BC

You *never* contribute anything. Just alot of words. And arguments. And incorrect conclusions.

But everyone already knows this. Except, of course, for you.

mark kibort

"never"..... really, is that why i have countless emails from those i have helped?? as well as my emails and notes to those that have helped you... all you do is post crap.... try and contribute.

as far as this discussion. ive just offered a few things here. was i right about the stock chip working better? was i in the right ball park by suggesting the injector size might be the difference between S4 and S3 with the same FR? was i right about the intermediate plate that helped a OP'er on the other thread fix his shift problems? even AO now has support cables so his splitter doesnt end up under a front tire and he ends up into a wall after going over the 80mph he has tested "his" version for! at 100mph and more, lots of things can happen! ive shown video of those kind of tests . or what about the 1000 other things ive done successfully that ive posted here to help others do the same? (by the way, ive received 2000 things from this list that has helped me!) All you do is make noise! seriously! man up and stop being such a complete ***!

by the way, in case you didnt read the title of this web site............ this is a discussion board. we all discuss ... that's the idea... ive only brought what i can as far as ideas and experiences to the table.. while all i really remember you ever doing is just the opposite.... make arguments and shoot insults. you better look in the mirror BC... .lots of projection going on.

in this situation, there is a lot of "discussing" goinig on. you wat to interpret this as "guesswork" go a head. but trust me, there are things happening that we havent found yet, so roundtabling for ideas is not a bad idea.

mark kibort

well, that might be one of many things that is not the same as the S4 system. anyway, i think that if you are getting 50psi and lean with the modified chip, its stands to reason that NO way will 5psi solve the problems!!! NO WAY... 5psi might change things a few points. you are no where near fine tuning mode at 14.5 to 15:1 AFR.... that is a serious difference... could the chip have some programming variance. lots of variables here... what about interaction of the ezk and LH

a dozen? really..... im at the track so often and never seen any real differnce between warm and cold tension. what problem are you referring too? less tension when hot... if so, i would see this and i just haven't! nor has scots or petty's motor. im sure im hotter than most anyone with oil temps at the track near 260F

possible, but i dont think that the fuel lines could be it. remember, he has seen his idle fuel pressure , go to WOT pressure, and stay there through the revs. (i dont know, but seem to remember something like 45 to 50psi WOT) this means no clog. something else is going on. could it be the EZK interacting with the injector duration on the LH?

you would think ... but maybe there is enough additional flow to effect pressure slightly.. just a thought. by the way, he has already proved we get 55psi when the system is jumped and no flow and no vaccum, right?
so, what happens when the engine is running? fuel is flowing and returning. the regulator is the only thing here that regulates pressure. even a clog wont do much at low fuel flows. conversely to your point, 24lb vs 19 shouldnt make a difference either... so hmmmmm

mark kibort

which fuel pump are you using?.. isnt the S4 pump different than the 85 pump ?

either way, again, 5psi is not going to drop the fuel ratios from 15-16:1 down to where you want to be for racing (i.e. near 12.5:1 and richer) NO WAY! So, there might be a programming issue with the aftermarket chip.

PorKen

AO hasn't recorded the fuel pressure at WOT with the filter changed. He stated only that it was around 45 psi at idle with the hose connected.

Typical manifold vaccum at idle is 18-20" hg, which equates to 9-10 psi. IE. with the vacuum hose connected at idle, pressure should be 45-46 psi with a S4-up FPR. With the hose disconnected or at WOT the pressure should be maintained at 55 ±3 psi or else there is a problem in the fuel system.

The FPR adjusts rail pressure to match manifold pressure so that the effective pressure of the fuel is the same on both sides of the fuel injector at idle and WOT. As manifold vacuum increases, less pressure is needed to spray at the same pressure. In other words, if the system had a FPR with no vacuum connection, running at a fixed fuel pressure, idle and part throttle would be too rich.


What kind of programming issue might there be that only affects this car?

AO

It's the stock FP. Pretty sure S3 and S4 are the same. Stock pump should be good up to 400-ish WHP, so it's not the pump. It's not the filter. It's not he FPR (unless the new one was bad out of the box, but static test shows' it's good).

It's not the injectors.

Only thing between the pump and the regulator is the front damper. So I guess that's next.

Brendan... c'mon dude. Please stop poking the bear. I'd like to keep this thread open until I solve it. Thanks..

mark kibort

sometimes there is errors that happen in electronics, and electronic circuits.. maybe these chips are immune to errors.

i already proved that there was NOT a direct PSI correlation between intake air vacuum and fuel pressure reduction. you can see when he lifts the throttle , there is an even greater reduction, but no where near the 25" of Hg that you can see on a throttle lift. the reason for this is the fuel regulator moves in proportion to this pressure differential, but not directly.
in otherwords, if you have -55psi of vaccum on the vaccum port is the fuel pressure 0? if that is what you are saying, thats not true. Remember, i already did some screen shots of what the vacuum was and what the fuel pressure was based on the intake vacuum..... the effect was about 4-5psi max with and without it attached.

the fact that the fuel pressure keeps the line pressure constant, has nothing to do with the fact that the manifold pressure pulls back fuel pressure a bit. the fuel pressure is most dominated by the fuel it self, building up pressure in the line based on fuel flow. the more it flows, the more the diaphragm closes the return line, this can be independent to manifold pressure. (manifold pressure can be 0, as in WOT), but the fuel flow will change, which means the fuel pressure stays the same because the diaphragm is moving open at the higher RPM for more fuel demands. you see, its not only a pressure regulator, its a volume regulator... that's how it works!

