Wilder

You're making some erroneous assumptions.
This is exactly what I said: "My T weighs just over 3,200 lbs. The average S weighs 3,500 lbs and the average Turbo near 3,700."
My car does indeed weigh just over 3,200 lbs. around 3,240 to be exact.
The average S does in fact weigh around 3,500 lbs. Like I said before, the S is heavier to start with and most are equipped with heavy options like PDK, sunroof, RWS etc.

You didn't list the car options for the C&D examples. You just posted weights that suggest the T and the S weigh nearly the same. They don't. Porsche quoted weight for the T is 3,241. Porsche quoted weight for the S is 3,382. C&D numbers suggest the T has heavy options and the S has LW options that reduce weight below their quoted weight. That's not an "apples to apples" comparison.

timothymoffat

Not assuming anything my friend. The “average” 992 S does not weigh 3500lbs.

We should step away from derailing the OP’s thread.

M3Inline6

Not every S has a moonroof, PDK, RWS, FAL, etc. In fact, my S has none of those options and is an MT. There isn’t a 300 lb. delta between a T and an S. The rear seats themselves don’t even weigh that much. Some S’ also have lightweight glass. It was an option when I ordered my S, but people were having issues with the glass so I opted not to configure my car with that option.

Newusername

I was hell bent on getting a GT3 to replace my 991.2 C2S, I was finally able to drive one locally on our roads and while its clearly an outsanding machine with a spectacular engine, it wasn't fun on our rough roads and I was honestly a bit dissapointed by that.

I went with a T because it was a better fit, and the right spec was available for me when I got it. I was also open to an S/GTS as well so i'm not a really a T fanboy.

The car I really want is one that Porsche does not make - give me the T as it is but with the 4.0 from the Cayman GTS/GT4 - 400hp ~ N/A and probably another 50-70 lbs lighter than the 3.0T in the current T.

RatherJaded

I agree with most of this but, I do suspect that the vast majority of C2S’s are equipped with the glass sunroof and the PDK and from what I have witnessed most of the 992 Ts are spec’ed with the manual and more often than not, no sunroof. A PDK slips in every now and then for the T, especially if it is for dealer inventory.

I personally spec’ed my T as an enthusiast spec, lite on the options. I still would like to acquire a C2S allocation and it would be spec’ed more GT with more luxury items, including the glass sunroof, but still retaining the manual transmission that I also spec’ed on the T.


This ⬆️ Sold! Take my money…

pitt911

GT3 is a much better car all around even as a daily . I never had a 992 T but had 992 C4S and TTS as well as multiple GT cars including 991.1 GT3
actually the .1 GT3 was my first GT car
but the only problem with the .1 is the potential engine issue
PDK-S on these cars is great and most likely you will not miss the MT
just make sure you have good extended warranty if that exists

GeorgeA

THIS.

So many people talking about the T being a better drive than the S when the S can be configured exactly like the T but with more power. My S is a 7MT with SPASM and RWS that doesn't have many other options. It's specced very similar to a T (which is a regular 911 with S sport parts essentially).

Problem is - most people are comparing a fully loaded PDK 4S to a T and getting those weight figures, when in reality the weight difference between a properly specced S and T is negligible.

Honinspire02

appreciate the feedback. Where you located? Our roads aren’t the best where I live as well

Irish Guy

OP: I went from a 991.2 Carrera T to a 992 GT3 - both were manual. I've owned the GT3 for just over 2 years now, and have had plenty of time to absorb what the car is all about and how it compares to the last generation T. My move isn't what you're contemplating, but my impressions may nevertheless be helpful. The 991.2 and 992 CTs share the same engine. And the 9K masterpiece in the GT3 has merely evolved from the 991.1 generation to present (though beware reliability issues with the 991.1).

First, nothing - and I mean nothing - matches the reality of a foot-to-the-floor race to 9,000 rpm in which you have to take one hand off the wheel to shift. It becomes a different car as you crest 6,000 and head towards redline. The power seems to come out of nowhere, and - at the very top end - is explosive. The shriek magnifies the effect. Honestly, there are times that I find it borderline frightening - light car, over 500hp, MT, and RWD. It's an experience like no other. The 991.1 won't give you the manual, of course, but the PDK is a wonder and its own source of fun. Those redline shifts are going to be an event, either way.

Second, although the 992 GT3 is known for a more punishing drive, I haven't found it much different than my Carrera T with SPASM. Importantly, my GT3 rides on Pirelli Corsas. I hear that the Michelin PS Cup 2s are a different beast. I'd suspect that a 991.1 GT3 will be firmer than your T, but not dramatically so if you spec'd the T with SPASM.

None of what I wrote will come as much of a surprise, I'm sure, but this part might: I sometimes miss my Carrera T.

Yes, it's always a joy driving the GT3 - even at low RPM, the immediate throttle response makes the car feel faster than it is. But the GT3 can be frustrating when you're stuck on ordinary roads. At least with the 992 GT3, you need to hit 50 mph before the chassis wakes up. Beyond such speeds, the car feels truly alive - the slightest movement of the wheel causes the car to dive toward its new direction. At more pedestrian speeds, though, the car has yet to wake up. And then there's the challenge of experiencing the power band. First-gear pulls are traction limited. You need real space to do even a second-gear run to 9K. The engine starts singing at 4K, power starts to build quicker at 5, but the party really starts as you climb beyond 6-7. By then, you're hitting some speed and making a lot of noise as you do it. In a world of cameras, speed traps, traffic, and - most importantly - the need to ensure that everyone on the road around you is safe, there are real limits to achieving the GT3's potential. But, wow, it really is something when you max it out.

