non PTS paint problem, roof also
#16
Who is telling you this? You have sources at the paint department at Zuffenhausen? Because that is whom we have to hear from to get the correct answer to this problem which is apparently happening with a few new 991's! We don't need just more 'speculation' unless they are from a solid source that is identified and is willing to be 'quoted' for the record.
Saludos,
Eduardo
Carmel
.
Saludos,
Eduardo
Carmel
.
I'm also told it's impacting more than just 991s. But again, I can't name the person so you can believe or not.
#17
Race Director
Just trying to help the OP out and yes, I can't quote the person who gave me the advice. It's unwise to bite the hand that feeds you, no? I seriously doubt PAG will announce anything publicly. I'm also told it's impacting more than just 991s. But again, I can't name the person so you can believe or not.
Regardless, they should work on a ceramic type clear coat like some other manufacturers, because what they're using now is soooo soft.
Rubbing your finger on a black one, you can see how soft it is. Have a dry rough finger, that will even do the trick with no dirt even needed to push around.
#18
Race Director
This issue clearly seems to be the clear coat still curing and not being able to breath through the wrap which gives it a "hazed cloudy look".
This must be happening after the car is wrapped and the paint is still "breathing/off gassing" during the curing process.
Same reason PPG and paint makers have a 30-60 day window advising no PPF film, paint sealing, etc. after a body shop repaint.
My "theories" of course...
This must be happening after the car is wrapped and the paint is still "breathing/off gassing" during the curing process.
Same reason PPG and paint makers have a 30-60 day window advising no PPF film, paint sealing, etc. after a body shop repaint.
My "theories" of course...
#19
For clarification, my car is also black.
The 'spots' look a little grayish with some small, cricular scratch-like aspects. There is definitely a loss of depth. You also mention it's 'in the clear'; my spots are definitely superficial.
I can only see them under specific light conditions but they are visible - and a source of frustration. However, I decided not to go back to the dealer with this. It's my fault I didn't notice them when I picked-up the car. (I think adrenaline impacts my eyesight...)
The 'spots' look a little grayish with some small, cricular scratch-like aspects. There is definitely a loss of depth. You also mention it's 'in the clear'; my spots are definitely superficial.
I can only see them under specific light conditions but they are visible - and a source of frustration. However, I decided not to go back to the dealer with this. It's my fault I didn't notice them when I picked-up the car. (I think adrenaline impacts my eyesight...)
#20
Three Wheelin'
For clarification, my car is also black.
The 'spots' look a little grayish with some small, cricular scratch-like aspects. There is definitely a loss of depth. You also mention it's 'in the clear'; my spots are definitely superficial.
I can only see them under specific light conditions but they are visible - and a source of frustration. However, I decided not to go back to the dealer with this. It's my fault I didn't notice them when I picked-up the car. (I think adrenaline impacts my eyesight...)
The 'spots' look a little grayish with some small, cricular scratch-like aspects. There is definitely a loss of depth. You also mention it's 'in the clear'; my spots are definitely superficial.
I can only see them under specific light conditions but they are visible - and a source of frustration. However, I decided not to go back to the dealer with this. It's my fault I didn't notice them when I picked-up the car. (I think adrenaline impacts my eyesight...)
#21
Race Director
For clarification, my car is also black. The 'spots' look a little grayish with some small, cricular scratch-like aspects. There is definitely a loss of depth. You also mention it's 'in the clear'; my spots are definitely superficial. I can only see them under specific light conditions but they are visible - and a source of frustration. However, I decided not to go back to the dealer with this. It's my fault I didn't notice them when I picked-up the car. (I think adrenaline impacts my eyesight...)
Curious to see more pics. A good body shop should be able to give a good assessment.
You haven't lost your warranty on the car!
#22
This issue clearly seems to be the clear coat still curing and not being able to breath through the wrap which gives it a "hazed cloudy look".
This must be happening after the car is wrapped and the paint is still "breathing/off gassing" during the curing process.
Same reason PPG and paint makers have a 30-60 day window advising no PPF film, paint sealing, etc. after a body shop repaint.
My "theories" of course...
This must be happening after the car is wrapped and the paint is still "breathing/off gassing" during the curing process.
Same reason PPG and paint makers have a 30-60 day window advising no PPF film, paint sealing, etc. after a body shop repaint.
My "theories" of course...
#23
Race Director
Obviously this problem he didn't seem to be an issue before, so that might point to a new formulation of the paint?
