I will roll your eyes (my test drive experience)
#1
I will roll your eyes (my test drive experience)
I test drove 3 different 911s and here is my feedback, and questions for seasoned 911 owners.
Cars:
My feedback:
Note, this car will be my daily. My kids will be driven to school/day care (short rides) and once/twice a year my family of 4 will take it for an hour/so drive. So the gear box dilemma is relevant here in terms of comfort...
Thank you in advance.
Cars:
- T with PDK, front lift, and rear wheel steering, standard seats;
- T with Manual, sunroof, and alcantera steering wheel, standard seats;
- 4S with 18 way seats, sunroof, and PDK
My feedback:
- worst car for my criteria was 4S. I'd rather stay in my M3 than pay way more money for a 911 badge. Assisted steering (because AWD) just killed it for me...
- next car on my not so sure list is the T with manual. I was surprised not to like it. I had such anticipation but I could not figure out how the heck I can have fun with this gear box. The gears are too short and the throws are very short and then there is that 7th gear. I know I can get used to it but I felt I was constantly fighting with the car. As I was always busy with the gearbox I was not able to take in the feel for the rest of the car. I loved BMW manuals for 10 years I had it and I was expecting the P-car to beat BMW in this department especially that everyone says how great Porsches are. Perhaps M3 with DCT subconsciously converted me to dual clutch?
- The car I loved and now thinking to get was the T with PDK and (see specs above). I could feel the car size, its dynamics, where the wheels are and what is turning inside the engine (ok that's a lie but I lie to myself sometimes), it had that raw feeling also probably due to reduced insulation. The PDK is great and at least for me it makes more sense over manual. I'd like to mention that I think just think that RWS and Front Lift had to do a lot with why I loved the car. It felt so different from the other T. I guess the weights of the lift system made the steering feel heavier while the RWS made the car twist quicker.... just my guess. I wonder what would I say if Manual T car was also equipped with these options...
Note, this car will be my daily. My kids will be driven to school/day care (short rides) and once/twice a year my family of 4 will take it for an hour/so drive. So the gear box dilemma is relevant here in terms of comfort...
Thank you in advance.
Last edited by georgere; 09-24-2018 at 12:32 AM.
#2
Rocky Mountain High
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Maybe you should consider a GTS.
#3
#4
What do you mean ‘assisted steering’?
And why wouldn’t you want short throws on the manual T? Who ever wants longer throws?
And why wouldn’t you want short throws on the manual T? Who ever wants longer throws?
#5
Rennlist Member
I drove a carrera S with Manual, I could get used to it.
Drove a PDK as well.
but everywhere I look recommendation was get the manual with T and of course RWS.
ordered a T with manual and RWS -thats what you need to try.
and yes the thin glass and less insulation has a lot to do with it and that was another reason to order, feels so good when you start it.
manual car is lighter vs the PDK too. FAS adds weight too.
so I went with Manual/RWS/FAS and PCCB
you also get LSD/PTV with manual not with PDK
go with what makes you feel good.
plus you can put a stage 1 tune for it, which will take care of any power/torque itch.
time is running out on ordering the T
Drove a PDK as well.
but everywhere I look recommendation was get the manual with T and of course RWS.
ordered a T with manual and RWS -thats what you need to try.
and yes the thin glass and less insulation has a lot to do with it and that was another reason to order, feels so good when you start it.
manual car is lighter vs the PDK too. FAS adds weight too.
so I went with Manual/RWS/FAS and PCCB
you also get LSD/PTV with manual not with PDK
go with what makes you feel good.
plus you can put a stage 1 tune for it, which will take care of any power/torque itch.
time is running out on ordering the T
#7
Rennlist Member
Btw it took me weeks to decide on manual over PDK, PDK is awesome.
if I ordered any other 911 vs T it would be with PDK.
but T made more sense to me with manual. Many Ts out there with PDK.
you can’t go wrong with either.
if I ordered any other 911 vs T it would be with PDK.
but T made more sense to me with manual. Many Ts out there with PDK.
you can’t go wrong with either.
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#8
Three Wheelin'
You are right about the close ratio gearing of the manual. For everyday driving 7 speeds is an overkill. Yes, you'll be constantly shifting gears. As much torque and flexibility of the engine you have to question the rational of 7 spd. Its almost like for the manual shifting lovers, Porsche says fine, we'll give you 7 so you can shift to your hearts delight.
#9
After I tuned my GTS, it's even more fun. As strange as it sounds, it's even more fun than my 991.1 GT3 and my Lamborghini Huracan. Every time I drive it, I'm impressed by it. The S I drove felt slow, laggy, soft, and just underwhelming. The GTS blew me away and I ordered one on the spot after the test drive.
Maybe I'm talking it up too much and it won't live up to your expectations, but for me it's an almost perfect package.
