Vandit

I'm new to this scene, and doing research, so what type of numbers can you get a NA 964 to put down? How high can you spin these engines, given it is appropriately built?

Thank you.

PorscheZen

Without 3.8 conversion: I'd say max just over 300hp -
Cheaper first - Starting with several mods under totaling under $1,000
K&N Filter (some say the full version, replacing the air-box)
Chip - for me it was custom configured
Cat-bypass
Primary muffler bypass
Single, RS pulley system (you can search this forum for info about that)
For these mods you are talking between 10 - 30hp gains but some would dispute those claims (260 - 280hp)

From an old post here - where mods that the owner claimed to bring him to 303hp (the most i've heard of)
Bosch MAF sensor
large bore throttle body
custom wrote chip
cat bypass
custom straight through exhaust
RS clutch and LWF
RS single pulley for alternator

raspberryroadster

think everything i have read agrees....so at best you may pick up minor gains at the wheels....and going to 3.8 is pricey option (maybe in conjunction with rebuild).

so guess as most agree if you want increased performance out of these cars - function of weight reduction / suspension & handling set up.

WHAT are you after Vandit?? are you coming out of american muscle??

Strega(UK)

Speak to ninemeister, they could give you 400bhp NA if your pockets are deep enough!!

Geoffrey

I have testing results from near identical engines, one with the RS 3.8 pistons, and one with some Ninemeister 3.6l pistons. The 3.6l engine made 7-8hp more than the factory pistons which are of a poor intruder design and limit their efficiency.

The engine in my 3.8RSR racing engine turns 8100 and produced 412hp on a chassis dyno, but has almost no 964 parts left in it.

RS-Basti

I have a 3,8L engine built by RS-Tuning in Germany. It has the mahle 3,8pistons, 4,5mm camshafts, a DW-Technik 44mm headers system, custom mapping by Ansgar Wiesen (he makes all mappings for Manthey Racing and many VLN teams) etc.
it has just made 344hp on a well known dyno

Vandit

I'm coming from a FWD 180hp Toyota wagon i've had since college that I will probably keep as a daily.

I'm looking at my first post-college car, something more serious. My list is very varied (e36 M3, e46 M3, wait a bit more and 996TT, 964 to build up, etc.). I kinda like to research my purchases to death so I know what i'm getting into and where I can go from there since I predict whatever I get will have a long lifecycle in my garage.

You guys in the mid 300s to 400hp range, what kind of pricetag comes w/ that type of power?

race911

Probably the most expensive known to man........... Seriously, something that's screwed together right is probably 2-3X the price of the underlying car.

roadsleeper

Amen... My 3.8l puts out around 360hp on a good day (revs to 7,200), and the rebuild labor plus parts was well in excess of US$50,000 (bull-market project).

Stating the obvious, but you are buying a 16-21 year old car, so there is a lot more than just the engine and outright horsepower to consider in terms of parts which need capex. Suspension and brakes are a key consideration.

If you're looking for a weekend fun/2nd car, and are the type who enjoys the character (and potential inconveniences) that comes along with owning an aircooled Porsche, think about getting a 964 that is as close to MY1993, and store some $ in the bank for the inevitable repair jobs.

If you're looking for something for the daily grind and weekend fun, the post-2002 E46 M3s on your shopping list are reliable, have 330hp under the hood and require minimal $ for upkeep.

That said, I drive my 964 every day, race clutch and all

Strega(UK)

In the Uk you will spend the price of the car again achieving 350-400hp.

R6XTERRA

You can get a stage 1 protomotive turbo installed with no engine mods and turn 375-385hp for probably about $9-11k usd

I went a little overboard and spent around $17k cdn. Getting it tuned Monday, can't wait. I added alot of extras and got my engine detailed at the same time, 996tt clutch, hargett valve covers and a full maintenance including valve adjust and plugs wires etc.

Jeff

911Jetta

A 964 sounds perfect then!

Don't worry about horsepower, a stock car in good condition will be fast enough! Really? Yes, because after drive a well sorted 964 you will start to understand what 911s are all about.

911s look, drive and feel different than anything else out there. Don't worry about hp/weight and 0-60 times. Believe me, this is a serious car, even at 20 years old!

After you own one for a while (and the nervousness of "what have I done!?" subsides a bit) you will look at each drive as an opportunity to learn how to drive the car a little bit better: be smoother, enter corners better...the whole driving dynamic is different. It's a very special car that you will feel proud to own!

Looks like you are in a good situation. You're post-school (for now), researching/shopping for the right car. If, as you mentioned, you're into long-term car relationships...it's time to start your Porsche adventure!

Oh, don't let me forget to say.... along the way you'll also meet tons of nice people...and occasionally go for drives in the country with your new friends...


and if embed is not working: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvrI5jHZHRc

race911

And that's the point of any 911, over any of the generations. Takes awhile for some to understand that, however.

I've enjoyed all of mine, from the '68 that briefly had a 2.0S before it became wildly modified, to the over-the-top '95 faux RS. But you've got to be smart on where you throw your money into the car. (Buying one already done, like my '95 works out great.)

TR6

Not to just repeat what was already stated above, but in simple terms, the first additional 10-20 hp comes "relatively"* cheaply. Above that, you'll need a second mortgage on the house to sponsor additional hp gains. That's why most of us stop at the first 10-20 hp gain.

Stock hp at the crank is in the 250-ish neighborhood. A good target for gain would be 260-270 hp. Someone above already mentioned a few tricks to get there. A well programmed chip (be careful, there are some poorly programmed chips I've run across), exhaust bypasses including a cat bypass will get you most of it. In my opinion, it has never been proven that the open airbox achieves any real gains, but it shouldn't hurt the power and it makes more noise which is fun.

You asked about how high you can rev. The weakness of the stock 964 engine is the valve train (retainers, springs). I strongly recommend that you keep the oem rev limit unless you have installed titanium retainers and racing valve springs. Even then, unless you've done other mods internally to gain more power in the upper range, it is a waste of time to rev above the stock limit, in my humble opinion. It's not worth the risk given the cost of failure on these engines if they grenade (ask me how I know). My disclaimer is that I am not a professional Porsche mechanic. I am merely repeating much of the advise that was given to me by more experienced people on this forum and from my mechanic when I had my engine rebuilt/upgraded.

*Relative for a Porsche.

sergiDA

Hi to all:

Reading this posts makes me think; how can a stage1 9M Motec conversion can take a nearly stock 964 to 330 bhp for 4000 Euro, when to get to 350/360 bhp a minimum of 30.000 Euro need to be invested...

Is there any way to explain that?

Thanks