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What a shame this car wasn't left alone. He'd pull $35K and them some if it had been.
"This is one of around 3400 cars built in 1998 on the same production line as the last of the air cooled 993’s. This car has no electronic drivers aides, no drive by wire on this car!"
Us 996.1 owners with eGas throttles are tired of the mythology surrounding the unicorn 99s.
1) Yes, eGas cars need a tune or other 'fix' if rev matching and double DE-clutching and heel n toe are to be utilized. For me, this matters, because Sportscar. So I have an easily reversible tune, by a reputable vendor.
2) Let's address 'electronic driver aids'. Porsche PSM is easily disabled. By default if you turn it off, the first time you touch the brake it enables again. You can defeat this, but why? The PSM won't activate until your slip angles are WAY beyond most drivers courage and abilities. Certainly if you manage to activate PSM on public roads, your next ride (or someone else's) will be in an ambulance or worse. Or your car will be on a wrecker....
ABS is on ALL 996s. Thank God say most, ABS is and was a requirement by USA DOT and Bosch did a great job with it.
Now, if you're 996.x, any year, has LSD, then that adds value. Otherwise, this mythos about the lack of driver aids' has to stop. It's like a Rennlist minority cult. Maybe the admins should open a dedicated forum for the elitists? Just a thought.
Last bit of common sense here. The early 996.1 cars were 'built on the same assembly line' as the much vaunted 993. Huh? The 996 and it's predecessor don't share a single part. I would bet this started as some form of 993 jealousy and spread like herpes through Rennlist. If you want a 993, buy one. But they're not great value. If you're rich it doesn't matter, but all 911s are better than their predecessor. Objectively. Or Porsche is selling us all snakeoil.
Now, if your early .1 has LSD and x51...oh, wait! X51 was never optioned on US 3.4L cars. Sorry '99 fans...
The '99 is the best story needs to end at some point. You might as well be saying 'the 99 is so great, because Ferry Porsche died in March 1998, (RIP) and all 911s got steadily worse after that'. Sheesh.
/rant
Put me in the first group! (with the proviso that my 911 is the only 911 that I have driven, aside from a quick spin around the block in a G-body cab and a ride-along in a 996.2 with tasty mods but a sketchy history and presentation).
That being said, the early 99's do have some things to recommend them and make them unique, like lightest weight, availability of an LSD, the cable throttle, ambers, and a few more things. The 4-spoke steering wheel and the GT3-style 4-speaker/no amp stereo that many early cars were equipped with may seem like demerits, but again make the car different in some way.
My policy is appreciate those things in my 4/98 car (except the ambers which a PO sadly discarded) while also seeing the good in other 996 model years and variants.
the early cars are better. buddy is about sell his though (kid on the way, never drives it). 1999, 72k miles, manual, savannah interior. ping me and I'll forward you on if you're interested
[QUOTE=damage98MO;19012322]"This is one of around 3400 cars built in 1998 on the same production line as the last of the air cooled 993’s./QUOTE]
This quote by far is the biggest myth being perpetuated around "early build" 996's. Porsche had assembled and shipped roughly 2K 996's in MY97 to the ROW market, and my research puts total production before the so-called "once in a lifetime" production cutoff date of 8/98 somewhere around 10-12K total cars shipped. As for the 996 being built on the same production line as the 993...spoiler alert...there is (and has only ever been) one 911 production line since the the 911 was first produced in 1964. If this 993/996 statement holds any water, then I guess the early 986's produced on the exact same line have some magic pixie dust sprinkled on them too? Gosh, those poor early model 986 owners are not getting all the attention they deserve because the hands of some factory labourer who put the arm rest in a 993 touched your Boxster radio *****!! I see a HUGE upswing in early 986 prices coming down the pipe...get one now before the market becomes WOKE!
All sarcasm aside, I have owned both an early '98 build and now an early '00 build. Each car has it's individual differences, but not enough to say one is more "unique" than the other. My '00 is a little more refined, but the '98 had full leather so it felt more luxurious inside. If I put both beside each other and pick where my money is spent it would be the '00 simply due to the way it is equipped. The moral of the story is find a great 996 that works for you, buy it, & drive the livin' hell out of it!
One thing that is forgotten is that the 993 line was PRE factory refurb.
So the early 996's were built on the hand assembled line, the fact that 993's
were built in the same line building is really immaterial. because the line was
basically nothing but a cart line with manual parts "kit" delivery to each station.
The older line did not have automated JIT parts delivery, much in the way of robots etc.
I don't think anybody knows exactly how many .1 cars were made on the old line vs new,
I suspect for a while they were built in parallel while the new line was implemented and checked out..
It would be pretty standard process and since Toyota was the partner in the line development, 12 to 24 months would be normal.
Based on other marques, the initial transition cars that got all their parts hand fitted the quality of assembly ends up being tighter,
doesn't mean that there aren't any glitches...
"This is one of around 3400 cars built in 1998 on the same production line as the last of the air cooled 993’s. This car has no electronic drivers aides, no drive by wire on this car!"
Us 996.1 owners with eGas throttles are tired of the mythology surrounding the unicorn 99s.
1) Yes, eGas cars need a tune or other 'fix' if rev matching and double DE-clutching and heel n toe are to be utilized. For me, this matters, because Sportscar. So I have an easily reversible tune, by a reputable vendor.
2) Let's address 'electronic driver aids'. Porsche PSM is easily disabled. By default if you turn it off, the first time you touch the brake it enables again. You can defeat this, but why? The PSM won't activate until your slip angles are WAY beyond most drivers courage and abilities. Certainly if you manage to activate PSM on public roads, your next ride (or someone else's) will be in an ambulance or worse. Or your car will be on a wrecker....