The factory paint I'm sure is cured at a higher temperature than your normal body shop because they're only spraying the shell. They're able to crank up the heat more so than if you were putting the whole car into a booth.
#24
Race Director
For clarification, my car is also black. The 'spots' look a little grayish with some small, cricular scratch-like aspects. There is definitely a loss of depth. You also mention it's 'in the clear'; my spots are definitely superficial. I can only see them under specific light conditions but they are visible - and a source of frustration. However, I decided not to go back to the dealer with this. It's my fault I didn't notice them when I picked-up the car. (I think adrenaline impacts my eyesight...)
#25
You have nothing to lose by seeing what he dealer says. If common, PCNA will surely want to fix the issue. They made money off of you when you bought the car, but plan to make more money off of you in the future. Leaving unresolved problems like this are bad for future business.
Good suggestion. I'll contact my rep.
#26
I'm not at that house right now but I'll be there over the weekend and give it a better inspection. I'll also try to take a good, clear pic and post.
#28
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
so thinking about it, maybe this is why no PTS, issues w/all paint
In July when I went on factory tour, there were very few bodies loaded above assembly line, on of the other people on the tour said he heard it was because of paint quality issues in the paint shop; looking at my car, Ive seen this kind of thing with model cars, you get a weird discoloration sometimes, and then you sand it and it looks ok and then you clear and it seems fine and then later is discolors again and sometimes you have to sand down all the way to get it right, I hope that in time and sunlight the problem will fade, right now Im just bummed, its like dating a hot supermodel and then finding out she has a piercing on her labia in the shape of a Ferrari emblem
In July when I went on factory tour, there were very few bodies loaded above assembly line, on of the other people on the tour said he heard it was because of paint quality issues in the paint shop; looking at my car, Ive seen this kind of thing with model cars, you get a weird discoloration sometimes, and then you sand it and it looks ok and then you clear and it seems fine and then later is discolors again and sometimes you have to sand down all the way to get it right, I hope that in time and sunlight the problem will fade, right now Im just bummed, its like dating a hot supermodel and then finding out she has a piercing on her labia in the shape of a Ferrari emblem
#30
It seems the new clear needs more time to cure and as such cars with blemishes are being delivered. I'm told if you run your hand over it, pre-polish it will feel like a jelly fish. Very light wet sanding can apparently help get small amounts out but it probably will not be 100% perfect.
I did a little bit of digging to see if I could find something out - from what I understand PAG has changed the clear they're using and it seems to tie up with customers experience with QC problems. The speculation is that they're pushing cars out of the factory and applying shipping film too early.
Who is telling you this? You have sources at the paint department at Zuffenhausen? Because that is whom we have to hear from to get the correct answer to this problem which is apparently happening with a few new 991's! We don't need just more 'speculation' unless they are from a solid source that is identified and is willing to be 'quoted' for the record..
Just trying to help the OP out and yes, I can't quote the person who gave me the advice. It's unwise to bite the hand that feeds you, no? I seriously doubt PAG will announce anything publicly. I'm also told it's impacting more than just 991s. But again, I can't name the person so you can believe or not.
The rest of your statement was indeed conjecture: 'The speculation is that they're pushing cars out of the factory and applying shipping film too early!'. There is nothing new here. PeteyDaddy on his 'Maritime Blue' gt3 and Tpup on his 'Aqua Blue' gt3 discussed these issues with us at Rennlist. But notice that 911dev had similar experiences years ago with a previous (non-991) Porsche. Furthermore, we really don't yet know if 'dark knight' issue came from the shipping film on his car's roof. In fact, I was under the impression that 'dark knight' was based in Europe with our US Armed Forces or a Defense Contractor. He might have picked up his Porsche at Zuffenhausen without ever been touched or wrap in shipping film. We still don't yet know that important fact. That is why I asked him earlier if he was based in Germany and I hope he can help us with this bit of important information ASAP. In fact, we (at least I) don't know what type of 911 'dark knight' owns - or how old it is, when it was delivered, etc?
Good luck with solving that problem Dark Knight! At least you are in Germany (right) and can take it back to the factory if necessary for a proper 'fix'.
Just in case others don't understand the references to PTS 'paint problems', see post 63 at link below:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...nkencar-5.html
Just in case others don't understand the references to PTS 'paint problems', see post 63 at link below:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...nkencar-5.html
Saludos,
Eduardo
Carmel
.