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Dead Cylinder - What Now?

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Old 12-23-2015, 04:12 PM
  #31  
mark kibort
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pull the engine! put it on a stand and start taking it apart. easier to do that, then try and pull a head with the engine in the car. you can have that engine out in 3-4 hours, with a friend ( ) taking your time.
otherwise, buy a new engine!
Old 12-23-2015, 04:14 PM
  #32  
FredR
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Originally Posted by zekgb
Very sure that I caught TDC on each cylinder and calibrated the HF tester correctly, however the tester only operates at 15 psi which in conjunction with the less than warm engine may explain the relatively high leakdown percentages across the board. After posting I got some PM feedback that this tester can also have undedected leaks at the base of the hose spark plug adapter, further skewing the results. So as Speedtoys says these
results don't really tell us anything other than #8 valves aren't sealing.
Kevin,

Sounds as though your results may well be skewed but have some relevance given your perception of a problem on No 8 and the relative numbers.

When I did mine, besides having the engine more or less at operating temperature, I marked the front harmonic damper at 90 degree intervals and then followed the firing order using a wooden spoon handle as a depth gauge to check TDC.

My compressor has a [decent] 50 litre reservoir and cuts off at 110 psig and you have to have a control margin between the reservoir pressure and the target pressure so I set a pressure of 80 psig and allowed the reservoir to run down to 90 psig before stopping the test. Fortunately I had excellent results with very little measurable leakdown but I could still hear something leaking into the crankcase [but not the inlet or exhaust].

That being said you clearly have some issues and sad to say it rather looks like the engine has to be pulled. I would not rule out fixing yours at this stage- I guess it all depends on whether you need to drive it any time soon.

Good luck

Rgds

Fred
Old 12-23-2015, 04:51 PM
  #33  
Cosmo Kramer
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Originally Posted by zekgb
Very sure that I caught TDC on each cylinder and calibrated the HF tester correctly, however the tester only operates at 15 psi which in conjunction with the less than warm engine may explain the relatively high leakdown percentages across the board. After posting I got some PM feedback that this tester can also have undedected leaks at the base of the hose spark plug adapter, further skewing the results. So as Speedtoys says these results don't really tell us anything other than #8 valves aren't sealing.
I don't know that tester but 15 psi seems really low to me. Not enough pressure to push the rings out and seal the cylinder especially on a cold engine.
Old 12-23-2015, 11:29 PM
  #34  
AO
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The motor can probably be brought back, but will require extensive disassembly to confirm. I suspect you have a couple bent valves and possibly a some broken rings on #6 and #7. You may want to try squirting in some oil and re-try to see if the numbers come up.

I think your best option is to get a replacement motor from Anderson and don't look back. You can do the swap in a long weekend with a friend or to helping.
Old 12-23-2015, 11:56 PM
  #35  
zekgb
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With the clock ticking on the half price sale I pulled the trigger today on one of Mark's engines today to be picked up after the holidays. At this point the plan is to refresh seals and gaskets (though I'm undecided on head gaskets, should I do them now?) and swap the newly finished fuel, intake and timing components over from the current engine. In the meantime I will get the engine pulled and do a post mortem to figure out if what's there is worth salvaging and give me some low risk practice doing things like removing the heads.

If I am (un?)lucky I will remain married after all this is done.
Old 12-24-2015, 06:33 PM
  #36  
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Good luck Zek. Just be sure to buy the wife a nice handbag and a trip to Bora Bora when this is done and over with.

Merry Christmas
Old 12-24-2015, 08:41 PM
  #37  
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We did this job. Small chip in the exhaust valve, like a mini slice of pizza. Took a while for the owner to believe it was really the cause (they tried de-carbonization, seafoam etc).

85 car, manual trans nice shape. So we pulled the motor, which was I think required. Went at all the things that needed to be renewed, mounts, cleaning etc. Got the one valve fixed, low miles engine was clean.

Now here's the stupidity. I said $xxx to replace injector o-rings do an injector service "Nope, put them back in as is" (Ok but stupid).

Starting the car up, sprays fuel because the o-ring had dried out, woof, fire, extinguish, powder all over the place, melted the outside of a harness, gawd.

Finally got the massive job all done, and it was horror show from there (in terms of getting compensation for parts and labor), that I care not to repeat.

Tweak needed with a cam chain tensioner and was running great.
Old 01-16-2016, 06:41 PM
  #38  
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Well Speedtoys came over today to get the heads off, and we found ourselves the same slice of pizza you found in #8. Here are pics of the left side valves eight to five, doesn't look like we have any pitting and absolutely nothing in the fire ring. Bores look good according to Speedtoys, all cylinders look similar to eight pictured below. Based on what we've found I'll send the heads out to get the broken valve replaced along with stem seals (and I guess guides measured for wear?), then get the heads back on and drop it back in. I guess I will end up either holding on to the spare I bought or trying to move it later this year either whole or parted.









Old 01-17-2016, 06:20 AM
  #39  
FredR
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Well- now you know what you are dealing with!

The $64 dollar question needless to say is why did this happen?

Rgds

Fred
Old 01-17-2016, 03:41 PM
  #40  
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Dredged these photos from the archives:

One little chip and so much work... why did it happen. I think it's a materials failure. A brittle fracture due to variance (lack of margin) through manufacturing.
Old 01-17-2016, 04:41 PM
  #41  
Imo000
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Are they going to lapp the other valves in too?
Old 01-17-2016, 08:20 PM
  #42  
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Eek. Not good.
Old 01-17-2016, 11:14 PM
  #43  
GregBBRD
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Valves burn in internal combustion engines....928 engines are not exempt.

Get a chunk of carbon stuck between the seat and the valve that the valve spring can't pound out and the extreme heat will burn a "v" into that valve.

You are going to find out that new valves for the '85/'86 models are hard to come by.....if you need a single used valve, I have some.

Send the heads out to a qualified machine shop, have them freshened, and bolt them back on.

I'd be happy to buy the engine you bought from Anderson for what you paid.
Old 01-18-2016, 01:46 AM
  #44  
zekgb
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Greg I'll take you up on both offers, PM me so we can work out logistics.
Old 01-18-2016, 06:32 PM
  #45  
zekgb
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Dropped the valves from #8 while at the machine shop for a quick look. Intake valves and guides looked great and the exhaust guides unsurprisingly were hammered. Planning on doing the exhaust guides but if the rest of the intake guides check out similarly tight does it make sense to do them anyway as a preventative?



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