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…….., it seems to me that many who have not driven with the updated version do not fully understand the the nature of the modification fearing that it takes away the ability to drive very aggressively and somehow takes away from the performance of the car. I don’t think it does.
Hopefully at some point, we will get some scientifically valid comparisons of the same car pre and post programming and timed driving on a track by professional drivers comparing the two.
Thank you for your insights. With all due respect to everyone’s subjective and anecdotal statements and “butt dyno” reports, we have received no objective, technical data whatsoever regarding the tune to date. None! So, in reality, NO ONE, including those who already have it, truly understands the nature of the modification. That is the point. No one who has had the recall tune installed can explain to anyone else exactly what the tune modified or changed. Why? Because no one knows. Although Porsche has this information, it declines to share it for some reason. My opinion might readily change if I had that information. So for now, Porsche is not any making changes to my vehicle when they cannot explain the proposed changes or answer my technical questions. The dealers say they have not been told either. I am just asking for technical information so I can make an intelligent and informed decision like every good engineer should. I do not think that is an unreasonable request to Porsche NA.
@Eloas In your post you say ”I'm on a country road in automatic mode, let's say I'm driving in sport mode at 55-60 mph in 5th gear, the RPM is around 2700-3000. When you activate the sport mode +, the car automatically downshift in 3rd gear and the RPM is at 4000-4500 and as soon as you press the accelerator a little, without even forcing it, it goes from 55 mph to 130 mph in a fraction of second and the gears change at 7400 rmp, without even worrying about when to upshift since we are in automatic mode”
The “new” Sport+ would work pretty much like that driving in a spirited manner. The only difference is that if you change your driving style to a more relaxed one, the PDK will upshift as opposed leaving the engine RPM rewing at lets say at 7,000. If one continues to push the car, the shift will happen at redline and PDK does not force a higher gear prior to that. I have obviously driven with both as my car was updated, and while I have not yet had an opportunity to put a lot of miles and especially back road miles with the “new” PDK programming, it seems to me that many who have not driven with the updated version do not fully understand the the nature of the modification fearing that it takes away the ability to drive very aggressively and somehow takes away from the performance of the car. I don’t think it does.
Hopefully at some point, we will get some scientifically valid comparisons of the same car pre and post programming and timed driving on a track by professional drivers comparing the two.
This is pretty much how the 991.2 Sport + acts.
If the car detects you are driving aggressively it will hold gears until redline.
If you are driving more casually it will up shift earlier, but will hold gears until redline with aggressive driving.
I suspect they are making the 991.1 PDK act like the 991.2 PDK in Sport +. Having it upshift earlier under light throttle allows them to meet emission regulations.
I have yet to hear 991.2 PDK owners complain that the car doesn't drive properly when pushing it on the street/track in Sport +.
Thank you for your insights. With all due respect to everyone’s subjective and anecdotal statements and “butt dyno” reports, we have received no objective, technical data whatsoever regarding the tune to date. None! So, in reality, NO ONE, including those who already have it, truly understands the nature of the modification. That is the point. No one who has had the recall tune installed can explain to anyone else exactly what the tune modified or changed. Why? Because no one knows. Although Porsche has this information, it declines to share it for some reason. My opinion might readily change if I had that information. So for now, Porsche is not any making changes to my vehicle when they cannot explain the proposed changes or answer my technical questions. The dealers say they have not been told either. I am just asking for technical information so I can make an intelligent and informed decision like every good engineer should. I do not think that is an unreasonable request to Porsche NA.
To be fair, they have stated, in absolutely unequivocal terms, that performance is not affected. So if someone can show that their car now develops less torque at any given RPM, they have cause for legal action.
To be fair, they have stated, in absolutely unequivocal terms, that performance is not affected. So if someone can show that their car now develops less torque at any given RPM, they have cause for legal action.
This^
Don't whine. Measure and file a complaint if your "butt dyno" is correct.
Last edited by Wellardmac; 04-11-2022 at 05:37 PM.
To be fair, they have stated, in absolutely unequivocal terms, that performance is not affected. So if someone can show that their car now develops less torque at any given RPM, they have cause for legal action.
Respectfully disagree. The term “performance” as used in the one page “lawyer letter” was not defined. So, Porsche gets to select how that term is defined and measured. That is exactly why they used a vague term in the letter. Performance is not hp, torque, 0-60mph, etc. It is “performance” …..which is something different to everyone of us. In fact, emissions “performance” was improved. No lawsuit actionable absent a clear and unambiguous factual misrepresentation.
Or……just refuse to have it installed which is everyone’s option.
Agreed.
I have it installed on my car and have now driven it for several months to assess it. I agree that under "normal" road driving that the car may appear tamer if you're not accelerating hard, but with aggressive acceleration I see no issues at all in how it handles. It redlines all the way and performs as it should.
As was correctly pointed out, Porsche has certified no performance difference. Those that are unhappy can test them and I'm sure they'll find an eager class action attorney happy to file an action. Personally, I'm pretty confident that if Porsche is willing to put out that statement and put their name on the line, then I'm confident that they wouldn't expose themselves to the liability.
