997.2 3.8 Engine Failure
01-17-2019, 09:33 PM
#136
Few months ago my wife's car (Nissan) was making clunky metallic noise, especially when cold, she brought it to transmission shop then another mechanic who both said 99.9% transmission/clutch whatever was shot. I chimed in and said ok let me check the engine oil just so...you know...only to find out there was almost none in there. Filled up, problem fixed and case closed. I mean me neither I don't get it, between the clueless OP swapping parts at random and people "selling" full on engine rebuild it's just insane.
The path taken by OP from the very beginning should have been corrected promptly by no nonsense advice. Whatever sound that is of serious concern means that you have the car towed to a reputable shop for inspection immediately period. Digging on your own with zero clues of what is going on is not the right path.
01-17-2019, 09:41 PM
#137
Intermediate
I don't know why you ROFL really. My wife didn't dig into her car but brought it directly to a shop, after which she reported the "experts" results to me to assess. I assessed by "dipsticking" and fixed the problem by putting oil in the engine. You see even my wife goes straight to the shop, after that it's another story. True story by the way.
01-17-2019, 09:52 PM
#138
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I don't know why you ROFL really. My wife didn't dig into her car but brought it directly to a shop, after which she reported the "experts" results to me to assess. I assessed by "dipsticking" and fixed the problem by putting oil in the engine. You see even my wife goes straight to the shop, after that it's another story. True story by the way.
01-17-2019, 09:59 PM
#139
No his wife owns a Nissan Juke and SHE took it to the mechanic. Had it been his Juke he would have but damn oil in it, but she can’t do anything right!
01-17-2019, 10:20 PM
#140
Rennlist Member
You know i'd like to know what all of you critics would have done differently and be specific. Bronz there are a lot worse things - spending $30k-50k on a child failing out of college the first year or having to spend the same $ on a child's rehab or health issues, or having your prostrate removed and having a heart attack and having seven stents put in your late 50's in the same year(good friends of mine) . If Raby rebuilds add some power and upgrades, it stinks having to spend the money if that what it comes down to but at the end of the day you can fix this -some things in life are irreparable. And you can go to sleep at night dreaming about that new FLAT 6 vastly improved engine. Just my 2 cents.
Honey, I may need a new motor. Thats bad news dear.
Good news is the new motor will be bad ***.
Last October when I asked Jake to build my aircooled motor his schedule required a 12 month down time for the build. Didnt want to wait that long so it went to another shop. We are four months into the build and near completion.
Good luck. As much as we all hope its not a full rebuild and we are rooting for ya, based what you have shared so far prepare yourself.
01-17-2019, 10:55 PM
#141
Rennlist Member
Looks like the OP's car is for sale on The "New Vehicle Marketplace" - $30K asking price.
Best color too
If it was a manual transmission I'd pay $25K for it
I figure that's the market considering having to ship it and a car with rebuilt engine seems to depreciate a bit more than stock engine example.
Best color too
If it was a manual transmission I'd pay $25K for it
I figure that's the market considering having to ship it and a car with rebuilt engine seems to depreciate a bit more than stock engine example.
01-18-2019, 12:07 AM
#142
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Couldnt have said it better. This is literally first world problem we are talking about. Oh no the engine in my Porsche blew up. Im happy to be alive, not disabled and well. Initially i was a bit sad that it kind of happened unexpectadely but so do a lot of other things in life happen unexpectedly, like my dad and brother getting cancer(thankfully both caught it early and got it treated in time) Even if it does need a rebuild and i need to shell out the 30k its alright ill make more money its not that big of a deal. Some things are unreparable like you said and this isnt one of them. I dont know why are some of these guys so worried how i spend my money.
Thank you, thats how i look at it hopefully it gets fixed for a lot less than full rebuild, but if it does need a rebuild ill have a badass engine that i can have fun with.
Jake quoted me 2-3months if its fixable and 8 months if it needs full rebuild. I know its a long time but i have ways to keep myself busy and i have other car to drive so no biggie there.
