wayne325

SwayBar

I think I have the same situation as you but mine is not as bad. I was at the Ruf shop the other
day, my car had the SAI code for the left bank. I told them I had the SAI valves replaced a few
miles ago ($600) and they all said - inunison - "valve guides". It means top end rebuild.
Probably. But they have to go in and do more checking to be sure.

So my thinking is the same as yours. If it is a "reasonable" adder for these new heads over
machining the old heads - then it's the perfect time to do it. Of course for everyone the
word "reasonable" means something different !!!?!?!?!
In the US we need the SAI ports to be street legal. I have a smog test here so I need the SAI part
sorted for the US market before I would think seriously about buying the kit.

WCheers,
W.

SwayBar

Geoffrey

While the SAI port design may not have been the most well thought out solution to the emissions requirements here in the US at that time, it isn't necessarily the root cause. The 993 valve guides are the issue. Either the clearance is too large from the factory, AND/OR they are made from soft material and wear prematurely. This causes carbon coking inside the exhaust port, on the exhaust guide, and inside the SAI port itself. Further issues are that the exhaust valves become pitted from the carbon and lose seat concentricity and begin to leak as well as increased oil consumption. All of these issues contribute to the 993 head problems people are seeing. Once the heads are redone using better cooling and harder valve guides with proper clearance and newer, lighter, and better made valves, the problems go away.

stedge

Though I do not have the SAI issue, this would be fabulous! I would acutally like to know the cost for the set you note, SwayBar, compared to the 3.8 liter "race" setup... if that can be made street/smog legal over here?

rkass

I too would love to do this mod and have same questions as swaybar, except need to know who can do tuning in US. If nienmiester or 4tech can respond, would be greatly appreciated.

Geoffrey

The issue here in the US is the ability to program the 88pin ECU on a dyno, in real time, tailored to your engine's operation. This is the major challenge to overcome in order to make the large changes required to support a 350hp engine vs 282hp stock engine. Assuming emissions equipment is still in tact, it should not be an problem to make the car emissions compliant since the testing is done at cruise and low rpm drive cycles.

rkass

Geoffrey, do you do this? I am in RI and see you are in NY. Randy

Geoffrey

No, I don't do any reprogramming of factory ECUs. I am considering working with Colin to obtain the necessary equipment, however it only supports 55pin ECUs. This would allow me to do 964s, but not 993s. I haven't done this at this point because I really need a solution that will support both 964 and 993.

Joe S.

If this setup becomes smog legal etc. and I need a top end rebuild, this becomes a no brainer. Good work!

'95 993

Drove my car back to Ninemeister for the final remap today, 200 miles on the Motorway (freeway) wow, the car really pics up, massive torque. 2000 rpm in sixth, ~ 60 - 70 mph, floor the accelerator and the car just picks up and rides this massive wall of torque, had to brake at ~120 mph (on a private road of course) because of other traffic (invited to the private road ) but it just felt so incredibly powerful and strong - it is just so good , will post the dyno plots when it is remapped, maybe colin will run me off a copy which compares the torque and BHP with a GT3 for posting?

John

SwayBar

That is without a doubt the best of both worlds: 993-looks, GT3 engine-performance.

Thanks for the update; enjoy driving your car!

Including a stock 993 dyno-run would be helpful for comparison too.

NineMeister

Seek and ye shall find....


Thanks to JS dropping off his 993NVR this morning and us having the dyno free, we managed to do the remapping work on his engine this afternoon. The bonus is that we also have the results of Robin's 993VR Monday dyno run and as requested by JS, a standard GT3 mk1 test from Friday. The power & torque curves below are all three cars which are now corrected to DIN standards thanks to the new hardware/software package from Dynostar. They make really interesting reading, especially considering that they are all 3.6 engines.



GT3 mk1 = blue
9m 993VR = red
9m 993NVR = green

Makes you wonder what results we are going to get from the 993 once we finish the work on the new 9m/4T "Sport" pistons, rods & cams which will allow us to run the engine up to the same rev limit as the GT3?

epj993

Amazing work, Colin! Can't wait for the US version!

NineMeister

To confirm some of the questions raised by everyone in the above posts:

1. 9m/4T Cylinder Heads
Supplied ready to fit but not assembled. As standard they have fully CNC machined ports and are fitted with special 4T sintered valve guides & seats which are finished to suit the 993VR inlet & exhaust valve sizes of 50mm & 42.5mm respecitvely. The price of the heads are £795 each = £4770 a set. You can either purchase a ROW or USA version of the heads for the same price, the ROW version is obviosusly as tested, the USA version will have our version of the SAI port drilling as Robin detailed above.

2. Valves/Springs/Retainers/Cam package
Whilst I have no doubt that similar or even better results could be obtained with alternative parts, the only package that 9m are selling is the one that we have tested with the results shown above. This kit can also be fitted to standard 993 engines for a useful power gain. The price for the complete cam/valve package is £1775.

3. Introductory Deal
As an incentive for customers to run the same proven parts as we have tested, we are offering the complete engine hardware package of six heads with cam/valve kit for £5995.

4. Exhaust
You must fit split flow sport cats to achieve the same results as above. We can supply these to fit either Bischoff or Gillet heat exchangers for £1350 including all fitting hardware & gaskets.

5. Engine options
Aside from the obvious head gasket set/oil/filters we recommend that you also fit new rings and a full set of the later specification hydraulic lifters (white plastic seal on the body). In the case of both engines above we also replaced the intake stubs (6 x inlet manifold injector stacks) since the originals were distorted or were damaged being removed due to corrosion of the through bolt fixiing. As a guide, all the above parts will cost around £700-800.

6. Labour
Pretty much just a top end rebuild, so around 30 hours work on the engine itself, plus removal & refitting and wheel alignment. Including the before dyno testing and the full live remap, our cost for this work is £3000.


All the prices exclude tax & shipping.

Finally, before anyone asks, because of the investment required to bring this product to the market we cannot offer any further price discounts other than the introductory deal as mentioned above, so sorry but no group buy at the moment. Genuine trade enquiries are welcome but please contact me directly as I would like to keep the Rennlist posts informative, not commercial.

Bill Verburg

I have 2x 55pin993 DMEs that are crying for a real time remap

1 '97 Row M64/21
1 '95 US M64/05

would love to do a Motec but the cost makes my head spin