#10
There is almost nothing an M3 does better than a 911 in performance aspects, handling, acceleration, cornering, track ability etc etc.
what an M3 will do better:
more comfortable for multiple passengers
better electronics (maybe)
better cup holder
and its core an M3 is based on a 100,000 unit people mover 3 series. The 911 starts as a performance car. You need more time with each car if you believe the M3 bettered a 911 in any performance characteristics...even though the newer ones are easier to drive well at speed, you still need time with the car.
All that said, the manual will give you that connection that only a manual will give you, while the PDK from a specs and numbers perspective is the better trans...but visceral, mechanical, romantic feel...it's the manual.
what an M3 will do better:
more comfortable for multiple passengers
better electronics (maybe)
better cup holder
and its core an M3 is based on a 100,000 unit people mover 3 series. The 911 starts as a performance car. You need more time with each car if you believe the M3 bettered a 911 in any performance characteristics...even though the newer ones are easier to drive well at speed, you still need time with the car.
All that said, the manual will give you that connection that only a manual will give you, while the PDK from a specs and numbers perspective is the better trans...but visceral, mechanical, romantic feel...it's the manual.
#11
Regarding short throws, sure I agree, the shorter the better, but after 10 years with BMW manual gear box, I thought if BMW is, let's say, red caviar than P-car manual got to be the black caviar, right?... during my test drive the p-car manual box felt like chicken tempura.... like I said, I was disappointed b/c I was about to sell my children in order to get the T with 7-speed and if I now go for PDK, I will need more children than I have
seriously though, I think its a learning curve for me now as I have not driven manual cars for 3 years and DCT in M3 got me spoiled... but I did like the PDK car better and for a daily car, why bother with black caviar and learning curve....
#12
There is almost nothing an M3 does better than a 911 in performance aspects, handling, acceleration, cornering, track ability etc etc.
what an M3 will do better:
more comfortable for multiple passengers
better electronics (maybe)
better cup holder
and its core an M3 is based on a 100,000 unit people mover 3 series. The 911 starts as a performance car. You need more time with each car if you believe the M3 bettered a 911 in any performance characteristics...even though the newer ones are easier to drive well at speed, you still need time with the car.
All that said, the manual will give you that connection that only a manual will give you, while the PDK from a specs and numbers perspective is the better trans...but visceral, mechanical, romantic feel...it's the manual.
what an M3 will do better:
more comfortable for multiple passengers
better electronics (maybe)
better cup holder
and its core an M3 is based on a 100,000 unit people mover 3 series. The 911 starts as a performance car. You need more time with each car if you believe the M3 bettered a 911 in any performance characteristics...even though the newer ones are easier to drive well at speed, you still need time with the car.
All that said, the manual will give you that connection that only a manual will give you, while the PDK from a specs and numbers perspective is the better trans...but visceral, mechanical, romantic feel...it's the manual.
Thank you for your reply however and let me ask you about your POV on current 911 for daily use. would u still drive manual or PDK every day including food shopping and haircut saloon?
#13
In my humble opinion, the GTS feels much, much better than the S. I didn't like the S I test drove one bit, so I was skeptical about even trying a GTS. I'm glad I did, because it felt like a completely different car. I'm not sure why, because on paper they should be fairly similar, but I guess the small differences add up.
After I tuned my GTS, it's even more fun. As strange as it sounds, it's even more fun than my 991.1 GT3 and my Lamborghini Huracan. Every time I drive it, I'm impressed by it. The S I drove felt slow, laggy, soft, and just underwhelming. The GTS blew me away and I ordered one on the spot after the test drive.
Maybe I'm talking it up too much and it won't live up to your expectations, but for me it's an almost perfect package.
After I tuned my GTS, it's even more fun. As strange as it sounds, it's even more fun than my 991.1 GT3 and my Lamborghini Huracan. Every time I drive it, I'm impressed by it. The S I drove felt slow, laggy, soft, and just underwhelming. The GTS blew me away and I ordered one on the spot after the test drive.
Maybe I'm talking it up too much and it won't live up to your expectations, but for me it's an almost perfect package.
#14
I know all about 911 (as a reader/YouTube 'customer') and have no doubt any 911 is better than M3 in sports category, but as I said 4S did not make me want it over M3 while other 911 felt much closer to what I am seeking in my next car.
Thank you for your reply however and let me ask you about your POV on current 911 for daily use. would u still drive manual or PDK every day including food shopping and haircut saloon?
Thank you for your reply however and let me ask you about your POV on current 911 for daily use. would u still drive manual or PDK every day including food shopping and haircut saloon?
well...I have a few cars (some vintage), so my answer is biased...if I had no other performance cars or vintage cars in my stable, I'd go manual. If I had or plan to add a vintage performance car anytime soon, I'd buy the PDK.
I have a 2013 991 carrera 2s and its PDK but I also have a 67 911 and three other manual trans vehicles...
#15
You are right about the close ratio gearing of the manual. For everyday driving 7 speeds is an overkill. Yes, you'll be constantly shifting gears. As much torque and flexibility of the engine you have to question the rational of 7 spd. Its almost like for the manual shifting lovers, Porsche says fine, we'll give you 7 so you can shift to your hearts delight.