The lightly boosted 3.0 in the Carrera T is a magnificent engine. No, it's no GT unit. But it has its own charms. My 2018 CT had sharp throttle response. I *loved* how Porsche controls the boost in the T so that power builds progressively rather than in a single kick. I don't know whether the 992 CT has the same, following feature, but I suspect that it does: Porsche designed the 991.2 T's engine so that valves open at ~ 3.5K, just as boost builds. The combination of sound and power was magic. On smaller back roads, you can dig into the T's performance in a way that you just can't with a GT3. The turbo engine gives you its performance sooner, and there's real joy to be found in that.

I also noticed that, with the 991.2's narrow-body setup, the rear on my CT was much less stable than the GT3. My CT liked to rotate! (It gave me the occasional scare.) The GT3, by contrast, is planted and all business. This may not be as significant a change for you given the 992 base case.

Good luck with your choice. The right decision depends entirely on your preferences and situation. FWIW, though, I think that the Carrera T is a fabulous car with a marvelous engine. The GT3 will give you something different, and - in some respects - clearly better. But it'd be an older car, out of warranty, subject to its own demerits relative to your T, and with an engine that history has shown not to be bulletproof. If I were you, I'd keep the T unless you get a 991.2 or 992 GT3. And, even then, ask yourself - when you're not entranced by the prospect of the next, exciting thing (something I certainly fall prey to) - will you really have more fun in the GT3 on most of your drives?

I don't plan ever to sell my GT3. It's a special car. In a time of electrification and, for ICE cars, homogenization - the GT3 represents something else entirely. I love it every time I drive it, and - if you're after driving thrills - the GT3 at redline will give them to you. But I also miss my Carrera T, and suspect that you would, too. In a perfect world, one would have a both (and sure a TTS for good measure!).

M3Inline6

This is a very well thought out, articulate and balanced response.

Wilder

Wisdom that frequently falls on deaf ears.

100%

rk-d

For me this is a big part of what makes the GT3 what it is.

It is violent and brutal, yet completely polished. It truly sounds motorsport in the upper registers and the way it just won't stop pulling is addictive. I love the little report from the exhaust with upshifts when you're really getting on it. Frightening is the right word and I think that's the thing that has kept the car interesting for me.

bobert75

That's 98% true - two things I get on a T that I can't get on an S are the reduced sound insulation and the shorter shift lever. I do wonder how much the loss of those two things might bother me if I ever were to trade my T for an S. I love my T but I resent not being able to get PTS (and the unique spec I would have built to go with it) so it's possible I could be tempted into a future S if PTS were to be available.

Regarding the weight difference, Porsche lists the US Carrera T with standard 7MT at 3254 lbs and the Carrera S with optional 7MT at 3298, a difference of a mere 44 lbs. And if you add the rear seats to the T and the lightweight glass to the S it'd theoretically be even less. That said, many months ago in some other thread, many of us debated the actual weight difference (just for fun!) and I wanna say "we" came to the conclusion that the weight difference had to be more than 44 lbs. There's simply no way the lighter battery + lightweight glass + reduced sound insulation + lack of rear seats all add up to only 44 lbs less. At any rate, my guess is it's more than that but < 100 lbs.

As for the OP's "dilemma" I for one certainly would not consider trading my 992 T for a 991.1 GT3. However, a 991.2 GT3T with 6MT is the "holy grail" for me. That said, I still wouldn't trade my 992 T for one of those because I'd rather have my car that I ordered new (and drove in Europe) vs someone else's used car not built to my exact specifications. As much as I love my 992 T, and as much as it's surely a better daily driver than a 992 GT3, you can bet I'd trade my T for a new 992 GT3T allocation provided PTS was available.

M3Inline6

The S’ shifter is short enough to be honest, but if you prefer the slightly shorter throw, you can buy Porsche’s short shifter for the 992 for $485 from Suncoast.

GeorgeA

The weight really depends on the build - some S models with RWS come with the lighter battery as standard (mine did). Lightweight glass is an option but the difference is very minimal. Sound deadening is an interesting one because my S is SO loud inside while cruising, I think it doesn't have much sound deadening to begin with so I doubt a few feet of foam will weigh much. These are just very minimal differences and no one would even feel that weight anyways. Even rear seats don't weigh much. Issue is, all 911's are designed so heavily with weight in mind (pun intended), that besides the larger items (like AWD, PDK, sunroof, heavier seats etc) there isn't much you can take out. Good example is the GT3t vs S/T - I believe the difference was around 33 pounds which is nothing given the extent they had to go to get there.

As far as the shifter, I would recommend the Numeric unit as it's the best one you can get - I have that in my S and no factory shifter really comes close to it - it's perfection.

As far as the GT3 - it's a tough one for me. I'm coming from M3's and the S already feels very low, stiff and rather a bit inconvenient as a daily (I absolutely love dallying it still). The GT3 might be a little too much for my use to be honest. Granted I'll still get one when the time comes but it will be hard giving up the S as it does everything so well (and is an absolute joy on the track). I also love the power and torque this engine makes with a tune, it's borderline uncivilized.