Sure is 
Care to elaborate why in your opinion cars with rebuilt engines would depreciate faster? I understand if its some unknown shop down the street who performed the work. If the work is done by one of the best, i would think it would strenghten the cars value as the motor would have less miles with upgraded parts. Just my opinion of course.
You know i'd like to know what all of you critics would have done differently and be specific. Bronz there are a lot worse things - spending $30k-50k on a child failing out of college the first year or having to spend the same $ on a child's rehab or health issues, or having your prostrate removed and having a heart attack and having seven stents put in your late 50's in the same year(good friends of mine) . If Raby rebuilds add some power and upgrades, it stinks having to spend the money if that what it comes down to but at the end of the day you can fix this -some things in life are irreparable. And you can go to sleep at night dreaming about that new FLAT 6 vastly improved engine. Just my 2 cents.
Jake quoted me 2-3months if its fixable and 8 months if it needs full rebuild. I know its a long time but i have ways to keep myself busy and i have other car to drive so no biggie there.
Good news bad news.
Honey, I may need a new motor. Thats bad news dear.
Good news is the new motor will be bad ***.
Last October when I asked Jake to build my aircooled motor his schedule required a 12 month down time for the build. Didnt want to wait that long so it went to another shop. We are four months into the build and near completion.
Good luck. As much as we all hope its not a full rebuild and we are rooting for ya, based what you have shared so far prepare yourself.
Honey, I may need a new motor. Thats bad news dear.
Good news is the new motor will be bad ***.
Last October when I asked Jake to build my aircooled motor his schedule required a 12 month down time for the build. Didnt want to wait that long so it went to another shop. We are four months into the build and near completion.
Good luck. As much as we all hope its not a full rebuild and we are rooting for ya, based what you have shared so far prepare yourself.
Care to elaborate why in your opinion cars with rebuilt engines would depreciate faster? I understand if its some unknown shop down the street who performed the work. If the work is done by one of the best, i would think it would strenghten the cars value as the motor would have less miles with upgraded parts. Just my opinion of course.Looks like the OP's car is for sale on The "New Vehicle Marketplace" - $30K asking price.
Best color too
If it was a manual transmission I'd pay $25K for it
I figure that's the market considering having to ship it and a car with rebuilt engine seems to depreciate a bit more than stock engine example.
Best color too
If it was a manual transmission I'd pay $25K for it
I figure that's the market considering having to ship it and a car with rebuilt engine seems to depreciate a bit more than stock engine example.
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Robocop305 (12-05-2020)
01-18-2019, 02:47 AM
#143
Drifting
I guess my fault for using a term rebuild. Jake spent over an hour with me on the phone talking about different scenarios. Of course we will start with diagnosing the problem and if theres possibility of repairing it for significantly less we will go that route. I just dont want to spend the time towing around the car to a shop to borescope it and then still find out we have internal problem we kind of know that we do. The car is making loud banging noise and shedding metal. I would just rather have a car at a shop that i would want to rebuild my engine because it most likely will need it, instead of having some shop take it apart and then still have to send it out in pieces.
I fully understand that there is a high probability that something internal is fubar, but it would drive me crazy to not know exactly what went wrong before I committed to a full rebuild. I'm glad there is more method here than i assumed from earlier posts in the thread.
i am very curious about what you find when the engine is looked at. Please post the findings.
01-18-2019, 12:08 PM
#144
That makes a lot more sense. I jumped to the conclusion that you were going to Jake Raby for a rebuild without even attempting to find out the cause of the noise and metal filings. I'm glad they are investigating the cause first.
I fully understand that there is a high probability that something internal is fubar, but it would drive me crazy to not know exactly what went wrong before I committed to a full rebuild. I'm glad there is more method here than i assumed from earlier posts in the thread.
i am very curious about what you find when the engine is looked at. Please post the findings.
