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All of the sudden it is very hard to get the car into 1st and reverse. For that matter, the shifter seems rough to get into every gear, in all gear albeit easier in higher gears. What is bizarre to me is that when the car is off, shifting through the gears feels perfectly normal. I'm sure there is an easy explanation to this, I just don't know it.
I will bring it into the shop, but figured the group would have some feedback.
I actually just picked the car up. Literally the first day I've owned it was yesterday, so I don't have a frame of reference. I bought it from my father who drove it to me yesterday and he said the condition just appeared. The car was just in the shop getting a once over.
I thought that the clutch pedal felt spongy, but again I don't have a frame of reference.
I actually just picked the car up. Literally the first day I've owned it was yesterday, so I don't have a frame of reference. I bought it from my father who drove it to me yesterday and he said the condition just appeared. The car was just in the shop getting a once over.
I thought that the clutch pedal felt spongy, but again I don't have a frame of reference.
At the risk of stating the obvious, go GET that frame of reference before worrying or taking it to the shop. You said you just bought it. Just take it easy and get to know the car first.
Check out this thread regarding the "1st gear jam". I am now getting it when I put the car into reverse. I believe the transmission is wearing out but these symptoms can be ameliorated with a change of fluid to what is spec'd in your manual. Read up on it here:
The "all of a sudden" gives us the big clue as to what is happening. Clutch disks wear slowly. It is not the disk; Slave /master cylinder can fail or leak and cause the affect noted because the clutch is not being completely dis-engaged . However this usually occurs over a period of time and gets worse. The #1 guess for you is the pressure plate has failed with a crack in the diapharm spring fingers. This results in instant/sudden problem with zero warning.
What is going on with your car is the clutch is not completely dis-engaging when you push the pedal down. With the engine running, the triple synchronizers on R, first and second gears will not let you shift into gear as that is their job. With the engine off, there is no rotation therefore the shifter will slide into any gear as it should. The pressure plate fails instantly and with no warning. When it does, some of the fingers collaspe and will not fully disenge the clutch. It is better to not drive the car as you can damage the flywheel with heat from the slipping clutch. When you get the car on a lift you will first check that the slave cylinder is working and it probably will be fine. the next step will be to pull the trans and you will find the pressure plate has collasped fingers on one side. Just get a Sachs clutch ,disk, pressure plate and throwout bearing and you will be back on the road, providing the flywheel is good. This is a very common failure on these cars .1 and ...2 . Interestingly enough, the failure is not related to the fancy self adjusting clutch mechanism built into the pressure plate, it is the big diaphram spring finger plate that cracks through. You will see this when you get the trans out. I just went through this on my 997.2 with 100,000 miles, 65,000 on the clutch. A good indy will do the job for $900 for a clutch kit and 4 hours labor.
Very common problem. Report back what you find.
Interestingly enough, the failure is not related to the fancy self adjusting clutch mechanism built into the pressure plate, it is the big diaphram spring finger plate that cracks through. You will see this when you get the trans out. I just went through this on my 997.2 with 100,000 miles, 65,000 on the clutch. A good indy will do the job for $900 for a clutch kit and 4 hours labor.
Very common problem. Report back what you find.
Just as a reference to the self adjusting clutch mechanism you mentioned FWIW. At around 40,000 miles on my previous -06 C4S the clutch started to get heavy. It kept getting heavier and heavier with miles and I've been told this is the result of the self adjustment.
The adjustment worked though. At least on my car. No problems shifting into any gears. Just a heavier and heavier clutch pedal. That was all. Traded the car in this condition. The dealer didn't even drive the car. Just went around it with a paint meter but I'm pretty sure that clutch was on its last leg. Again, very heavy at the time of the trade but working perfectly.
A manual transmission car shifting easily when off, but difficult when running is a classic sign of incomplete clutch disengagement. My guess is that your clutch slave is failing and the fluid pressure is not moving the discs the proper distance as the fluid leaks by the internal seal. It's located abotlve the transmission. You could first try bleeding it but if it happened all of the sudden that likely won't do anything.
F1Kevin What timing for your Dad (ggod,maybe) and for you -bad. As I stated above, the problem will typically be the pressure plate failure. Your symptoms are 100% of this type of failure. Which model 997 do you have and what milage on the clutch?
