SICAONE

I just have to share that I got torn a new one by a CBR bike on the Southern State Pkwy last Saturday in my 996. I took the head start taking off first from about 60MPH and mashed the pedal. He popped the front wheel off the ground and passed me like I wasn't even moving. I know beating a bike is tough to do but at least I took a shot.

Carlos from Spain

Its not you fault Sicaone, its imposible to do in a straight line unless the guy on the bike screws it up pretty bad, their power to weight ratio is unfair, even if its a small 600cc CBR.

To get an idea my GSX-R1000 (fastest of the 1000cc's) will do 100-200Km/h quicker than what my 996C4 will do 0-100km/h, or 0-200km/h a whole second quicker than an Enzo. So if I were racing myself on a rolling start, I pretty much just have to open the throttle in whatever gear I'm in and the car is left standing.

But don't worry, the table turns when you hit the twisties or at a track, the higher braking and curve speed of your 996 would have "torn him a new one"

RR

I raced a zx-7R and GSXR 600, starting at 90mph.
You shouldnt lose.
The bikes weight advantage is minimalized at speed b/c once an object is in motion it does not take much energy to keep it in motion or increase its velocity.

Since you have 300HP vs 150HP on the bike,the bike wont catch you until top speed if even that.

SICAONE

Carlos, I actually was running on a curvy 2-lane road in the 996 a few months back with a bike right on my tail. On the straights, he was on my bumper but I did in fact get way ahead of him through the turns. On one turn, I noticed that the guy almost lost it from leaning the bike too much because he jerked it back upright mid-turn and veered out way into the other lane. Then I decided to slow down because I didn't want the guy to kill himself trying to keep up. Don't know what bike it was though.

RR, It happened and I lost in reality, not theory. It also does take more energy to overcome the greater wind resistance at higher speeds so I don't think it gets easier unless the wind is at your back.

Can anybody else comment on this topic?

Carlos from Spain

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by RR:
<strong>I raced a zx-7R and GSXR 600, starting at 90mph.
You shouldnt lose.
The bikes weight advantage is minimalized at speed b/c once an object is in motion it does not take much energy to keep it in motion or increase its velocity.

Since you have 300HP vs 150HP on the bike,the bike wont catch you until top speed if even that.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Thats not correct, in fact the greater the speed the greater the horsepower you need to increase anymore speed due to the drag, since it increases at a rate of velocity squared. And on top of that, like sicaone said, a bike has much much less overall drag because the drag is also dependant on the frontal surface area. But its gets to a point as you reach very high speed that because the drag is "squared" by the speed were the bike cannot overcome the drag due to its overall less HP, and the car given enough horsepower, like a 996TT, can beat a bike in overall top speed but will take a much longer time to get there (due to the initial greater drag at lower speeds and much lowerr power-weight). Thats why Capirossi's MotoGP Ducati with only 240HP can beat the top speed of Scumachers F1 Ferrari by a few Km/h before the braking for the curve at Mugello's 1.1Km straight while coming out of the corner that leads to the straight at only half the speed of the F1!

Now my bike has 160HP (a 600cc bike has about 110HP) and it can reach 270Km/h in just 1000m (in 18,8secs) while a 360HP GT3 for example needs 2000m to reach 265Km/h and at 1000m is not even at 230km/h. I think that puts things into perspective.

So if you beat, even a 600cc, with any 996 model in a straight line, the guy in the bike wasn't even trying or messed up really bad. The only time you are going to beat a bike in a straight line is if you go above the bikes top speed, in my case 285km/h (a 600cc around 250km/h), and you get a really head start like a mile or so. Believe me I drive both and the difference in acceleration at ANY speed is unreal, but throw in a few corners and its 911 territory

Sicaone, I agree its dangerous to race some bikers because sometimes its really young inexperienced kids that can really hurt themselves trying to follow, its a big responsibility.

ruey220

i lost you in all the scientific theory stuff you posted, and I know you went 180mph several times so you're speaking from experience, but i do know that 3 times i raced different racing bikes with my 996 on the freeway, and never did I get smoked. As a matter of fact twice, I was pulling up on them so bad at 120 I almost ran them over from the rear and learned never to do it again as I don't want to get anyone hurt.

Carlos from Spain

Well since I believe what you say Ruey, then it must have the bike, only way you could have done that is if they were smaller less powerfull sportbikes with low top speed or were the sport-touring type bikes. Since with my bike, at 120mph I'm just then switching to 3rd gear only, and the acceleration is so hard up until that point that you can't even keep the front wheel on the ground at WOT, compared to that, my carrera feels like a Hyundai, since its power-weight ratio would be equal to a 1200HP 996TT

Like I mentioned before, from 60mph to 120mph my bike accelerates even faster than what a C2 can do 0-60mph so my C4 going 60-120mph is going to be left standing cause my bike or similar is going to do it in just 4,4secs or similar.

So I guess it depends on the bike, 1000cc (GSX-R1000, Yamaha R1, Kawa ZX-9R & CBR900...), 1200cc (Hayabusa, ZX-12R...), and 750cc inline-4's (GSX-R750) or 1000ccc V-Twins (Ducatis, Aprilias, etc) should have no trouble and you may have more chances against a 600cc the higher the speed is the roll on start at, as long as its not modded cause most are riced up too <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

MikeP Long Island

The only place a 996 MIGHT be able to stay with a 750cc to liter-class sportbike is in tight twisties. That will only happen because 98% of street riders don't have the confidence to push the bike to anywhere close to its potential. If one of the 2% is riding, we don't stand a chance in the car under any circumstances. And not only in the go-fast deprtment...5 years ago a "street" road test on Carl Fogarty's WSB Ducati showed a 60-0 stopping distance of 87 feet!!!