ABS is on ALL 996s. Thank God say most, ABS is and was a requirement by USA DOT and Bosch did a great job with it.
Now, if you're 996.x, any year, has LSD, then that adds value. Otherwise, this mythos about the lack of driver aids' has to stop. It's like a Rennlist minority cult. Maybe the admins should open a dedicated forum for the elitists? Just a thought.
Last bit of common sense here. The early 996.1 cars were 'built on the same assembly line' as the much vaunted 993. Huh? The 996 and it's predecessor don't share a single part. I would bet this started as some form of 993 jealousy and spread like herpes through Rennlist. If you want a 993, buy one. But they're not great value. If you're rich it doesn't matter, but all 911s are better than their predecessor. Objectively. Or Porsche is selling us all snakeoil.
Now, if your early .1 has LSD and x51...oh, wait! X51 was never optioned on US 3.4L cars. Sorry '99 fans...
The '99 is the best story needs to end at some point. You might as well be saying 'the 99 is so great, because Ferry Porsche died in March 1998, (RIP) and all 911s got steadily worse after that'. Sheesh.
/rant
Not sure why my quote was followed-up by that diatribe?
"This is one of around 3400 cars built in 1998 on the same production line as the last of the air cooled 993’s. This car has no electronic drivers aides, no drive by wire on this car!"
Us 996.1 owners with eGas throttles are tired of the mythology surrounding the unicorn 99s.
1) Yes, eGas cars need a tune or other 'fix' if rev matching and double DE-clutching and heel n toe are to be utilized. For me, this matters, because Sportscar. So I have an easily reversible tune, by a reputable vendor.
2) Let's address 'electronic driver aids'. Porsche PSM is easily disabled. By default if you turn it off, the first time you touch the brake it enables again. You can defeat this, but why? The PSM won't activate until your slip angles are WAY beyond most drivers courage and abilities. Certainly if you manage to activate PSM on public roads, your next ride (or someone else's) will be in an ambulance or worse. Or your car will be on a wrecker....
ABS is on ALL 996s. Thank God say most, ABS is and was a requirement by USA DOT and Bosch did a great job with it.
Now, if you're 996.x, any year, has LSD, then that adds value. Otherwise, this mythos about the lack of driver aids' has to stop. It's like a Rennlist minority cult. Maybe the admins should open a dedicated forum for the elitists? Just a thought.
Last bit of common sense here. The early 996.1 cars were 'built on the same assembly line' as the much vaunted 993. Huh? The 996 and it's predecessor don't share a single part. I would bet this started as some form of 993 jealousy and spread like herpes through Rennlist. If you want a 993, buy one. But they're not great value. If you're rich it doesn't matter, but all 911s are better than their predecessor. Objectively. Or Porsche is selling us all snakeoil.
Now, if your early .1 has LSD and x51...oh, wait! X51 was never optioned on US 3.4L cars. Sorry '99 fans...
The '99 is the best story needs to end at some point. You might as well be saying 'the 99 is so great, because Ferry Porsche died in March 1998, (RIP) and all 911s got steadily worse after that'. Sheesh.
/rant
Not sure why my quote was followed-up by that diatribe?
Don't take it personally @Corso . You're just one of dozens or even hundreds quoting the same regurgitated statements about early 99s.
My response is reasoned, researched, and is intended to create debate with other intelligent Porschephiles. That's why it's called a forum. If everyone on the forum agrees with repeated bogus claims about 99s, does that make said false statements true? No. No it doesn't. If you have actual evidence, photos, quotes (not heresay) to support your claims then by all means share such insight. Me, I've done my research, own the books, and stand by the truths of my post.
Perhaps you're sensitive because you realized you might just be sharing the automotive forum equivalent of gossip, and it's embarrassing. Like I said, don't take it personally. But when you lay down with dogs, you will get fleas.
Oh, and I prefer rant to diatribe thanks.
Or do I?
/diatribe
Don't take it personally @Corso . You're just one of dozens or even hundreds quoting the same regurgitated statements about early 99s.
My response is reasoned, researched, and is intended to create debate with other intelligent Porschephiles. That's why it's called a forum. If everyone on the forum agrees with repeated bogus claims about 99s, does that make said false statements true? No. No it doesn't. If you have actual evidence, photos, quotes (not heresay) to support your claims then by all means share such insight. Me, I've done my research, own the books, and stand by the truths of my post.
Perhaps you're sensitive because you realized you might just be sharing the automotive forum equivalent of gossip, and it's embarrassing. Like I said, don't take it personally. But when you lay down with dogs, you will get fleas.
Oh, and I prefer rant to diatribe thanks.
Or do I?
/diatribe
Sir this is a Wendy's
Last edited by GarrettSR5; 09-14-2023 at 04:59 PM.
I must have really made you sweat if you're going to run to your bookshelf and take selective pics of page 17 of Streather's '996, the essential companion'. Those two photos taken out of context (read the whole production line chapter) are not a valid rebuttal. You would fail debate class🪿.
I don't have a problem with the hand assembled mythology per se. It's the way it's used to pump 99 values and to make subjective claims about how the early cars are better to drive. 'no nanny's', but 'the cable throttle,' yada yada.
You're a 99 owner, so you've got skin in the game. I understand why you wouldn't want anyone pooping on your pixie dust.
I still think you guys need an early 996 forum, where you can all pat each other on the back, (or whatever, you know, you're into).
Before you respond to my post, consider not doing so. Remember, I'm retired, I can do this all day. Haha, just kidding, I got **** to do, I'm out. 👍
09-14-2023, 09:57 AM
