Window Stopped Dropping
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Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2012
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Window Stopped Dropping
2005 997.1 with ~70k miles. The driver's window is tired. 3 out of 4 times it will not drop before you close it - so it closes on top of the rubber instead of tucking underneath it. It's probably the switch that controls the drop, but I am not sure what all is in there. The window still drops if I tug on the interior or exterior door handles, but it pops up. Which leads me to think maybe there is another position sensor in there that's not working?
I've searched and I haven't found anyone else with this issue. Hard to believe it's just me. Anyone seen or fixed this? Thanks.
I've searched and I haven't found anyone else with this issue. Hard to believe it's just me. Anyone seen or fixed this? Thanks.
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Joined: Jun 2014
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It is either the microswitch in your door handle or the window regulator. Nine times out of ten it is the regulator. If the window doesn't drop but you can push it down with your hand, it is likely the regulator. Very common problem.
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,402
Likes: 10
From: Maryland
does my problem sound like yours? (altho at least i can still get mine to work if i'm careful when opening)
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...sue-again.html
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...sue-again.html
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 19,031
Likes: 266
From: Bentonville, AR
2005 997.1 with ~70k miles. The driver's window is tired. 3 out of 4 times it will not drop before you close it - so it closes on top of the rubber instead of tucking underneath it. It's probably the switch that controls the drop, but I am not sure what all is in there. The window still drops if I tug on the interior or exterior door handles, but it pops up. Which leads me to think maybe there is another position sensor in there that's not working?
I've searched and I haven't found anyone else with this issue. Hard to believe it's just me. Anyone seen or fixed this? Thanks.
I've searched and I haven't found anyone else with this issue. Hard to believe it's just me. Anyone seen or fixed this? Thanks.
If you do not pull on the handle hard enough to open the door but instead release the handle, the window should go up. This is a sign the door latch/catch switch is working.
If you go ahead and open the door the window should stay down. This is also a sign the door latch/catch switch is working.
If the window goes up before the door is closed, this is a sign the door lock assembly/controller (it it an electro-mechanical device) is bad, though it can be possible one of the other switches could be at fault. The tech might not know which is which until after he pulls any error codes from the car's security system. Even then he might have to expose the door innards to do some more tests.
If the window drops slowly, or fails to drop a sufficient amount this is a sign the window regulator is bad.
Long shot but check for dampness on the floor of the car, under the seats. Check for dampness along the door bottoms. You can even give the doors a shake for any sounds of water sloshing about. In some cases water can get into the cabin -- usually from blocked body water drains that overflow -- or from a door membrane or water can get into the door from a bad door membrane -- and this can cause electrical gremlins at the door locks, odd window behavior.
If all is dry, then something has just worn out.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2012
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does my problem sound like yours? (altho at least i can still get mine to work if i'm careful when opening) https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...sue-again.html
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 26
Likes: 5
Long shot but check for dampness on the floor of the car, under the seats. Check for dampness along the door bottoms. You can even give the doors a shake for any sounds of water sloshing about. In some cases water can get into the cabin -- usually from blocked body water drains that overflow -- or from a door membrane or water can get into the door from a bad door membrane -- and this can cause electrical gremlins at the door locks, odd window behavior. If all is dry, then something has just worn out.
RL Community Team
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From: Clemson, SC
On the backside of your interior door handle find the little plastic pin that is a molded part of the handle and see if that pin looks worn compared to the one on the passenger door which is used far less often. If that pin wears it won't always push the little microswitch and that will keep the window from working properly. Next time it happens, push that door handle in and see if the window works right. Actually, in thinking about this, that switch would cause the opposite problem where the window wouldn't return to its up position, not prevent it from dropping. There are I think 4 microswitches tied to the window drop functionality and it's likely one of the outer door handle ones that's being intermittent. Unfortunately, you need to pull the door panel to get to those. Just look up the door panel removal DIY and follow it. The first time it will take you 20-30 minutes, but after you've done it a few times, you'll be able to pop them off in about 10. Let us know what the issue turns out to be.
