John D II

Which is the better choice for a 6-point harness?
Pull up or pull down style - which is preferable?
Note: To be used with TE roll bar and GT3 seats.

Garey Cooper

John, as I DON'T have GT-3 seats I'm not sure my comments are going to apply. But on my stock sports seats I use the Schroth belts and they are pull down to tighten. I think now ordering pull down was a mistake and I should have ordered pull-up. You just run out of adjustment that you can get trying to pull down; and there is little room to manipulate them in that direction.

I use the Brey Krause seat hardware, which has been very good. I also have the Brey Krause seatbelt harness holder.

A minor point on the stock seats. The shoulder harnesess tend to spread across your shoulders as they go around the outside of the headrest and don't feed through openings to hold them in place like they do on the GT-3 seats. I have had made a little webbing strap that I put between the sholder harnesses at about sternum level to keep them closer together across my chest.

I do not use a submarine belt. I can't figure how to mount it with the stock seats.

Interesting side note; I flew (as a passenger) in a stunt/aerobatics plane a couple of years ago. The harnesses were six point and the lap belts were tightened up by ratchet! In the air in an outside loop I really appreciated that!

John D II

Thanks, Garey. I'm not sure which to choose. Some say the pull down is better and some say get the pull up.

Would this piece help you mount the sub. It bolts under the sliders using the factory holes/bolts.

Geoffrey

Schroth pull up are the way to go. Also, get the 2" lap belt.

Mikelly

I've just installed the BK Harness mounts, sub mount, the DAS Sport bar, and some Gforce harnesses. I'd consider Teamtech Harnesses over the two you've mentioned. They are more expensive, but are a better solution than any harness I've seen. My car came with harnesses that I'd never use in a car, but hey the previous owner did what he thought was best... I'm planning to use a HANS device, along with an OMG fire suit, Puma shoes, Simpson gloves, and Gforce underwear. The schroth and Sabelts, although not bad choices, are no comparison to the Teamtechs. I'm working on another guys car in my shop right now and the fit and finish of the Teamtechs are just FAR superior.

I've also got the GT3 RSR Seats in my car, which is similar to what you have.
Mike

John D II

Mike,

I went to the TEAMTECH website and must say...they look like serious belts. Which model do you prefer?

Woodster

Mikelly,
we need pics of your interior, sounds fab!

Marty

Turbohead

Hi John,

If you plan on usuing a Hans device (and you should) consider the width of the belts since some are not easy to put on the collor ridge of the hans. I have used simpson,HR, those are pull down and seem to work well.
Regards,
BTW how are the new mods?

Elliot

John D II

Hi Elliot,

Thanks for the sound advice. Actually, I do intend to use a H&N restraint, but I was leaning toward the R3. Any comment on R3 vs. Hans?

The car is in the middle of the upgrade now - it will be another two weeks or so before I pick it up and drive it. Just last week I decided to add the fuel system (dual pumps and larger injectors), since the motor is out. That said, it is taking a little longer than originally planned.

How are your new mods working out? I heard those new turbos you got are really fast

Geoffrey

The R3 relies on a strap against your chest area for support. That is soft tissue and in a high G impact, it is not clear how much damage will be done. The HANs works with the friction of the belts against the HANs device and as the belts stetch and your body moves forward, the HANs device does not which is what keeps the helmet taught. I personally would not use anything other than a HANs device.

Turbohead

Hey John,
I don't know much about the R-3 ,but most of the guys in our chapter use the Hans. both I and my son has use it and I do do feel more confident with it. It is a good system and the testing video was very impressive. They say that in a frontal crash there is 1100lbs of force of a helmeted head going forward pressure on your neck which the Hans will absorb.

I know how it goes with the mods taking longer than they are supposed to. (been there and still there!)

Trying to complete the EFI conversion on my 965 (just needs final tuning for the Haltec engine Mgt. system. ) So I havn't installed those super fast turbos on the 996 TT........ Still collecting more parts, I got a v flow, bigger intercoolers, still looking for stock headers to port, and i'll do the clutch at the same time.

Elliot

Garey Cooper

John, again I want to say I don't have the gt-3 seats; but the pull-up lap belts are easy to grab by the tab and pull against. The pull down type that I have tried to use more or less make you use the hand on the side that you want to adjust and in a limited space do the adjustment......just an observation and both types would certainly work.

On the sub bar, I don't think it works with stock seats? I think they must be gt-3 types and the sub bar works very well.

Last note; I've seen the teamtech and they look very good. It also looks like you can get them with a sternum strap which would help my problem a lot.

ltc

Just about every available H&N restraint (HANS, ISAAC, R3, Hutchens, Hutchens, Hutchens Hybrid, Hutchens II Pro, D-cel, Wright, Leatt, et. al.) have been discussed in this forum, usually in fairly good detail.
A search for any of these names, or SFI 38.1, should provide additional detail.
In the end, you can always just go with HANS, as it's pretty much the Microsoft of the H&N world.

FWIW, I ran a TeamTech Rampac harness http://www.teamtechmotorsports.com/r...ss/rampac.html and liked it a lot. However, I do prefer my current Schroth Titanium Hybrid II harness http://www.schrothracing.com/products/competition/1593 especially for lower body comfort.

John D II

Thanks for the information. I have read all the archives and remain undecided as to which device to choose - I was going to go R3, but I am now considering just going the microsoft route...

ltc

John,
Have you read these documents yet:
http://www.schroth.com/installation-.../en/index.html
and
http://english.schroth.com/racing/pr...d=67&id_kat1=2

For example, the ISAAC is far less 'sensitive' to belt geometries and terminations. One of the developers, rennlist member Gregg Baker (gbaker) is very helpful in checking your setup for correct installation. He's a good engineer and resource IMHO.

The HANS has some very specific requirements regarding belt geometries, termination spacing/distance, et.
I don't know what your interior is (seats, rollcage/bar, etc) so another H&N restraint MAY be a better option than the HANS.
You can actually render the HANS ineffective (or worse) by having incorrect/compromised belt geometries.