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I am beating myself up over suspension choice. Originally I had decided on KW HAS but now I am thinking for nearly the same money I can get H&R or Techart springs and a DSC controller. My experience with coilover height has always been set it and forget it. My car has S-PASM. I love the way it rides. In a perfect world I want the car to drive the same and be GT3 height.
I am also afraid the Techart will ride softer than stock after seeing people with base Carerra saying it rides like stock. The base Carerra spring rates are very soft. This C2S is on the plusher side of what I want out of a 911.
Does anyone know the height of GT3 vs height of H&R or Techart? I feel like the Techart look slightly higher, and H&R lower, then GT3.
H&R
Techart
GT3
Last edited by AdamSanta85; 07-13-2019 at 01:08 PM.
I don’t know the numbers but it is very slight if at all. I had a 991.1 with TechArts on it and I have a 991.2 GT3 and a 991.2 Cab. The GT3 might be a very little bit lower. I will add that my GT3 settled after a bit and the TechArts settle after a few months as well. That said I will never put TechArts on my cars again. I also have a 991.2 cab and while it sits a bit higher than I would like I won’t lower it until there is a coil over setup that works with PASM (Like the PSS9).
To make a long story short I installed the TechArts early in the ownership cycle and drive the car for 4 years. During that time I had not driven another 991.1. I went a test drove a 991.2 and was shocked how much better it rode than my car. I had noticed that the car had a tendency to porpoise a bit but thought it was normal. After riding in a stock car there was no going back to the crap bouncy TechArts.
Get the KW HAS or H&R has something similar called the VTF. I had H&R springs on my car then went with the H&R VTF.. ride is still very stiff, but lowered it to my liking. H&R drop was not low enough for me.
Get the KW HAS or H&R has something similar called the VTF. I had H&R springs on my car then went with the H&R VTF.. ride is still very stiff, but lowered it to my liking. H&R drop was not low enough for me.
Nice, you are the only person I've met that has the VTF kit. Does it ride any different than the H&R springs? (other than ability to go lower)
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I am going to give H&R a call tomorrow. Their kit is attractive as it is 1/2 the price of the KW. I want to confirm the spring rates vs the KW and PASM-S. I notice the H&R kit does not have helper springs. Also need to confirm it is compatible with PDCC. I would also like to know the spring free length on the KW vs H&R vs PASM-S. Can we maintain OEM spring length using coilover conversion vs springs?
Are PASM-S shocks a different part number/model than the PASM shocks?
I can't shake the feeling that the people that some of the complaints about stiffness of new springs are coming from cars with springs that are much softer (Base or PASM).
Spring Rates
Base 991: 24nm/48nm
PASM: 28nm/62nm
PASM-S/GTS?: 33nm/108nm <- me
KW HAS: 44nm/100nm
Elephant Stage 1: 52nm/96nm
KW VTF: ?
GT3: 45nm/120nm
Last edited by AdamSanta85; 07-14-2019 at 11:13 AM.
I have Eibach on my PASM/Cab 991.1 and it is not even a little bouncy. Still not as low as a GT3 but barely lower than a SPASM car. Also, there is no rake like the HR setups I've seen which I don't care for.
I have techart on my .2 it feels pretty similar to stock pasm. Although i have the dsc controller too which made a difference
Thanks. My suspicion from reading reviews is the Techarts are softer, at least in the rear, than the PASM-S. Even the KW HAS and Elephant Stage 1 are (slightly, 1 level) softer in the rear. I cannot verify because Techart will not release their rates.
Giving H&R a call when they open to talk about their VTF/HAS/Coilover conversion kit. After closer analysis I noticed that while they do not have a separate helper/tender spring, they do appear to have that integrated into their primary springs. Additionally they appear to be straight/linear rate, which from what I read, leads to best performance from the PASM system and the DSC sport. I need to confirm they work with PDCC and the rates. If the rates are similar to the KW, and I am struggling to see what (if any) extra value the KW or Elephant add for nearly 2X the price. H&R make all their parts in Germany, TUV approved, high quality.
Last edited by AdamSanta85; 07-15-2019 at 09:47 AM.
H&R kit does NOT work with PDCC. H&R does NOT publish spring rates. Disappointing.
So it looks like if you want a coilover conversion kit for PDCC you have Elephant or KW as your options.
Now not really sure what to do... H&R or Techart are a crap shoot with their unpublished spring rates, or KW or Elephant coilover conversion but damned pricey for what you get.
Last edited by AdamSanta85; 07-15-2019 at 02:41 PM.
H&R kit does NOT work with PDCC. H&R does NOT publish spring rates. Disappointing.
So it looks like if you want a coilover conversion kit for PDCC you have Elephant or KW as your options.
Now not really sure what to do... H&R or Techart are a crap shoot with their unpublished spring rates, or KW or Elephant coilover conversion but damned pricey for what you get.
Or get a full Damptronics Kit, I went from TechArt Springs to Damptronics and DSC. It's a fantastic combo. If you wanna go super Gucci there are always Tractive Options from TPC.
Or get a full Damptronics Kit, I went from TechArt Springs to Damptronics and DSC. It's a fantastic combo. If you wanna go super Gucci there are always Tractive Options from TPC.
That sounds amazing, and I considered it, but it is too rich for my blood at this time. I promised wife this car wouldn't become a money pit like my last.
I have a line on a used V2 DSC Sport box. Just need to determine if I am going to roll the dice on mystery spring rate H&R/Techart vs KW HAS. Huge price diff.... errrr. I wish the Techart was a tiny bit lower in back. The front looks just about perfect.
That sounds amazing, and I considered it, but it is too rich for my blood at this time. I promised wife this car wouldn't become a money pit like my last.
I have a line on a used V2 DSC Sport box. Just need to determine if I am going to roll the dice on mystery spring rate H&R/Techart vs KW HAS. Huge price diff.... errrr. I wish the Techart was a tiny bit lower in back. The front looks just about perfect.
Our rear shocks have a snapring adjustments that allows you to lower the suspension perch, so you can actually lower the rears a little.
I have a set of used TechArt Springs I would sell for pretty cheap from my 991.1. Here's my car on the TechArt.
Our rear shocks have a snapring adjustments that allows you to lower the suspension perch, so you can actually lower the rears a little.
I have a set of used TechArt Springs I would sell for pretty cheap from my 991.1. Here's my car on the TechArt.
Good info, but what a pain it would be to have to put it together, nope not low enough, back out it all comes, etc. I did a very scientific test at a car meet over the weekend. My car right now is 2 fingers gap, GT3/RS is 1 finger gap
07-13-2019, 12:48 PM
Techart/H&R vs GT3 height
