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Any chance you can drop the sump at your house? That will give you a clear view of the bottom of the cylinders and might paint a more accurate picture of what is going on. According to the experts, that is where scoring begins.
I suspect most, if not all of our cars with 30k or 40k plus miles have some degree of "streaking" or "scuffing", but full on scoring is hard to miss if you're looking at the cylinder from the bottom with the sump removed.
Yes, depending on how the filter looks I will likely be doing that next.
Regardless of how the filter looks, you should be doing that anyway I'd assume ...
I agree with this. Based on what you've found thus far, or haven't found, I don't think cutting open the oil filter will tell you much more than having a look at the used oil itself, which you've already done.
I'm wishing you the best and hoping it's not scoring. Best of luck.
Regardless of how the filter looks, you should be doing that anyway I'd assume ...
Not necessarily. If there were bits of chain guide material that would point me in something timing chain related. At that point scoping the cylinders could only serve to add more confusion as I might see light streaking or something that is inconclusive. Heading there now and will update with pics.
Not much of anything. The filter pleats were clean, some tinny aluminum/black flakes in what we drained, but hardly anything notable given the sound it makes. Next step is to drop the pan and look for debris/scope the cylinders.
Not much of anything. The filter pleats were clean, some tinny aluminum/black flakes in what we drained, but hardly anything notable given the sound it makes. Next step is to drop the pan and look for debris/scope the cylinders.
Black flakes are tensioner pad plastic. Did you send a sample for UOA?
Black flakes are tensioner pad plastic. Did you send a sample for UOA?
Well they are more like sand size specs. I haven’t sent it off yet but will tomorrow. For reference that is the bottom of like a sour cream type container.
Part of me is thinking of pouring back in the 2qts drained (new oil of course)and tossing on a filter and running it to try to look at some stuff with the Durametric, before jumping right to dropping the pan. Would a bad tensioner show in the cam deviations?
Well they are more like sand size specs. I haven’t sent it off yet but will tomorrow. For reference that is the bottom of like a sour cream type container.
Part of me is thinking of pouring back in the 2qts drained (new oil of course)and tossing on a filter and running it to try to look at some stuff with the Durametric, before jumping right to dropping the pan. Would a bad tensioner show in the cam deviations?
Yes, it should. The deviation should be too large and not stable. A tensioner can still be bad (bleeding out pressure and have a weak spring) and not show bad readings, but it will kill the motor on longer term cold starts. That rattling sound you describe on cold start is textbook bad tensioner and I would have replaced all 3 of them after the first time you heard that noise. I just changed all mine proactively at 59,000 miles. The IMS and Bank 1 ones are very easy. Bank 2 requires removal of the A/C compressor - not hard, just more work.
I have had these kind of noises after taking the car out of winter hibernation, coming from bank 1, goes away after driving awhile, so might be a lifter.
Tossed 2.5 qts back in, 1 of which was Castrol 5W40 since I only had 1.5 qts of DT40. Put a new filter on. I could only get the Wix 51042XP for the spin on which is actually noted to be a tighter filter material by LN and therefore not really recommended. Not that I think mixing the oils and a tighter filter will cause any issues for just a short period of time or could contribute to my observations, but felt it important to note.
The sound was definitely present on initial startup and when it idled down. I turned the car off to plug in the Durametric and upon restarting it completely went away and sounded normal.
Cam deviation is -.0313 bank 1 and .7813 bank 2, which I think is about where it was a couple years ago. Looking at the nominal values and actual on the cam angles they track really well. Looking at roughness values there was nothing notable. I did pick up 1 misfire in cylinder 2 which is the area where the sound seemed to come from when I was hearing it, but 1 misfire isn’t much to really note IMO.
So basically the sound is gone, no real explanation other than a couple qts of fresh oil and fresh filter. This leads me to think that it is oil/oil pressure related and possibly a tensioner although I think a scored cylinder could possibly change with a newer oil. I am going to actually go drive it easily which will be the first time since the sound occurred and see how the car runs (before it ran poorly). From there I think it is probably best to drop the pan and take a look around with my camera that arrived yesterday.
Some positive news, though I wouldn't have mixed the oil types.
Keep us posted.
Yeah it won’t be ran long this way.
Took it for a drive, zero noise. However, I got a noticeable stutter again at around 2k, like
it was running out of fuel. Unfortunately my computer battery is dead so I wasn’t logging and couldn’t see what it was. I was not able to replicate it with several attempts made. Upon return there are zero codes or pending codes.
I really don’t think this is scoring and my fear of dropping the pan and scoping is some type of
an inconclusive observation, I just think that is the next logical step though. If there doesn’t seem
to be a smoking gun I think I will order all new tensioners and go that route.
So I dropped the pan and the only thing is this one small piece of magnetic metal. It is really shiny on one side like it is plated or it wears on something. Dull on the side that seems to have broken away. Possibly the tip of a tensioner?
08-06-2021, 12:33 PM
