Macca

Sure. But I think we are splitting hairs. Lined up side by side yesterday morning we were all surprised how the cars looked almost identical in length. Driving behind the GT4 for a few hours with red 991 GT3 in front of the 4 I had plenty of time to consider the aesthetic and dimensions from various angles and perspective. The sense of the GT4 being s smaller car is 100% attributable to the cars width not length or height. It is a noticeably narrower car when compared on the road behind a GT3. These are my personal observations only. I'm happy to add a GT4 but would not replace my 993 RS spec or GT3 with one.

It's a very good car for the money my biggest concern is its not a 911. I am a 911 snob and loyalist :-). Love the chassis dynamics of the rear engine layout and they don't scare me on road or track - in fact once you understand them can be turned to real delight and plenty of pace. 911 has heritage and history and I feel proud to say I own one/two.

But I'm without doubt that dynamically the GT4 is a great machine I'm just saying aesthetically I found it lacking in the flesh. You can't beat the muscular rear quarter panel bulges of the gT3 with the slab sided Cayman. No staggered wheel base and the lovely curved front fenders 911 IMO. All pure Coke bottle 911 styling cues...

PS edited on account of multiple mistakes due to failing vision and small iPhone ha ha

997rs4.0

Jimmy, thanks for the write up.

The gt4 sure is one of the best road cars out there. If you live in a area with great mountain roads or similar I would get gt4 over gt3! Really no need for the extra power in those situations.
But always a risk to go from higher HP to lower. Especially when you think you are in the same car. (Identical interior)
I'm very interested to hear TRAKCAR feedback after Sebring back to back RS vs gt4! I'm pretty sure he will continue to like PDK and more importantly the power.

Manifold

PDK in the GT3 is awesome. After 16K miles in the car, I'm not bored with the PDK, and I like having the option to put it in auto when I just need to get from A to B. The power is nice too. I can't make full use of the power of either car on the road, but when you want a few moments of thrust, the GT3 certainly delivers, accompanied by sounds which can leave you trembling.

Jimmy-D

I think Porsche really put together a nice package in the GT4. Actually, an excellent one. But, once again they neutered her a little bit. I know AP said they did not hold back but they did. But I can not blame them; they still feel compelled to protect the 911. They very well knew they were going to turbo charge all the 911 variants with more HP and torque so it did not matter if they threw 385 hp in a GT4.

Macca is right that the eye can not really catch if the GT4 is smaller than the GT3 when side by side. Look similar in size but the Cayman design, I believe, makes it look a little smaller. It certainly drives smaller though. Where I differ with Macca is I think it is the prettier car. But - I also understand it is hard to imagine that when you are obsessed with the 911 body and the whole evolution. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Really what it comes down to is superior handling and steering vs the engine and tranny of the GT3. And I say that because the engine and the tranny is what encompasses the 991 GT3. The perfect combination that will be revered for years to come. Even if one prefers a Manual the package that the GT3 puts out is a nasty combination.

I think for me the GT4 wins. If you are going to have to pick one car to keep ion your garage for street driving and you prefer a Manual the GT4 is amazing and I do not think there is anything better out there right now.. The first 20 min drive in the GT4 I felt a little underwhelmed from the engine because i just switched to the GT4. Than I let Mauro take my car out. He never drove a GT3 before. I think he was shocked by the power and exhaust noise of the GT3 . He looked as if he was in awe. But then I did not sense he would take it over the GT4. He sort of felt one would get in to trouble or go to jail with this car on the street. We both agreed the steering and handling of the GT4 is just amazing. I hope I am not putting words in to his mouth. But after that i jumped back in to his GT4 for another round and then I was not so underwhelmed by the GT4. It is a very competent and powerful engine. Sure, it is not 991 GT3 - but it is a different car/package all together that stands alone in the Porsche family tree

Manifold

^ Can't go wrong with either one ... and whichever one you go with, you'll wish you had the other one too!