And c'mon, there's nothing in cardom that looks 1/10 as cool as some guy doing a wheelie for two blocks! So the next time you tangle with a bike, just give them a thumbs up - it avoids a lot of embarassment!

RR

My situation is exactly like Ruey's.
I raced 2 bikes twice on different days.
ZX7 and GSXR 600.
In both cases we were going along at around 140km.
In both cases I pulled away from them especially at 200km/hr.

Carlos from Spain

Then it was the drivers of the bikes that didn't use WOT or used long gears and weren't trying, especially the ZX-7R. I have raced 600cc bikes with my car and if they use the correct gears and powerband, they pulled away always up until 220km/h or so when slowly I have the advantage as speed futher increases and at around 250km/h they can go no further. Now, as soon as the curve came I would catch up on the braking and cornering speed but I would have to reach the cornering limits of the 996.
Now, a 1000cc doesn't even need to reduce gears and the advantage would too great to make it up on the curves, even on a place with lots of curvers like nurburgring, any 1000cc can lap under 8mins, but on a slower twisty track such as Hockenheim the 996 would win.

So it was driver factor if you beat any 600cc and up RR, the driver in the car was better then <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Waz996

I do have a few posts on bikes vs 996 as i do have quite a hefty experience with bikes.. my only competitors in Nigeria were bikes, for the lack of supercars *or the waste of carreras and the like driven by show off yuppies*

Anyway, fact is there is no way you can win 0-60 with a 750cc or more.. Otherwise, if you do catch them at +140km, you can go along head to head till 250 after which the carrera's aerodynamics take over.. I've raced two 750's up to 250km/hr and then overtook them after 270km/hr..

Talking about twisties, the carrera will surely control the situation since no bike can take lateral g's the way a carrera can handle +0.80g

Now Carlos, i did race a GSX1000R like yours.. Carrera loses on all counts.. the 1000R takes advantage of the straights and loses some time on the twisties but not to let me even get close.. He was just too fast.

Last impression is that if ever one should race with a bike, never do it behind the biker.. From experience point of view, I almost ran one of the bikes in an emergency braking maneouver.. I still shiver!

Waz

ruey220

Carlos,

I know the bikes that I raced were definately sportbikes as I had a group of friends that were into this and had even GSX-R's like a 1000 i think. One I know did 1/4 at 12, but he told me himself it would be a tough match to blow away a 13 second car after 120mph.

You probably are right that the driver must be really good to take it to the limit, but then again I clearly recall hearing the exhaust on those bikes I raced seemingly at full throttle because prior to 100mph it almost seemed like his bike was squatting and screaming from all the power being applied. It seemed as though he was already peaking at 120-130mph.

How fast do these go anyway?

Carlos from Spain

The tough part about bikes is getting them rolling from stop start, since they can flip up on you, but as soon as they are moving or from a rolling start its very easy to accelerate them.

I guess it depends on the bike but I know in my bike which is the fastest production bike, at 120mph the acceleration is much higher than my 996, actually its not even close. And also I have seen small 600cc bikes out accelerate my 996 at speeds between 60-120mph while I was at WOT.

As how fast? which size bike?
My 2003 GSX-R1000 will do 0-120mph in 7,7 secs officially, thats faster than a McLaren F1 or an Enzo. Those are the facts (A 600cc needs around 10secs)

Now, top speed generally favors the cars due to HP needen to overcome the drag at those speeds, mine does 175mph (still marginally faster than my 996) but a 600cc will do only 160mph.

You are right about the exaust sound of these bikes, but even at low rev's like 6000RPM they are screaming. Its because the engines are so tight (mine pumps 160HP from just 1000cc) and rev up to 12000RPM. If you go to my web page under my signature, there is a video of my GSX-R1000, the bike is screaming but actually I'm only using half of the powerband up to only 6000RPM since I was still on the break-in on this one.

Believe me, driver factor aside, any 600cc spotbike bike and up will out drag any Porsche on a rolling starts up to starting at speeds above 120mph. And its very easy to do rolling starts on a bike, the tricky part is standing starts. And 1000cc sportbikes are in another league alltogether, imagine a 1200HP Porsche's acceleration? thats about it up to 175mph

Carlos from Spain

OK I found some info on the subject which leaves it pretty clear and are also some fun readings

<a href="http://www.pro-libertate.com/gsxr1000/Magazine_Articles/bike-car/bike-car.html" target="_blank">2001 GSX-R1000 vs Vette Z06 article</a>

<a href="http://solo2.abac.com/avigdor/mags/caranddriver%20dec1996/Page.html" target="_blank">Viper vs 1000cc sport-touring bike (not the fastest 1000cc but still blows the Viper)</a>

<a href="http://solo2.abac.com/avigdor/mags/roadandtrack%20june2000/Page.html" target="_blank">R&T shootout b/w race cars, modded cars and a ZX-12R too</a>

docjackson1

i agree with carlos-a competent motorcycle rider could take a 996 thru the straights up to 120 mph time after time-and he doesn't necessarily need a sportbike. a honda goldwing or a bmw k1200lt will probably do the job. they just have too much power for their weight.