I fully understand that there is a high probability that something internal is fubar, but it would drive me crazy to not know exactly what went wrong before I committed to a full rebuild. I'm glad there is more method here than i assumed from earlier posts in the thread.
i am very curious about what you find when the engine is looked at. Please post the findings.
I think there is some ambiguity regarding what is considered a "rebuild". Any time an engine is apart there's some components that can't be reused, some that could be reused but are best replaced "while you're in there", and some that will be reused if at all possible. More likely than not in this case, determining the root cause with reasonable certainty will require at least removing the heads. Taking the engine completely apart is only about 15% more work at that point. Depending on where you draw the line for "rebuild" most of us might be talking about the same thing.
01-18-2019, 12:21 PM
#145
That makes a lot more sense. I jumped to the conclusion that you were going to Jake Raby for a rebuild without even attempting to find out the cause of the noise and metal filings. I'm glad they are investigating the cause first.
I fully understand that there is a high probability that something internal is fubar, but it would drive me crazy to not know exactly what went wrong before I committed to a full rebuild. I'm glad there is more method here than i assumed from earlier posts in the thread.
i am very curious about what you find when the engine is looked at. Please post the findings.
I fully understand that there is a high probability that something internal is fubar, but it would drive me crazy to not know exactly what went wrong before I committed to a full rebuild. I'm glad there is more method here than i assumed from earlier posts in the thread.
i am very curious about what you find when the engine is looked at. Please post the findings.
Looking forward to hearing exactly what the internal problem was and then the decided upon solution.
Good luck. Keep in touch.
01-18-2019, 01:04 PM
#146
Drifting
Pdople using the term "rebuild" very loosely is one of my pet peeves. Years of buying and selling old cars has made me naturally skeptical of what many people call a rebuild.
On the Fords I am familiar with, a rebuild consists of a complete teardown and ar the very least, machined bores, new valves, seats, guides, lifters, push rods, piston rings, bearings, plus a whole lot more. Anything less is just fixing a problem, not a rebuild.
On the Fords I am familiar with, a rebuild consists of a complete teardown and ar the very least, machined bores, new valves, seats, guides, lifters, push rods, piston rings, bearings, plus a whole lot more. Anything less is just fixing a problem, not a rebuild.
01-18-2019, 02:00 PM
#147
Rennlist Member
"Sure is Care to elaborate why in your opinion cars with rebuilt engines would depreciate faster? I understand if its some unknown shop down the street who performed the work. If the work is done by one of the best, i would think it would strenghten the cars value as the motor would have less miles with upgraded parts. Just my opinion of course."
---> First of all I was sorry to hear your engine had issues. I think you are taking all of this very well and handled the negative BS just fine.
My comment regarding a rebuilt engine depreciating the value compared with same car with same miles with original engine---> Many Porsche buyers especially newbies become alarmed whenever the term "rebuilt" is used with these water cooled cars. The opposite of rebuilt engines in air-cooled cars which usually fetch more money and are more desirable from a buyers standpoint unless it is a collectible original low mile example.
I've found that water cooled cars retain a certain stigma if they are rebuilt. Why?.... Many buyers unaware of what the initial issue was with engine, what exactly was done when rebuilt, quality of parts used, machine shop used, completion work/etc..I have found this even with cars that have had rebuilt engines from the dealer with full service records. *I think you could make the same comparison with cars that have had minor accidents that were repaired at the best shops in town. They look absolutely perfect, paint id perfect match but there is still a bit of a depreciation no matter how well you tell the story.(My current car has had minor rear bumper accident and I know I'll get a few $thousand less than same example with no accident even though my car looks perfect and all work has been inspected by dealer during my PPI)
However, water cooled (996/997) factory crate engine replacements with full service records from dealer hold their cars value but really don't increase it's value. I know this may seem odd but it is what I have found and I think seasoned Porsche owners would agree.