The first thing that you will check is the clutch slave cylinder as Petza9144 says as it is easy to check when on a lift. The plastic slave actually has a long life as long as the rubber boot has not been damaged ,allowing dirt to get in. It will probably be just fine ,clean and dry. The next step is to pull the gearbox . The plastic throwout bearing will be fine as they look cheap but have a very good service life. Also the release fork could fail but they have a good history behaving forever. However, on looking at the pressure plate fingers you will probably see some are collapsed as shown on the attached picture. The pic is not mine but lifted from another post. In my case 100,000 miles (Yipee!) the clutch assembly had 60,000 miles when the failure occured just like yours. Slave looked great. throwout bearing good but with expected amount of wear. Clutch disc with about 40% wear but very good. Flywheel good , no glazing heat checks burn marks etc. Pressure plate surface had heat spots (discoloring) on one side This was due to the dragging clutch during the short period of time that the failure occurred and before I figured out the problem. The release fingers looked exactly like the pic shown. Very common problem on these cars. Since mine is a late 997.2 (2011) there was no reason to replace the RMS as it was dry and good. Also flywheel was perfect and slave cylinder dry and happy. No replacemnent needed. New Sachs clutch kit and back on the road .
Let us know what you find. It just happens, cannot predict or inspect or maintain against this type of failure. I still had 60+ % of wear surface left when it let go. However you can still rib Dad for it. Diaphram spring finger plate crack failure allows some fingers to collaspe thus not being able to disengage the clutch completely. Fingers are not all at same height. Do not drive if possible to avoid other damage.
F1Kevin What timing for your Dad (ggod,maybe) and for you -bad. As I stated above, the problem will typically be the pressure plate failure. Your symptoms are 100% of this type of failure. Which model 997 do you have and what milage on the clutch?
The first thing that you will check is the clutch slave cylinder as Petza9144 says as it is easy to check when on a lift. The plastic slave actually has a long life as long as the rubber boot has not been damaged ,allowing dirt to get in. It will probably be just fine ,clean and dry. The next step is to pull the gearbox . The plastic throwout bearing will be fine as they look cheap but have a very good service life. Also the release fork could fail but they have a good history behaving forever. However, on looking at the pressure plate fingers you will probably see some are collapsed as shown on the attached picture. The pic is not mine but lifted from another post. In my case 100,000 miles (Yipee!) the clutch assembly had 60,000 miles when the failure occured just like yours. Slave looked great. throwout bearing good but with expected amount of wear. Clutch disc with about 40% wear but very good. Flywheel good , no glazing heat checks burn marks etc. Pressure plate surface had heat spots (discoloring) on one side This was due to the dragging clutch during the short period of time that the failure occurred and before I figured out the problem. The release fingers looked exactly like the pic shown. Very common problem on these cars. Since mine is a late 997.2 (2011) there was no reason to replace the RMS as it was dry and good. Also flywheel was perfect and slave cylinder dry and happy. No replacemnent needed. New Sachs clutch kit and back on the road .
Let us know what you find. It just happens, cannot predict or inspect or maintain against this type of failure. I still had 60+ % of wear surface left when it let go. However you can still rib Dad for it. Diaphram spring finger plate crack failure allows some fingers to collaspe thus not being able to disengage the clutch completely. Fingers are not all at same height. Do not drive if possible to avoid other damage.
It's a Carrera s. 40,000 mi on the car, my dad is very easy on cars.
Luckily car hasn't been driven much since this issue popped up.
You mentioned the RMS, should I just do that while I'm in there?
Really appreciate your detailed post, and feedback from all others. I will reply with an update once it goes in the shop.
Mine experienced the same fate the year before last with the pressure plate also on the left side of the pic ... The good news was did the master / slave at the same time and now the clutch is better than ever.
F1Kevin; what year /series is your car? If it is 2009 to 2011/12 then you have a 997.2 and there is no need to do anything to the rear main seal unless there is evidence of leakage ( there won't be, it will be dry). If you car is before 2009 then you will have the 997.1 series issue to deal with as to the RMS and the dreaded IMS. issue. It just depends on which series your car is. Report back on what year.
F1Kevin; what year /series is your car? If it is 2009 to 2011/12 then you have a 997.2 and there is no need to do anything to the rear main seal unless there is evidence of leakage ( there won't be, it will be dry). If you car is before 2009 then you will have the 997.1 series issue to deal with as to the RMS and the dreaded IMS. issue. It just depends on which series your car is. Report back on what year.
Sorry, should have provided this info from the beginning. It's a 2007.
F1Kevin; You have a 997.1 car . Being a later .1, you have the bigger IMS bearing. As to the RMS , you should check it for leakage when the trans is out. Others with .1 experience will have wisdom on this matter. My world is limited to .2 generation.
Update. Took me a while to get an appointment at the local shop that specializes in Porsches. Clutch started slipping on the way there. What should I expect to pay for a clutch replacement parts and labor?
11-25-2021, 08:27 AM
Shifter/Transmission issue
