smithee
An 'RS' model should weigh significantly less than the standard model. The 997GT3RS weighs about the same as a base model 997 (which has a power sunroof, rear seats, power rear spoiler, full stereo system with PCM and amp, and no exotic materials). There's no excuse...Porsche got lazy and greedy.
It's a shame that Porsche has started increasing weight in the 911 again. It would have been nice to see them continue what Porsche accomplished with the 996, by making it lighter than it's predecessor.
08-17-2007, 02:46 PM
#75
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Originally Posted by eclou
The stock TT wheels are 25.4lbs front, 29lbs rear. The Gt3 wheels are 24 front, 31 rear IIRC. By comparison, Champions are about 18lbs front, 21lbs rear.
I wonder what a GT3 with carbon fiber roof ala BMW and full alloy construction ala Audi would weigh in at? I would guess over 4000 pounds if Porsche did it!!!