In the 50 or so Porsche's I've shopped for and owned over the past 40 years, these are my observations. I've owned 3 996 C4S's and an 05 997S in past 6 years and have seen many different examples of cars with rebuilt engines and follow the market closely. I searched hi and low for my current 2007 997C4S and looked at a couple with rebuilt engines - One was advertized as rebuilt but I came to find out after researching it that the engine was a junkyard replacement.
Personally I wouldn't buy a water cooled car with rebuilt engine. Just like I wouldn't buy a 997 with +100K miles. I'm all about resale because I usually upgrade my car every year or so.
I also don't buy cars with aftermarket body parts/wheels/etc and prefer manual transmission - Just my preference.
I think you have a solid $25K roller and will make someone very happy for right fit.
My opinions, my thoughts on subject - No more, no less.
Good luck with your sale - Great color combo!!!
Care to elaborate why in your opinion cars with rebuilt engines would depreciate faster? I understand if its some unknown shop down the street who performed the work. If the work is done by one of the best, i would think it would strenghten the cars value as the motor would have less miles with upgraded parts. Just my opinion of course."---> First of all I was sorry to hear your engine had issues. I think you are taking all of this very well and handled the negative BS just fine.
My comment regarding a rebuilt engine depreciating the value compared with same car with same miles with original engine---> Many Porsche buyers especially newbies become alarmed whenever the term "rebuilt" is used with these water cooled cars. The opposite of rebuilt engines in air-cooled cars which usually fetch more money and are more desirable from a buyers standpoint unless it is a collectible original low mile example.
I've found that water cooled cars retain a certain stigma if they are rebuilt. Why?.... Many buyers unaware of what the initial issue was with engine, what exactly was done when rebuilt, quality of parts used, machine shop used, completion work/etc..I have found this even with cars that have had rebuilt engines from the dealer with full service records. *I think you could make the same comparison with cars that have had minor accidents that were repaired at the best shops in town. They look absolutely perfect, paint id perfect match but there is still a bit of a depreciation no matter how well you tell the story.(My current car has had minor rear bumper accident and I know I'll get a few $thousand less than same example with no accident even though my car looks perfect and all work has been inspected by dealer during my PPI)
However, water cooled (996/997) factory crate engine replacements with full service records from dealer hold their cars value but really don't increase it's value. I know this may seem odd but it is what I have found and I think seasoned Porsche owners would agree.
In the 50 or so Porsche's I've shopped for and owned over the past 40 years, these are my observations. I've owned 3 996 C4S's and an 05 997S in past 6 years and have seen many different examples of cars with rebuilt engines and follow the market closely. I searched hi and low for my current 2007 997C4S and looked at a couple with rebuilt engines - One was advertized as rebuilt but I came to find out after researching it that the engine was a junkyard replacement.
Personally I wouldn't buy a water cooled car with rebuilt engine. Just like I wouldn't buy a 997 with +100K miles. I'm all about resale because I usually upgrade my car every year or so.
I also don't buy cars with aftermarket body parts/wheels/etc and prefer manual transmission - Just my preference.
I think you have a solid $25K roller and will make someone very happy for right fit.
My opinions, my thoughts on subject - No more, no less.
Good luck with your sale - Great color combo!!!
The following 2 users liked this post by Mike Murphy:
NAMR6MT (05-17-2020),
Robocop305 (12-05-2020)
01-18-2019, 03:32 PM
#149
Instructor
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Robocop305 (12-05-2020)
01-19-2019, 02:03 AM
#150
So sorry to hear this is the outcome.
I commend your perspective. I'm sure you've gone through a wide range of emotions, but in the end, it is just a car.
As a 997.2 owner, I am genuinely curious why this happened and will continue to follow. Hopefully the rebuilder will share a full postmortem and root cause analisys.
I commend your perspective. I'm sure you've gone through a wide range of emotions, but in the end, it is just a car.
As a 997.2 owner, I am genuinely curious why this happened and will continue to follow. Hopefully the rebuilder will share a full postmortem and root cause analisys.