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Race Director
Joined: Sep 2006
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From: Bentonville, AR
Barring some inexplicable problem with body water drains though the odds are there is not a moisture problem. It never hurts to check, though, just in case.
My Boxster's interior has remained dry over the years, thank goodness, but still the car has required a number of door and window hardware replacements. The parts just wore out. There was the passenger side door lock assembly, a door handle switch on the driver's side door and both sides required a new window regulator.
These appeared after 200K miles but like other parts these can wear out -- or fail -- at any time. 70K miles is probably as good as time as any.
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Might be able to find some DIY Tech Articles that can help you out with removing the panel and inspecting further to see what the issue may be. Good luck!
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Mine started acting up but then the door suddenly fixed the issue. The dealer was about to order the door sensor(s) (there are 7 for each door in the 996.2). In my case the door computer became confused...and then relearned what it was supposed to do. Imagine all this just so they could do away with the window frame on the door. The answer is to bring back the 993.
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Mine started acting up but then the door suddenly fixed the issue. The dealer was about to order the door sensor(s) (there are 7 for each door in the 996.2). In my case the door computer became confused...and then relearned what it was supposed to do. Imagine all this just so they could do away with the window frame on the door. The answer is to bring back the 993.
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From: Georgetown, TX
Window frame?......
In May '93, I picked up my first 911 on Euro Delivery at Zuffenhausen. The drop off process was pretty simple. You could drop it of at any time on any day at a specific factory gate. There, a security guard would appear with an inspection form similar to what you might see from a car rental company. He would closely inspect the car for any damage, and asked if there were any problems or faults with the car. Any faults would be addressed by trainees in the service training dept. rather than pay the US dealer warranty labor to repair the car.
I mentioned to him that at speeds above 160 KPH, the window frames would not seal tightly and you could hear wind noise. (It seems that as the air rushed past the window area, a low pressure was created that sucked the window from away from its seal.) The inspector politely told me, "The 911 has been this way since 1963, and there is no solution or adjustment that will solve this problem". Apparently it required the design you saw first on the 996 and following models to eliminate the problem all together.
I mentioned to him that at speeds above 160 KPH, the window frames would not seal tightly and you could hear wind noise. (It seems that as the air rushed past the window area, a low pressure was created that sucked the window from away from its seal.) The inspector politely told me, "The 911 has been this way since 1963, and there is no solution or adjustment that will solve this problem". Apparently it required the design you saw first on the 996 and following models to eliminate the problem all together.
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Booyah!
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...2529%2520%2520
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...0%20Left%2C%20
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...2529%2520%2520
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...0%20Left%2C%20
I copy pasted this for you. Hope it helps.
It seems that there are more and more cases of these faults appearing, and as some of our cars are reaching 10-12 years old, it is hardly surprising. I've compiled this information from past personal experience on both of my 996s, reading about others on here and other forums, referring to the workshop manual and wiring diagrams, and applying some logic. Hopefully you might find it useful, and save some grief when troubleshooting.
DOOR MICROSWITCHES
There are seven microswitches in each door which control the alarm system.
Two are separate switches:
a] One on the outside door handle. This switch is used to sense that the handle is lifted.
b] One on the inside door handle, which has the same function.
When the car is unlocked and either handle is lifted, this signals the alarm control module (ACM) to lower the appropriate window by 10mm, and turn on the interior lights. As soon as the door opens, another switch inside the door lock (explained later) tells the ACM that the door is open, which holds the window down until the door is closed, when the window is raised, and the dimming timer on the interior lights is started. Once the car is locked, the outside handle switches are ignored by the ACM.
The remaining five switches are inside the door lock assembly:
c] One switch senses if the door is open or closed.
d] One senses that the key has been turned to the 'lock' position.
e] Another senses that the key has been turned to the 'unlock' position.
f] One senses that the door lock motor has reached the 'lock' position.
g] Another senses that the door lock motor has reached the 'unlock' position.
