JJB236

Yeah... all the other guys with manual seats said the same. I wonder why they made the 997 manual seats go lower than the power. As some have logically commented, the absence of motor should make the manual seats go lower.

When I got my 996, the sales lady said that only the power seats can make the seats go low or lower. Can manual seats on 996 be lowered? Wonder if she lied.

Let me ask you 997 owners a question I was dying to ask. I am absolutely thrilled that there are so many Porsche enthusiasts out there to ask questions. But why aren't you guys out there enjoying your 997? I have a feeling most of the guys in here are married and don't go out much

Moderato

To get a CS2 or C4S has to be one of the hardest decisions.

Le Chef

Manual seats go lower because they don't have electric motors underneath them. It's a packaging issue.

I'm married and I'm on a plane every week so being home is something I enjoy. when I'm home I drive my car. Today however, we're recovering from snow and not going to visit family in Michigan, so I decided to cook my wife Cassoulet instead and offer up a wonderful bottle of '98 Corbieres as "thank you" for being tolerant of my schedule.

JJB236

Only for those who can afford the C4 S. C2S is already up there in the $95k range without tax.

Edgy01

As a long time Porsche owner/driver I absolutely can't see the reason for a 4. Porsche has tamed the "911" so well that 4WD is totally unnecessary. If you order the Carrera Sport wheels you will get the widest rear wheels/tires available on any 997, short of the GT3 and GT3RS. (They're even wider than those on the 997TT). (That's why I went with the XRR rims).

Le Chef

Quite honestly the real fun begins when your rear tires are narrower. Slightly less grip at the rear with a C2S makes the car slide a little more and that's when you "get it" and why a 911 is such an iconic sports car. I really don't think that you get even remotely close to appreciating that when you drive a C4/S. I didn't "get it" until I traded my 996 C4S for a 997 C2S and saw the light on a streaming wet road in Wisconsin.

Now if only I could find a 911 2.7RS...

Crazy Canuck

There is 4' of snow on the ground and it's stupid cold out. Spring is a month late.

Could have had the C4S. Could have had a 996 Turbo. Knew I wouldn't be driving it in the snow and in the rain the C2S is more than competent. It had nothing to do with $$$. The C2S in the rain is a pussycat compared to the 996GT3 - no traction control or PSM.

+1

MartyB

You probably wouldn't be the first guy to pay $8k for an inch and a half. If it means that much to you, go for it, but it does indeed sound like you are already hell bent on the wide body. Me personally, I opted for the lighter, slightly faster, and already drop dead hot C2S with a larger boot for considerably less $.

Moderato

How is a little extra weight in the front of a 997 a bad thing?

The Carrera 4 drive system is more about straight line traction on not only dry roads but also wet & winter roads as well as traction exiting turns. These things have to be beneficial otherwise it wouldn't put up similar numbers to the C2S on a wide variety of tracks.

A lot of people on these boards tout the everyday driveability of the 997, and AWD does make a better DD. I don't see how the benefits of a C2S over a C4S can be realized any where else then a track. So if your purpose of buying a 997 is to obtain the best DD on the planet then why not the AWD?

Moderato

The wide body C4 does look great and that's not the only thing you get for 8K.

Moderato

I don't think that anyone considering a 95K C2S would be concerned with another 8K for a C4S, so what do you mean????

Crazy Canuck

The physics of weight transfer comes into play when a vehicle is in motion and will muddy the benefits of AWD vs. RWD. All things being equal the C4S will be better on a wet road provided weight transfer is not ignored. Accelerating hard while trying to turn sharply overpowers the grip of the tires since a lot of weight has been transferred to the rear tires. AWD won't save you. Lift mid corner while driving with enthusiasm and AWD won't save you. PSM might but AWD won't. As for traction exiting turns, well if the car is accelerating weight has been transferred to the rear wheels to a large degree and the incremental benefit of AWD will be minimal. BTW, when driven with enthusiasm, 911s like constant throttle or slight acceleration through turns.

Provided the driver manages weight transfer properly (or at least doesn't do anything stupid) and has either braked to shift weight to the front wheels or is travelling at a constant speed AWD will pull the car around a corner. With some practice, weight transfer can be managed and it is astounding how capable these cars really are. It is enlightening.

If you are truly an enthusiast then learning to have fun by prompting and controlling the rear end slipping a bit is very enjoyable. This can be done during low speed driving. Controlling the weight transfer is the key.

I can see buying the 4S if you are driving in snow because getting going is the hard part. But, with all the weight over the drive wheels, and weight being transferred rearward under acceleration, provided the car has good winter tires, a C2S will be very competent. The key is the tires. A C4S driven on PS2s in the snow will not be as good as a C2S with proper snow tires. At that point, provided you have the space I'd get a CRV or somethign for the winter and drive a RWD Carrera S any day given the choice.

JFScheck

Holy Crap - I come back from Overseas - and look forwarding to logging onto Rennlist only to see this post?

Wow - whose hips are better - JayLo's before or after kids...

Come the "F" on...

;-)

Ucube

As others have already chimed in, you seemed well convinced on the C4S based on looks alone, so the pics would mostly be a trivial exercise. By your own admission, you don't really care for the AWD as much as its rear-end look, so it's your $8K, spend it if you want the extra 1.73".

rfedele

I have to agree. I think the C2/C2S provide more thrills. As I've said here before, I think we get caught up in the performance numbers and forget the joy of driving a porsche.

I've often made the C2 over C2S argument based on this reasoning.

We've gotten to the point that a base Corvette has 430+ hp, costs half of a C2S and will probably out perform it in most if not all subjective ways, but don't we all still want our P-car?

Back to the AWD vs RWD argument -we can all probably agree that generally the AWD improves performance (see Nissan GT-R), but I think it detracts from driving pleasure or at least excitement. Some of the joy of driving is being a bit scared by the car.

Just my 2 cents.