Palmbeacher

Paragonmotorclub.com is the site. Someone else on the forum checked with them recently and said were told they don't write warranties for 911 any more, but I would call or e-mail them and get it from the horse's mouth. Sometimes things will differ depending on the state where you live.

There is no specific requirement or mention of "dead engine coverage". My policy covers breakdowns of everything not specifically named on a list of exclusions, and nowhere is there any mention of the motor or IMS or anything remotely related to it on the exclusion list. What this policy requires to maintain it in force (for everything) is oil changes every 6mo/6000 miles. That's not a problem for me. I drive about 7K/yr, and I have the oil changed every 5 months just so they can't even try to suggest I went over the limit. TTBOMK all policies require that you stop the car as soon as you become aware of the trouble, and don't drive a car without oil. Since the oil dumps on the ground when the IMS lets go, my thought was that a warranty adjuster could claim the car was driven after the oil was out, and thus deny the claim. My service advisor (at the dealer) told me not to worry, because they have dealt with it before and explain to the adjuster that the oil dumps at the same time as the bearing fails. He said they've never had a claim denied, as they know how to talk to the adjusters.

All the negatives I've heard about extended warranties have come from the mouths of indie mechanics. Some indies just don't want to deal with the warranties, for whatever reason, and some of them have better innate people-skills than others. My Mercedes indie knows how to talk to the adjusters so the claims don't get denied, and has always gotten me coverage on my warranties. Service advisors at dealerships are all put through courses in people-skills. There is no such requirement for a mechanic who runs his own shop.

That said, the biggest single-repair claim I've ever had run through a warranty personally was about $1500, so don't quote me on engine replacements. I'm just going on what my service adviser told me was his and his fellow advisers' experiences. I certainly hope it doesn't happen to me, which is why in addition to the warranty I did get the LN retrofit done when I had my clutch replaced.

Don't forget, it's definitely in the best interest of the dealership or shop to convince the warranty adjuster to allow the claim, otherwise they might very well lose the job entirely. (I know I'd sell my 997 for parts and then go out and buy myself a year-old Mini with $20K rather than pay for a new M96 out of my pocket). What a shop might do to convince a baulking adjuster is not something I care about, nor to even speculate.

Neotorque

That's one reason I bought my extended warranty through my dealership. Not only does my dealer assure me that they've never had a claim denied, I assume it is the warranty company's long-term interest to stay on my dealer's good side, especially since he's part of a huge nationwide network.

Palmbeacher

I was thinking along those lines too, however my dealer sells Fidelity and there's that clause about not covering breakdowns caused by worn parts (vs defectively-manufactured parts) after 50K miles. That and the same policy term would have cost me over $8,000 at the dealer, which I got for $4600 through another company. The service adviser didn't even try to use your argument to convince me to go with the Fidelity, which frankly surprised me a little. The dealership doesn't pay commissions to the service advisers for selling customers on the warranties...not the way I'd do it if I owned the place

Neotorque

I bought Fidelity and I'm not worried about that clause for a number of reasons, not the least of which is my dealer's assurance. The specific always trumps the general, and that provision is so vague, general and meaningless that it would never be enforceable if they tried to use it to claim they didn't have to repair one of the specific parts they cover (something like IMS failure would be a defective part anyway). Moreover, based on all my research on Fidelity, it doesn't look like they're using it to try and screw people, they've got really excellent feedback just about everywhere.

Anyway, I sleep well with my Fidelity policy, and I'm glad you found one that works for you too!

utkinpol

intersting news, on web site they do not have anything about that.
i will check it out. just sent them email, will see what they respond.

it may be a problem as i see it - they do not have 60m/100K miles policies for 'used' cars at all, apparently. interesting.

Minok

The problem with these sorts of statistics, and there's a reason for the term "there are lies, then there are damned lies, and then there are statistics", is that it is very easy to forget the the populations involved.

The sampling of 400 997 owners is a very specific subset of all 997 owners with those cars. Those 400 in all likelihood don't represent a representative sampling of that model 997 owner/car experience. Those 400 are likely specific people that go to a specific website, are willing to participate in a poll, and by virtue of going to that website likely exhibit general driving styles that may not align with the actual total 997 owner population.

Until we know the real rate of a problem, it may well be a non-issue for Porsche. If a very small percentage of cars are affected and/or the cost of repairing the issue to the company vs the lost sales and reputation value doesn't make financial sense, then Porsche won't fix it on their dime. Its a very basic business decision. Given that Porsche just got listed #2 in quality behind Lexus on the news (NBC national newscast 2/15/2012), I'm wondering about the pervasiveness of the problem vs the statistics that lead to that particular quality ranking.

The point being that any poll only can possibly show statistics about the specific people that took the poll, and typically not the population you are actually trying to understand. Polling is very hard to do well, because of that.

Its why those news and political polls are so wildly unreliable too... they get answers only from those folks they telephone that 1) were at home 2) didnt' hang up and presumably 3) answered truthfully and completely and 4) were in the geographic regions they called... so not a general voter picture.

DreamCarrera

BINGO!!!

Although for some people here you may as well be talking to a wall when explaining this.

Zeus993

Any update?

sandwedge

I doubt the "real rate of the problem" will ever be officially declared. And yes, it is a basic business decision for Porsche to pretend it's non-issue since they know we'll keep buying their cars regardless of their arrogance.

Palmbeacher

My car was used (CPO was expiring) and my warranty is 72mo/75K (meaning, 75K total miles...car had 30K at the time, and I drive 7-7.5K/yr so that was perfect for me). I could have had a 60mo/100K for the same money, but longer time suited me more than higher mileage. This was a year ago, so YMMV. The warranty is called Tech Choice ULTIMATE.

Oh yeah, and if you go with them be sure to ask about payment plans...I think mine was a third up front and the rest in monthly installments over 18 months with no interest or added charges, automatically put on my credit card each month.

RollingArt

What a bummer. Looks like you're one of the unlucky ones.

Or are you one of the lucky ones? Having this happen while still under Porsche warranty is really quite fortunate. You'll now have a fresh motor in that 7 year old car. I'm almost jealous!

About the "997 IMS poll".
I believe the #'s are skewed to the high side of failure. If I recall correctly, two of the "I had IMS failures" in the poll where not even 997 owners, just burned Porsche owners looking for some place to vent. I think the percentage our poll came up with is way of.

That said, I'm beginning the LN IMS upgrade on my 2004 Boxster S today. The motor and transmission will both be coming out as I'll also be changing out the timing chains and their ramps. Also installing a motorsport air-oil separator. I'm getting ready to track the car and don't what any nasty surprises at the track. I'm very curious what condition the old bearing will be in when it comes out. I'm betting on excellent condition. The car has 65,000 miles.

Good luck with your new motor Lenelsa!

Neotorque

Amen. There were about a half million M96/M97 motors sold. A 6% failure rate, as in our poll, would mean 30,000 IMS failures. There would be a heck of a lot more reports about IMS failure on the web if there had been 30,000 failures, or anything remotely close to it.

That's not to say it isn't a real problem, or that it isn't awful for those who have them, just that the problem is extremely rare, despite what you might read here.

cibergypsy

I was told by a tech from my local dealer that they have a Panamera in for an engine replacement. It's not only our cars that can suffer from it. My dealer hasn't done a single engine replacement on a 997 since they came out, according to that tech. I guess it can happen, but the odds are it won't, imho.

LENELSA

I got the word from my Service Manager at Porsche yesterday.
My car will NOT be a repair.
It will be a replacement.

Zeus993

Well that's good news. I may have missed earlier postings on this but was it confirmed an IMS failure?