TYPICAL FAULTS
All these microswitches can be problematic, and it is common for one or more to fail at some time. These are some of the common failures and symptoms:
1) The door window won't drop when lifting a handle. This is usually the handle microswitch which has failed.
2) The window drops, but goes back up when the door opens, or when the handle is released. This can be the handle microswitch, or more likely the 'door open/closed microswitch' ( c ) has stuck. Because the system thinks the door is still closed, it sends the window back up.
3) Door window won't go up the last 10mm. This is likely to be the 'door open/closed microswitch' ( c ) stuck in the opposite sense to (2). The system thinks the door is still open, so won't allow the window to go back up. Note that in this case the door will still lock, but you may get a single-beep from the alarm horn.
4) Door will not lock with key. The 'key lock' microswitch (d) is broken. This is very rare, as this microswitch is hardly ever used – most times the car is locked by remote.
5) Door will not unlock with key. The 'key lock' microswitch (e) is broken. This is also very rare, for the same reason.
6) Door locks, and then immediately unlocks, usually accompanied by a double-beep from the alarm horn. This is the 'door locked' microswitch (f). The locking motor physically operates the door lock, but the microswitch to sense this has failed/stuck. The ACM promptly unlocks the car. In this case, the only way to lock the door is to use the emergency locking procedure. Turn the key in the door to the lock position and back three times in quick succession.
7) The door unlocks, but there is a beep from the alarm horn. This is the 'door unlocked' microswitch (g). Although the door is unlocked, the ACM has not recognised that. The alarm will not sound, as turning the key in the lock has deactivated it.
FIXES
The inside and outside handle microswitches are available separately, and are not too expensive. Although alternative equivalent switches may be available, the genuine Porsche switch comes with a connector and wiring, so it makes sense to use an original. Part Numbers:
Inside handle microswitch: 996.613.123.00 (Same both sides)
Outside handle microswitch: 996.613.125.00 (Left) / 996.613.126.00 (Right)
The door lock microswitches are not available separately. You have to buy the complete door lock assembly, at a cost of around $120. It has been known for people to repair the offending switch though. This is a picture of a typical failure of a 'door open/close' microswitch (courtesy of another RennTech member):
I didnt put this photo in as you already saw it on another posting..... It shows a broken switch unassembled in parts.
You can see that the plastic plunger has broken, jamming the switch lever inside. These switches are (apparently) made by Burgess, but as yet the source and part number is unknown. There are several other similar standard switches on the market for around $2, and people have stripped down the new switch and rebuilt the old one with the plunger from the new one.
OTHER SWITCHES IN THE ALARM SYSTEM
The other switches and contacts in the alarm system are to monitor the lid closures:
Front lid microswitch
Rear lid microswitch
Oddment compartment microswitch
Glove box microswitch
Radio contact (to detect radio theft)
An open compartment or switch failure will cause a single-beep of the alarm horn on locking. A system error will cause a double-beep.
Other elements of the system include an interior monitoring sensor (in the overhead lighting), an alarm readiness light (on the dashboard in the centre) and a central locking button (on the dashboard). Options are a tilt sensor (next to the battery or under the left hand seat) and an alarm siren (next to the the battery).
It seems that there are more and more cases of these faults appearing, and as some of our cars are reaching 10-12 years old, it is hardly surprising. I've compiled this information from past personal experience on both of my 996s, reading about others on here and other forums, referring to the workshop manual and wiring diagrams, and applying some logic. Hopefully you might find it useful, and save some grief when troubleshooting.
DOOR MICROSWITCHES
There are seven microswitches in each door which control the alarm system.
Two are separate switches:
a] One on the outside door handle. This switch is used to sense that the handle is lifted.
b] One on the inside door handle, which has the same function.