On the handling, I can see how the GT4 handling may be viewed as better, but the limits of both cars are so high for the road that you'd have to do something really dumb to get the car out of shape. So I think it comes down to which one you find more fun to drive. On the road, I find them both comparably fun, though I'm a bit preferential in general towards the rear-engine feel. On the track, the GT3 is the winner for me so far, but I've only done one track day so far in the GT4 (on a track which isn't among my favorites), so I need to give it more time.

bronson7

Great comparison Jimmy. At this time I have yet to experience a GT4, hopefully soon, so as everyone knows, each and everyone of us would get some what of a different feeling. I'm wondering if each of these two cars had both LWB's in them, how much different, if any would the experience of been? There's seems to be no doubt that Porsche nailed it with both of these two cars. What clearly would be neat is to experience all 3 of them on same days, the GT4, GT3 and GT3RS. Hopefully one day for me. Once again, a great thread, thanks Jimmy!!!

pitt911

thanks for the comparison. I have not driven a GT4 yet, but was impressed with the spyder .I know the suspension is different between them and that is more in favor of the GT4. I have decided to keep GT3 and get a spyder.Down the line GT3 will be replaced by a lambo most likey Hurrocan.

Macca

I'm hearing really good things about the spyder on the road and track. In fact I think for fast road drives this could be a better alternative than the GT4 actually.

I went for a fast road drive on Sunday with my GT3. Once we got to the countryside and some tight twisty roads I got the chassis really moving underneath me. Those who have done fast road work or track will understand. I mean down hill tight flip flops under breaks, hard turn in on the gas and the car squirms and moves around but you have total control and the roars toon is Dublin (I'm not talking Chris Harris style show boating either). I just love getting into that zone in my 911. I've driven boxsters and caymans but they don't have the same "ride the snake" feel in those situations.

I have a very competent driver friend who is a bit of a road car legend in UK & Europe. He has many cars and does slot of Tarmac rally. He says with his GT3 he has enough power to get slip angles on the road but with his GT4 it's simply too planted. He believed it's over tyred for fast fun road driving. Before anyone uses the too fast for the road argument, he would tell you what he's talking about you'd go to jail in either car! These are things you learn running open speed events on the road such As Targa.

I believe all modern Porsches are somewhat over tyred for having ultimate fun on the road. The MPSC2 are too sticky as well. Better to put slightly narrower tyres on with 300 TW rating to have some fun in those mountains :-)

The GT4 will be fun Jimmy. I've watched you sway this way now for well over 6 months so it's not a surprise to met out are moving on. The GT3 is not for everyone and frankly as a road car the GTS is a far better proposition and more fun than GT series cars. The 911 will always have more cachet than a Gayman tho whatever it's guise it there is no arguing the later has superior dynamics just like 4WD v 2WD there is always something better sorted out there. Of course the flaws we call character but the 911 isn't the answer for all.

Porsche have been making "better" cars than the 911 since the 70s. The 944 was better balanced than the SC of it era. The 928 dynamically superior to most 911s for 18 years of production....but the 911 endures....because it's a legend.

neanicu

The GT4 doesn't move under hard braking. But I definitely noticed the rear moving in the GT3 under hard braking.
I am not saying it's a bad thing,but you have to be ready with your steering inputs. Also there's not as much weight load transfer under braking with the GT4,while in the GT3,you want to load up the front and once you have clipped the Apex you can go pretty much gorilla on the throttle. In the GT4 the transition is seamless.

TRAKCAR

Talking about manual fun...
This is fun. Give it 7 minutes, you're welcome!

TRAKCAR

Weird, I drove a Cayman racecar and a new GTS and both seemed less stable under braking and they do this weird rotation, nose in thing into the corner...

neanicu

Many have complained of understeer in the GT4,but that can be fixed with alignment.
The GT4 is definitely rock solid under hard braking,at least IMO.

konaforever

Glad you loved the GT4! It's my favorite car I've owned so far!

PistolPete

Thanks for the comprehensive writeup! I've also had some extensive seat time in a 991 GT3 and they are amazing in their own way. The only way to solve this dilemma is to own both!

That said, here are some more comparison photos between my GT4 and a friend's GT3

LND_2017 by Peter Moy, on Flickr

LND_1984 by Peter Moy, on Flickr

LND_1952 by Peter Moy, on Flickr

LND_1921 by Peter Moy, on Flickr

LND_1907 by Peter Moy, on Flickr

LND_1847 by Peter Moy, on Flickr

Manifold

I've threshold braked from high speed in both the GT3 and GT4. Both are comparably prone to some wiggling, but it can mostly be avoided with better modulation of brake application. Physics generally favors rear-engine for both braking and putting down power. Mid-engine has some advantage with respect to easier turn in and mid-corner adjustment, but many of us enjoy working to get the best out of a 911 in corners. So each platform has its pros and cons, even with respect to objective criteria.