IcemanG17

Todays out there idea..... 928 SPEC racing...

The Goal: Fun affordable racing with a V8....a simple to build car on a modest budget. A true $5k "gut and go" racer....

The Cars: I'd say any 16V USA pre 1984 928 (automatics encouraged!!)..use the lemons racer as a template....bilstein shocks with eibach springs....brakes must be S or OB....pad-lines-fluid is free.....engines must be stock with simple oiling mods & exhaust mods (no cats-smog junk)....claim dyno sheets-weights like NASA GTS so the cars can cross class to GTS2 (14.5 power-weight).... Must use stock 928 wheels up to 245/45-16 tires all around.....

Why do it....because all the other spec classes are BORING....they all run weak engines, typically gutless 4 cylinders that sound HORRIBLE.....get out there in a V8 powered machine that handles better than the American Iron cars...but everyone races in them because of the higher level of competition.....and relative low cost of entry....

Yes I know its crazy and probably will never happen...but seriously...how many guys that run spec944 wouldn't want to run a V8 928 with much more performance (I beat all spec 944 lap times right now by a wide margin) for the same or less $$$$

danglerb

I think its a great idea, and if you use DOT tires on stock 7" rims could be the gforce would be low enough not to have oiling issues, and perhaps increase the challenge of driving with stock hp? Stock brakes would mean the driver has to pay attention in how they are used.

Landseer

You describe the way I want to run our USA 5 speed. I don't know much about classes, but if we do it, it will run pretty much stock. Will do rod bearings, maybe the early sump/pan arrangement, sport shocks, stock wheels. 85/6 exhaust manifold. Cage. If we can't run like that, then we can't run at all.

S4ordie

Not enough 78-85 cars left to build out enough racers to have spec class competition. Other than that I like your thinking.

Mike Frye

I disagree. There are lots of the pre-S4 cars available at under 4-5k, especially if you don't care about the condition of the interior. Most have 'gremlins' and issues but those are usually with the fiddly bits that wouldn't matter on a race car (electrics and other interior doodads). Used engine can be had for a phone call and a couple of thousand from 928 intl.

I'd love to do this if it were anywhere near me.

S4ordie

Your last quote is one of the reasons why. How many 944's versus 928's were mfg'd and shipped to the U.S.? How many potential 928 owners that will build and race a 928? Not enough to field much competition unless you are assuming the majority of 944 Spec racers will switch which in effect increases demand over supply of raceable 928s.

Does it sound like a good/fun concept? You bet! Is it feasible with today's inventory of 78-85 cars and 928 owners interested in a Spec racing series? Probably not.

AO

Hey... that's one way to increase the value of our cars. Reduce the supply. I'm in. Been wanting to to a track car project anyway. All races must be held at Road America in Elkheart Lake, WI. Hacker will buy the beer.

Landseer

I believe that right now is kind of a witching hour for early 928's. When a car sits, especially on dirt, and starts to take moisture on, rate of decay has to increase dramatically.

What irks me is watching straight-bodied project cars move from becoming driveway ornaments to being backyard, behind-the-shed rotters. They don't even have the chance to leave the world dignified as parts for other cars.

There are many to choose from as a base for a low-dollar, high-fun track vehicle.

GlenL

PCA allows "certain 928s" in their SP3 class.

The problem isn't a lack of cars, it's a lack of racers. A "cheap" race car will still cost $5000 to prep and the costs to operate are near $2000 a weekend.

Sab

How do you get to spend $2000 on a track day?

Tom. M

We are trying to get going on our group up here using the SCCA platform. One of our locals was told that if he could get 5 or 6 928's to race in the SCCA ITE Class, we would be able to run our own sub class. The economy has pretty much held us back from getting out there...but once things stablize, I think we can muster up the numbers. It won't be as cheap as what you're proposing..(I'm guessing $10k starting point) due to the SCCA requirements. Adam B's car is much cheaper at this point but he's gonna need a bigger engine at some point, and a full cage.

GlenL

Track day? No. Race weekend.

Hotels, meals, tires, brakes, gas, oil and entrance fees. Then there's breakdowns and repairs, and I'm not counting that.

A lot of that is variable and personal preference but some guys spend a lot more.

When I'm at the track most of the racers fall into two groups. OK, one big group and one small group. The big group is rich guys. The small group is young DIY guys who put everything they have into it. Middle-class family guys are doing DE a few weekends a year.

taffelman

The idea is not too far "out there". In UK a spec 924 class has been running for nearly 20 years. http://www.porscheracingdrivers.co.u...che-racing.php

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...onship%22&aq=f

genikz

You can do a race weekend for less than $500. I currently have a 944-Spec car (working towards my competition license) and have done at least a dozen DEs. No weekend has cost more than $500 for me.

I flat tow the car, sleep in my truck and bring a cooler with all the food and drinks I need. Many guys have huge trucks, enclosed trailers and drive to a motel; but, you don't have to make the weekend cost that much.

Toyo RA1s or Nitto NT-01s are very durable and have lasted me more than an entire season. I would rather see a 17" rim for the Spec rules, but obviously ugly stock wheels are easy and cheap. 16" wheels limit your race tire options though.

I'm working with Michael J. ("Black28" on the 'list) to build a '78 928 track car and I would love to fit the mods into a SPEC series. The other option is NASA PT (classes based on power/weight), but I would really enjoy a Spec series since spares can be shared and the cars will be equal.

The 944 guys are fantastic to run with, but I want more power!

mark kibort

Yep, 5k for a cheapo 928 in race prep, and $8k for one like mine.

No regarding the costs per weekend. I agree with brian's two class of racers.
big hitters, or wanna bees and econo-racers like me.

Hey, I always finish in the top 3-4, and always against the big hitters.
(big hitters meaning, always using new tires for the weekend, sleeping in $100k plus moble homes, or hotels, dinners out, supported by pros or family/friends that know what they are doing and do ALL the wrenching, etc.)

I , Howeever, am in the econo group. I have a pretty fast car, and I dont spend a dime on it. in fact, I havent spent any money on this car all season long. tires are free, (or near free as I use others tossed away tires and I have a collection that could last for the next 3 seasons) AND all I spend money on is gas, entry fees, brake pads and oil changes about 2-3 per season. thats it. timng belt every 3 seasons, 10,000 combinded street and race miles. I sleep at the track, eat their food or bring my own, and thats the weekend. I added up everyhing spent last season and that was a full season, and it was less than 500 per weekend. prior to that, with the holbert car for 8 years /full seasons of racing, it was near the same, even adding in any things that broke or needed replacing along the way, and that list includes my defective holbert cam replacement with '85s, new wing mounts, timing belts, and JB weld .

With a 928, and its the only car I can say this about, you can have a pretty stout and fast car for very very cheap. Ive built and raced quite a few now and nothing has surprised me as far as what it takes to race one. Once you get those headers, rims and suspension, you are on your way after doing the normal refreshing of the things that can hurt the engine. (ie water pump and timing belt) find me a car in the world that can run a 1:38 at laguna with a set of headers, rims and a highschool level of street sport suspension, as its ONLY mods. Now, go find a car like Brians with out the wheels mod and make it a much older and cheaper 928. see if you can run a 2:09 at thunderhill with a free car and only rims and tires.

I think a spec 928 is a great idea . evey town in america has a older 928 for cheap. short blocks are cheap too, so even if it needs a motor, its just labor from being restored like new.

Talk about fun. Brian is right on, as Ive race everything from a 79 stock 928, to the fastest 928s out there, and there is nothing like the feel of a 928 on the track when fully gutted. wide, low, stable and the best part is the sound!!

mk