Robert Linton

And the second to lazst 928GTS was to be the last until the VINS were changed.

TL-Register

This factory build widebody Speedster was offered for >150000 Euro ( about 195000 $ ) last year in Austria ...

regular Speedsters are offered in Europe from 60000 to 100000 Euro :

Speedster


Best

Norbert

Fraenkie993

Sorry, thats not correct: there were made between 930 and 940 ROW and US together; even Porsche AG dont know the absolutely correct number.

@Norbert: youve got mail.

Greetings
Frank

TL-Register

964 Speedster ROW: 96 Z RS 45 5 001 > 96 Z RS 45 5 581
964 Speedster USA & Kanada: 96 ? RS 46 5 001 > 96 ? RS 46 5 469

the first 60 numbers of each modelrow where blocked for testcars - if that was done with the 964 speedsters, there should be 930 all over the world ... Marc Bongers writes of 15 widebodys ?? - so 915 regular ones ...

Best

Norbert ( www.turbo-look.com )

cobalt

What is your source on this info? There is a lot of contradicting info out there. Some sources agree only a combined 936 were made with 425 coming to the US however all of those sources agree no widebody was offered or available at any price. Since the US speedster has a unique vin number distinct from the ROW speedsters and since these are not grouped in with cabs or C2's as any of these other supposed TL's are how can you explain the number of plus 5xx vin numbers that have sold on ebay and the few higher than 5xx vins I have seen in person. I can only assume Adrian's numbers are correct. It took me a while to convince him of his error regarding the 94 US turbos but he had quite a convincing argument about TL speedsters and vin numbers. If there were only 425 or so US speedsters made for the US there shouldn't be a vin that exceeds RS465425 but they do exist.

I find this perplexing don't you?

I would be happy to be proven wrong and have definitive documentation attesting to any of these cars. If the numbers are different than what all these years have taught us than it would be nice to have answers to all these questions. The 928 guys somehow were able to obtain all documentation about every 928 made there must be way to obtain this about the 911's and if there are holes in the documentation that match up with these oddities than I am sure we can draw conclusions then.

Fraenkie993

Yep, here is everything explained, thx to Norbert. I know a lot of written sources, which all agrees with this. Btw: i have been a whole day last year in the historical archive at PAG Zuffenhausen, there are more sources with this numbers. But they dont know it exactly themselves.

@Norbert: haste die Fotos bekommen?

Best regards
Frank

TL-Register

that unforunately not shows the number of peaces - but it shows that we have to count from 5061 ...

Best Norbert

cobalt

I agree this tells a different story however I have this same document in English as do many. If you post the rest of the info you will also see that not only do they list those numbers for 1993 US but for 1994 US models. Since these were only sold in the US as 1994 MY cars we either have another M718 situation as we did with the 94 turbo or this info is misleading. I will say that it seems as though the 1st 60 serial numbers of each MY are not used for whatever reason. I verified this by the info on the 928GTS which we know is complete and accurate. http://www.928registry.org/Master-928GTS-VIN.htm

This brings up a very interesting series of questions. Assuming you are correct on the count that would explain why I have seen 5xx serial numbered speedsters. I am not saying there were more or less made at this time. However, Now for the real confusion.

The 94 turbo first 288 cars were known to have been M718 coded. I did a lot of research in the past and we found vin# 288 to be M718 coded and vin # closely above 288 not to be 718 coded along with all the numbers above and into the 300's. So if the first 60 from both 1993 M718 and 1994 non M718 turbos were not used one might conclude that there are 120 less US 94 turbos shipped to the US. that would make 346 minus 38 Turbo S flachbaus and 17 turbo S package cars or roughly 291 Stock US 94 turbos shipped. I don't believe this to be the case. Although, if we go as far as saying only the 1st 60 of the P coded turbo 3.6 did not receive a serial number below 60 and the actual R coded 94's continued from 289 on up it would mean that the number is still less than 466 total including turbo S's by 60 cars or 406 in total or 351 stock turbo 3.6's We also know the last 94 US turbo 3.6's made were the turbo S's taking the longest to build and being completed by the werks department the last vin number used was 466 as shown here. http://www.flachbau.com/X85-USA.html

This would explain why we see many cars over and over again for sale but there are about 100 that never surfaced over the past 7 years I have been researching this. We also know that a number of 94 turbos were sent immediately to customers for IMSA racing so the total number of street stock US turbo 3.6''s continues to drop.

Apparently there is much more info needed about the 964 than any of the experts seem to have.

Although this makes me excited as it would appear my one of a kind US version turbo 3.6 is even rarer than was originally thought. To think my car is now only one of 291 or 351 stock turbo 3.6's

Thanks for the info.

TL-Register

I wrote a letter to Porsche a few weeks ago asking for access to Porsche PPN Network. To browse all cars in the database would be the only way to get a claer view on all those questions

I would have done allthough it would be a job for someone who killed father and mother, but Porsche gave a clear NO !!

Letter is shown on my site ( http://www.turbo-look.de/news.php?id=48 )

Best

Norbert

cobalt

I will have to take your word for it since I don't read German.

Although someone knew someone to get all the build info on every single 928 GTS.

Although I find it hard to believe that Porsche totaled 240 US and another 240 ROW GTS's over a 4 year period when only 406 US cars were delivered. These numbers mean only so much and we will probably never know the entire truth.

It would be nice to find an in at Porsche as the 928 guys did but for now I don't think we have any real facts only suggested numbers and what source you want to believe or reference is up to the seller I guess.

ttAmerica RoadsterAWD

What happened with those pics of the beautiful black wide body speedster? I wanted to save them to my hard drive

curve lover

Howzis??? Enjoy!

ttAmerica RoadsterAWD

Wow, Thanks!! That is one sexy beast! Almost looks like my car 'cept for the windhield and rear hump. I would love to be able to mount a speedster windshield. I hear it involves welding attachment points?? anyone know?

The Flying Dutchman

There have been different topics about the speedster parts(including the windshield, doors, glass, hump, mounting hardware for under the hump) on rennlist and pelican. I am following these threads since I hope to build/let one build for me another day in the future.

I remember LA Porsche Dismantlers sometimes have these windshields and other speedster parts, right?

Otherwise try to search these parts regularly on Ebay and other sites.

I seem to remember that the total of parts, excluding working costs for mechanics, was about 15000 US dollars (someone calculated that). But this was using Speedster doors I think. You could also adjust your regular 964 doors (right?).

I wouldn't mind mine (if I will ever own one) if it would be original or not. As long as it is very well build and looks original or beautifully adjusted (like the black one from Japan).

curve lover

Speedster windshield post on the 993 Forum's "Speedster type 993 photo thread"...