C2S vs C4S
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,356
Likes: 7
From: Upstate, NY
Here's the downside on the C4S: an extra 110 libs (like another girl in the car), lack of pure steering feel primarily due to torque steer, the wide body looks shorter and thus heavier to the eye. The 305 rear tires cost more to replace and you'll likely be doing that every 10K. You can take it from there.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 432
Likes: 133
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
The car suffers from torque steer? I have not heard that complaint in the research I have been doing.
Here's the downside on the C4S: an extra 110 libs (like another girl in the car), lack of pure steering feel primarily due to torque steer, the wide body looks shorter and thus heavier to the eye. The 305 rear tires cost more to replace and you'll likely be doing that every 10K. You can take it from there.
Banned
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 26,140
Likes: 5,464
From: Chicagoland Area
Here's the downside on the C4S: an extra 110 libs (like another girl in the car), lack of pure steering feel primarily due to torque steer, the wide body looks shorter and thus heavier to the eye. The 305 rear tires cost more to replace and you'll likely be doing that every 10K. You can take it from there.
A P-Zero in 305/30/20 ($426) cost $7.00 more than a 295/30/20 ($419). $14.00 total. That's less than 3 Starbuck's Jamaican Blue Mountain Grande Clovers, double cup. 991 owners are seeing great tires wear, well above 10,000 miles. Heck, my car with just under 12,000 miles still has 5/32's on the rear and 7's up front.
Michelin Super Sports has a $53/tire spread ($428 vs $375).
*all Tire Rack pricing
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 432
Likes: 133
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Tires are not an issue, that expense is expected with any performance car. I like the wider tire on the 4S.
Here's the downside on the C4S: an extra 110 libs (like another girl in the car), lack of pure steering feel primarily due to torque steer, the wide body looks shorter and thus heavier to the eye. The 305 rear tires cost more to replace and you'll likely be doing that every 10K. You can take it from there.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 432
Likes: 133
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Wow! LOL!
Yep. LOL!
A P-Zero in 305/30/20 ($426) cost $7.00 more than a 295/30/20 ($419). $14.00 total. That's less than 3 Starbuck's Jamaican Blue Mountain Grande Clovers, double cup. 991 owners are seeing great tires wear, well above 10,000 miles. Heck, my car with just under 12,000 miles still has 5/32's on the rear and 7's up front.
Michelin Super Sports has a $53/tire spread ($428 vs $375).
*all Tire Rack pricing
A P-Zero in 305/30/20 ($426) cost $7.00 more than a 295/30/20 ($419). $14.00 total. That's less than 3 Starbuck's Jamaican Blue Mountain Grande Clovers, double cup. 991 owners are seeing great tires wear, well above 10,000 miles. Heck, my car with just under 12,000 miles still has 5/32's on the rear and 7's up front.
Michelin Super Sports has a $53/tire spread ($428 vs $375).
*all Tire Rack pricing
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,663
Likes: 135
From: SC
Having owned both, this time I went with the 2S. As I track my car, I didn't like the feel of the torque steering in tight hairpins. Felt the the car and computer were driving me! As far as the tires go, I'm running 255/305's on mine now!
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Three Wheelin'
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,710
Likes: 11
I chose rwd for the simplicity and lighter weight. However, I generally don't drive it in foul weather. No question the 4wd is better in rain and snow(which I avoid). The 911/50 gives me the wider body/wider tires etc. and keeps the rwd. The GTS will offer you the same thing. So, IF you like the C4S cosmetics AND want rwd think about the GTS. Both are excellent choices but I am a purist. Coupe body and rwd always. There must be a reason the GT3/GT2 are always rwd.......maybe Porsche knows something we don't? The GT3 does not seem to lack traction despite being rwd.
Pro
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 533
Likes: 5
From: Saratoga Springs, NY
Just think of AWD as not offering the pure steering feel of only RWD. When the front wheels are torque driven and slip under acceleration you feel it. This cannot happen with RWD as there is no wheel torque force in the front under acceleration to deal with. (And yes, under deceleration and braking you will feel the torque steering effect on the front wheels no mater which variant you choose, as one wheel may slip more than the other depending on the surface.) Simple?
Racer
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
From: Frisco Texas
LexVan
Yum - Had one today.
And yes the 4s looks best and I will sacrifice a couple bucks for tires. If I was worried about a couple bucks I would get a Hyundai. Oh wait that is $100,000 or more.
Starbuck's Jamaican Blue Mountain Grande Clovers
And yes the 4s looks best and I will sacrifice a couple bucks for tires. If I was worried about a couple bucks I would get a Hyundai. Oh wait that is $100,000 or more.
Race Car
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,522
Likes: 62
Torque steering is the influence of engine torque on the steering, especially in front-wheel drive vehicles with transversely mounted engines. For example, during heavy acceleration the steering may pull to one side, which may be disturbing to the driver. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steering
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 432
Likes: 133
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
I am well aware of what torque steer is. I'm just asking how prevalent it is on the 4S. I have not read about complaints in regards to torque steer on the 4S.
Just think of AWD as not offering the pure steering feel of only RWD. When the front wheels are torque driven and slip under acceleration you feel it. This cannot happen with RWD as there is no wheel torque force in the front under acceleration to deal with. (And yes, under deceleration and braking you will feel the torque steering effect on the front wheels no mater which variant you choose, as one wheel may slip more than the other depending on the surface.) Simple?
Race Car
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,522
Likes: 62
<<<@!1!@>>>
That's because there hasn't been noticeable torque steer on any 911 since at least the 993's. I have driven 993 C4S & TT, 996 Turbo, all of them on street, track and autocross, and 997 C4S on the street. None of them exhibited any torque steer at all. By the way I wasn't picking on anyone in particular. That would be unfair, since nobody got it right. All the same, I get what people are trying to describe.
Now given that Porsche had (assuming it was ever there to begin with) eliminated torque steer as far back as those earlier generations, well then to me it is inconceivable for it to now appear in the 991.
That's because there hasn't been noticeable torque steer on any 911 since at least the 993's. I have driven 993 C4S & TT, 996 Turbo, all of them on street, track and autocross, and 997 C4S on the street. None of them exhibited any torque steer at all. By the way I wasn't picking on anyone in particular. That would be unfair, since nobody got it right. All the same, I get what people are trying to describe.
Now given that Porsche had (assuming it was ever there to begin with) eliminated torque steer as far back as those earlier generations, well then to me it is inconceivable for it to now appear in the 991.