I personally have little patience for whining. Get data, or shut up and move on.
Email I received on the topic shown below for those that need to file suit.
Wel well well, I just made the reprogram AMCO today, So I describe my first impressions. My 991.1 S is a PDK automatic with Sport Chrono Plus.
In normal mode, the ride feels smoother and it shifts quicker. In sport mode, I did not notice any changes between before and after the update. Crackles and pops in are still there.
It's really the sport plus mode that changes. The update really affects how the car works in PDK Automatic in sport plus mode. It's hard to describe and the change is subtle. I give you examples before and after the update for you to understand. Let's say I'm cruising at 55 mhp in normal mode. The gear will be in 7th at 1500-2000 RPM :
Sport plus mode activated in PDK automatic before the update:
- The gear goes down in 2 or 3 and I will be at 4000 rpm. The acceleration will be between 4000 and 7800 rpm (red line), and gear changes at red line, fast and brutal.
Sport plus mode activated in PDK automatic after the update:
- The gear goes down in 4 and I will be at 3000-3500 RPM instead of 4000 RPM. Gear changes will be between 4000 and 6000 RPM. The update makes downsifts a little bit higher in gear and shiftings a little bit lower in RPM, but it's still fast and brutal. Crackles and pops in are still there..BUT, if I manually downshift with the paddle in 3rd instead of 4th or in 2rd instead of 3nd gear proposed by the computer in order to be at 4000-4500 RPM and I accelerate frankly, then the acceleration are between 4000 and 7800 rmp (red line) with gear change at red line, like the sport plus mode before the update. And it's still just as fast and brutal.
- In manual and semi-manual mode, the sport plus mode is the same as before the update as we can manage the gear and RPM to accelerate at full RPM and red line it.
Finally, I will say that the sport plus mode in PDK automatic after the update is more usable and pleasant (userfriendly) to use in street and on the city roads. We still have the possibility of finding the operation of the Sport plus mode as we knew it before the update in manual or semi-manual mode.
For my concern, I was skeptical and not sure before i decide to do it, but now is done. I do not regret the update and the change to the sport plus mode after the update because the difference is really subtle and in semi-manual with the paddles, we can find the behavior of the sport plus mode as we knew it before the update. So, it's OK.
Finally the impact and the changes of the update on the sport plus mode are minimal. I can drive my 991.1 with a smile and same pleasure, even during spirited driving sessions..
Nice write up Eloas. I agree the changes are not noticeable. One thing I thought I missed was the burble but as the car warms up they are there as they were before. Having the update isn't what others say it is, you'll not feel any changes and the power is all still there. That's my $0.02 worth.
Nice write up Eloas. I agree the changes are not noticeable. One thing I thought I missed was the burble but as the car warms up they are there as they were before. Having the update isn't what others say it is, you'll not feel any changes and the power is all still there. That's my $0.02 worth.
I'm in agreement. That's why I lost patience with the whining in my post above. If people disagree, then go out and get the data to sue Porsche if it's not what they say. Anything else is noise. In the end our cars still appear to perform as advertised.
I'm in agreement. That's why I lost patience with the whining in my post above. If people disagree, then go out and get the data to sue Porsche if it's not what they say. Anything else is noise. In the end our cars still appear to perform as advertised.
The problem with many on this forum is they believe what is good for them is best for everyone. But, we all do not wear a size seven shoe. I am sure the tune makes no difference for those using the vehicle for DD, running errands or even weekend canyon carving. But, the change in Sports + is a big difference for those few of us who heavily track their car. And you thank you for making my point about the lack of data for me…….Porsche has the data but refusing to provide it. You also might try to be less condescending (if possible) of those with differing opinions which I remind you is why this forum exists.
The problem with many on this forum is they believe what is good for them is best for everyone. But, we all do not wear a size seven shoe. I am sure the tune makes no difference for those using the vehicle for DD, running errands or even weekend canyon carving. But, the change in Sports + is a big difference for those few of us who heavily track their car. And you thank you for making my point about the lack of data for me…….Porsche has the data but refusing to provide it. You also might try to be less condescending (if possible) of those with differing opinions which I remind you is why this forum exists.
I'm not intending to be condescending. I'm simply saying to those that have differing opinions to go and get some data.
Perception is subjective - data is not. Anything else is a waste of energy and just emotion with no purpose and meaningless debate without hope of resolution.
We can argue this all day, but without data it's just hot air and tapping on keyboards to vent.
I'm not intending to be condescending. I'm simply saying to those that have differing opinions to go and get some data.
Perception is subjective - data is not. Anything else is a waste of energy and just emotion with no purpose and meaningless debate without hope of resolution.
We can argue this all day, but without data it's just hot air and tapping on keyboards to vent.
No….it is criticizing Porsche for not providing the data we all seek. Thank you. But you two previous responses were cloaked with arrogance and closed mindedness to any opinion that differed from yours.
Had my car on the track again last week, and while out for sessions I kept thanking my lucky stars that I didn't have this recall performed because Sport+ in Auto is brilliant.
04-11-2022 | 04:20 PM
