Motons on GT3
#1
Pro
Thread Starter
Motons on GT3
I must be the only one around who thinks the new GT3 is a little too bouncy. Compared to my almost stock 996GT3, this new car has a lot of vertical motion on our local, bumpy track. I think the new car has better mid-corner handling, but the dampening (PASM) is not so good.
[edit - removed the incorrect spring rates statement here]
So long story short, has anybody gone with Motons on their GT3 yet? Opinons? (I know you all have them )
[edit - removed the incorrect spring rates statement here]
So long story short, has anybody gone with Motons on their GT3 yet? Opinons? (I know you all have them )
Last edited by Ray G; 05-24-2007 at 02:45 PM.
#2
First, you must understand that if you have the same spring rates on one car weighing 2700 lbs and the same rate on a 3000 lbs the springs will be relativly softer on the heavier car. I actually think the car needs higher spring rates than it has but I am waiting a bit to see what others do as far as dampers which brings us to your original question.
#3
A few race shops have fitted Motons. You can turn PASM off so the computer doesn't blow up your dashboard with MILs. My understanding is that Motons work just as well on the 997 as they did on the 996.
#4
Originally Posted by Ray G
Anyway, talking to my local shop, Cantrell Motorsports, they told me the road GT3 has the same progressive springs as the 997 Cup cars. That is 1100lbs front, 1300lbs rear. Cantrell knows their stuff - they are running 5 997 cups this year in IMSA, and he has a long history with 996 cups.
Also, Excellence reported that the 997 moved to linear springs.
#5
Originally Posted by Ray G
I must be the only one around who thinks the new GT3 is a little too bouncy. Compared to my almost stock 996GT3, this new car has a lot of vertical motion on our local, bumpy track. I think the new car has better mid-corner handling, but the dampening (PASM) is not so good.
Anyway, talking to my local shop, Cantrell Motorsports, they told me the road GT3 has the same progressive springs as the 997 Cup cars. That is 1100lbs front, 1300lbs rear. Cantrell knows their stuff - they are running 5 997 cups this year in IMSA, and he has a long history with 996 cups.
They regularly put Motons on the Cup cars for this purpose. The springs rates are really high, and the road car dampening IMO is not up to it.
So long story short, has anybody gone with Motons on their GT3 yet? Opinons? (I know you all have them )
Anyway, talking to my local shop, Cantrell Motorsports, they told me the road GT3 has the same progressive springs as the 997 Cup cars. That is 1100lbs front, 1300lbs rear. Cantrell knows their stuff - they are running 5 997 cups this year in IMSA, and he has a long history with 996 cups.
They regularly put Motons on the Cup cars for this purpose. The springs rates are really high, and the road car dampening IMO is not up to it.
So long story short, has anybody gone with Motons on their GT3 yet? Opinons? (I know you all have them )
I have put on JRZ's with 400/600 springs, but I am still testing. I thought this would be a good starting point, but I may go higher. I will know more after a few weeks of testing.
#6
Pro
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by frayed
Am I reading this right? No way does the street GT3 have the same rates as cup cars. I can look up the rates, they are around somewhere.
Also, Excellence reported that the 997 moved to linear springs.
Also, Excellence reported that the 997 moved to linear springs.
Please look up the rates if can. I have a hard time believing that too.
#7
Well, the rears went linear; don't confuse progressive springs with dead coils, which are designed to fully go into coil bind under static load. Just like with tender springs on aftermarket coilovers.
Anyway, coilbind, tender springs, progressive, linear. . . all besides the point. I'll look up the spring rates and get back with the info; the springs were uprated front and rear about 10% over the 996 GT3 and my fuzzy recolloction is 250ish/450ish fr/rr.
Anyway, coilbind, tender springs, progressive, linear. . . all besides the point. I'll look up the spring rates and get back with the info; the springs were uprated front and rear about 10% over the 996 GT3 and my fuzzy recolloction is 250ish/450ish fr/rr.
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#8
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Thread Starter
Originally Posted by frayed
Well, the rears went linear; don't confuse progressive springs with dead coils, which are designed to fully go into coil bind under static load. Just like with tender springs on aftermarket coilovers.
Anyway, coilbind, tender springs, progressive, linear. . . all besides the point. I'll look up the spring rates and get back with the info; the springs were uprated front and rear about 10% over the 996 GT3 and my fuzzy recolloction is 250ish/450ish fr/rr.
Anyway, coilbind, tender springs, progressive, linear. . . all besides the point. I'll look up the spring rates and get back with the info; the springs were uprated front and rear about 10% over the 996 GT3 and my fuzzy recolloction is 250ish/450ish fr/rr.
#9
Pro
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by frayed
Well, the rears went linear; don't confuse progressive springs with dead coils, which are designed to fully go into coil bind under static load. Just like with tender springs on aftermarket coilovers.
In any case, I don't really care what the rates are, but the dampening is what I am kind of complaining about. I took my new GT3 around some of my fave hilly Northwest back roads, and it just wasn't as good feeling as my old GT3 over the same roads, mainly because the low-frequency rebound dampening seems too low. PASM in either mode didn't help much.
#10
Pro
Thread Starter
Just got word back from Cantrell. He got his info from Moton. This is what he said:
You are correct. They were confusing it with the cup cars. The street car rates are way too soft. Moton uses a 450 front, 650R and everyone has been really happy with how it transforms the car. The factory rates are super soft.
#13
Originally Posted by Ray G
the low-frequency rebound dampening seems too low. PASM in either mode didn't help much.
"You are correct. They were confusing it with the cup cars. The street car rates are way too soft. Moton uses a 450 front, 650R and everyone has been really happy with how it transforms the car. The factory rates are super soft."
The street rates are super soft. I think the fronts use interntal bump stops that ramp up the spring rates and make the effective spring rate non linear.
I think the above quote is misleading. "Moton" does not use any spring rates. They make dampers, not damper/spring combos. Motons club sports can handle up into the 1000 lb+ regime. 450/650 would be a nice setup for a dual purpose car but for the hard core track rates, 450/650 won't be enough to fight the weight of the car.
#14
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AWE has a PDF of the PIWIS procedure needed to disable the PASM. I am seriously considering their Moton clubsport package on my TT, along with adjustable H&R sways. It is very hard to shake these obscene urges to mod.
#15
Originally Posted by eclou
AWE has a PDF of the PIWIS procedure needed to disable the PASM. I am seriously considering their Moton clubsport package on my TT, along with adjustable H&R sways. It is very hard to shake these obscene urges to mod.
After Mike's post above I was wondering if the PDF is still current.