go put a pressure regulator on a S4 (or S3) and you will see your 55psi (or 38) with the fuel pump jumpered. Then, start the car. you will see 51-52 when its running, vacuum connected. disconnect, pressure goes up to 55psi. its not a 10psi drop with vacuum or 15 to 20psi fuel pressure drop on decel.
remember, i did this a long time ago! i used a sunx sensor to measure vacuum.. (very accurate)

mark kibort

yes, the stock pump has no problem to get to 400whp you are right. pump is fine. fuel pressure regulator can have some variance. especially since its probably 30 years old, but because it works statically, its probably not the FPR. how it responds to volume change is another factor. i dont think the dampers can be the issue. much of that needle movement, looks like it could have been engine vibration , but regardless, that i dont think is your issue . what about the vent lines....if you crack your gas cap, do you have a vaccum? if those lines are open to the atmosphere as mine are , that shouldnt be an issue. I cant think of anything else that would take system pressure down below static pressure unless the fuel regulator was at fault . injector size shouldnt be an issue either, nor should fuel pump pressure. its all managed by the FPR.

I wont worry about Brendan... .i think he might have been beaten as a child or something. we should just feel sorry for him.

BC

Most people are trying to help you - but he really is not. I've had similar issues, but usually its just something stupid. He just is like the retarded cousin everyone is polite to up until he knocks **** over.

The wide-band install - you said you will be putting it in a permanent place?

Have you already unplugged the o2 from the system to see what you can control with the MAF pot?

When you get the car going, can you see what the fuel pressure is at RPMs yet? You mentioned a go-pro.

What exhaust do you have? Is it an H-pipe? I had an H-pipe that had no connection from the exhaust pipe to the center section where the 02 sensor sat.

Hilton

Learn to put people on your ignore list There's still a "view post" link you can click to see it, and it saves a lot of clutter from posters who write large numbers of consecutive posts.

On an S3, does this just make the car go open loop? (on an S4, it makes the car run rich as buggery)

Given the mixture is ballpark on cruise, could be your MAF calibration is out of whack, so when the car's running open loop, its lean? My memory from Ken's threads is that the LH2.2 doesn't have an adaptation function.

This thread might be worth a shot:

https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...-85-86-us.html

mark kibort

those beatings as a child must have been hard to overcome. that with the small man's complex i see your need to lash out. we will give you some slack!

anyway, ive already had him do the WOT on the jack stands. (oh yeah, an idea that helped) .. you don't need to disconnect the O2 sensor, unless you want to check its function at idle or to see if the system does go open loop and it seems to be doing that.

I think he should have already checked out WOT and some RPM level too see if the mixtures are still lean and i think he said they are.

I dont think you can get much of a range with the pot on the MAF.. plus, thats doubtful its out of range.

Im still thinking the fuel regulator could be at fault , as its really the only thing that can regulate the fuel pressure unless you had some MAJOR clogs. again,

I am trying to help brendan, and your ideas are not only less valuable than mine, your posting arrogance to say that yours are better is a little anoying. he has perfect mixtures with the stock chip... this means the maf is good, o2 is good. the reason it falls down, is that the KEN CHIP makes things lean because the fuel pressure is too low (his words). its fine statically, but not fine dynamically. so, the cause of that is in the fuel system plumbing.

Im posting this to help, not to argue with a pencil tip minded internet knuckelhead like you . so...iyou just back off and take Hilton's advice. ignore my posts . your crap is just clutter here.

Hilton, its perfect with the stock chip.. and 50psi. Ken says at that level, his chip will make the car lean, but i dont think that 5psi will help a 15-16:1 mixture go to stock safe levels..... with the stock chip he is 12:1 and sometimes 11:1.
do you think the MAF pot adjustment can make such a difference in the AFRs?? if so, then what would his mixtures be at 50psi, with the stock chip if they are already 11-12:1 (all only being due to a 38 to 50psi increase to fuel pressure).

I agree, something else is going on.... and to Brendan's point (because i will admit, he sometimes does contribute), it might be "sommething stupid or simple"

Cosmo Kramer

I think a good workaround at this point is try an S3 regulator and stock chips and see what happens.

BC

I have never done that before. I just tried it. We will see how it goes.

GregBBRD

I remember when Kibort used to actually discuss things and exchange ideas....I actually used to respect him, because of how he did this.

Now, just personal attacks, way over the point where most people get banned.....

Seems like the goal should be to help AO solve his issue. Since the obvious things have been checked/replaced, I think any idea is worth considering. And frankly, I'm really doubting that Kibort has the experience to be an expert in this field....did that 6.0 car with the fuel injection problem (he was floundering with and asking a hundred questions about) ever get fixed?

I would guess there are other Forums where personal attacks/name calling might have some value.

Let's try and see if we can help AO fix his car.

mark kibort

Are you retarded? just bite your tongue, pass over my posts, whatever it takes.
can you just not help yourself?
Regardless, my only point of being here is to help... I dont have the answers, but i do have experiences and thoughts that might lead to a fix, as you might as well. so a word to from the wise... why not practice the golden rule here. you will be a lot happier my internet warrior!

Please let this side bar discussion of you not liking my posts end with this one.