When the car is unlocked and either handle is lifted, this signals the alarm control module (ACM) to lower the appropriate window by 10mm, and turn on the interior lights. As soon as the door opens, another switch inside the door lock (explained later) tells the ACM that the door is open, which holds the window down until the door is closed, when the window is raised, and the dimming timer on the interior lights is started. Once the car is locked, the outside handle switches are ignored by the ACM.
The remaining five switches are inside the door lock assembly:
c] One switch senses if the door is open or closed.
d] One senses that the key has been turned to the 'lock' position.
e] Another senses that the key has been turned to the 'unlock' position.
f] One senses that the door lock motor has reached the 'lock' position.
g] Another senses that the door lock motor has reached the 'unlock' position.
TYPICAL FAULTS
All these microswitches can be problematic, and it is common for one or more to fail at some time. These are some of the common failures and symptoms:
1) The door window won't drop when lifting a handle. This is usually the handle microswitch which has failed.
2) The window drops, but goes back up when the door opens, or when the handle is released. This can be the handle microswitch, or more likely the 'door open/closed microswitch' ( c ) has stuck. Because the system thinks the door is still closed, it sends the window back up.
3) Door window won't go up the last 10mm. This is likely to be the 'door open/closed microswitch' ( c ) stuck in the opposite sense to (2). The system thinks the door is still open, so won't allow the window to go back up. Note that in this case the door will still lock, but you may get a single-beep from the alarm horn.
4) Door will not lock with key. The 'key lock' microswitch (d) is broken. This is very rare, as this microswitch is hardly ever used – most times the car is locked by remote.
5) Door will not unlock with key. The 'key lock' microswitch (e) is broken. This is also very rare, for the same reason.
6) Door locks, and then immediately unlocks, usually accompanied by a double-beep from the alarm horn. This is the 'door locked' microswitch (f). The locking motor physically operates the door lock, but the microswitch to sense this has failed/stuck. The ACM promptly unlocks the car. In this case, the only way to lock the door is to use the emergency locking procedure. Turn the key in the door to the lock position and back three times in quick succession.
7) The door unlocks, but there is a beep from the alarm horn. This is the 'door unlocked' microswitch (g). Although the door is unlocked, the ACM has not recognised that. The alarm will not sound, as turning the key in the lock has deactivated it.
FIXES
The inside and outside handle microswitches are available separately, and are not too expensive. Although alternative equivalent switches may be available, the genuine Porsche switch comes with a connector and wiring, so it makes sense to use an original. Part Numbers:
Inside handle microswitch: 996.613.123.00 (Same both sides)
Outside handle microswitch: 996.613.125.00 (Left) / 996.613.126.00 (Right)
The door lock microswitches are not available separately. You have to buy the complete door lock assembly, at a cost of around $120. It has been known for people to repair the offending switch though. This is a picture of a typical failure of a 'door open/close' microswitch (courtesy of another RennTech member):
I didnt put this photo in as you already saw it on another posting..... It shows a broken switch unassembled in parts.
You can see that the plastic plunger has broken, jamming the switch lever inside. These switches are (apparently) made by Burgess, but as yet the source and part number is unknown. There are several other similar standard switches on the market for around $2, and people have stripped down the new switch and rebuilt the old one with the plunger from the new one.
OTHER SWITCHES IN THE ALARM SYSTEM
The other switches and contacts in the alarm system are to monitor the lid closures:
Front lid microswitch
Rear lid microswitch
Oddment compartment microswitch
Glove box microswitch
Radio contact (to detect radio theft)
An open compartment or switch failure will cause a single-beep of the alarm horn on locking. A system error will cause a double-beep.
Other elements of the system include an interior monitoring sensor (in the overhead lighting), an alarm readiness light (on the dashboard in the centre) and a central locking button (on the dashboard). Options are a tilt sensor (next to the battery or under the left hand seat) and an alarm siren (next to the the battery).
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,402
Likes: 10
From: Maryland
nice find! so it sounds like OP's problem, and mine most likely, is the (of course, most expensive) door lock mech which relates to 2c above. oh well, maybe i'll get around to replacing someday.