AO

I voted to put it in, but Hacker has a really good point. You need a shark tuner to properly tune that monster. You need to pull timing and get your fueling curve right than add back timing to prevent knock. This will take the better part of a day at the dyno to get right - that is with someone who knows what they are doing.

While my emotions say put it in... intellectually, it makes sense to wait until the off-season to do it right so you can really take advantage of the extra power and get max life out of the new motor.

SwayBar

+1 on what Hacker said. Wait until you have all the proper pieces in place before dropping in the new engine.

Amongst other things, let's say you decide to run the stock heads and intake on the 6.5L. That combo will produce massive amounts of low-end torque, and it will only be a short while before you blow something in the drivetrain coming out of a corner.

You may 'only' be in 2nd place now, but at least you are driving the car and having fun versus sitting in the pits with a DNF and wondering how you're going to fix/replace the tranny.

Plan it out carerfully and take your time with the new engine; in the meantime, have fun out on the track with the stock Holbert! That Holbert engine would have broken a long time ago, but it hasn't, so it shouldn't anytime soon.

You need the seat-time so that next time out at Road America, maybe you'll get a decent lap-time!

AO

Seat-time... lap-time... ? When did this become a strip club discussion?

69gaugeman

So then what 4 or 5 days for mark to do it? He has 4 weeks (2 if you take two to put it together and in.)

I think even Mark could learn to use a shark tuner in 2 weeks. I am pretty sure the group could get a shark tuner to him to use.

Since when do have intellectual sense when it comes to the 928

BC

+1,000,000,000

dr bob

Mark--

Clean the whole engine bay like you mean it. Drain all the motor fluids. Pull everything off the motor that you can-- the whole top end down to the heads. The whole front end accessory mess. All the stuff that will get transferred to the new motor. Get all that stuff cleaned and ready to bolt to the new block.Pull the wiring connectors at the CE panel and stuff them through the firewall. Undo all the plumbing. Unplug the front engine harness and start removing it as all the accessories come off. Lots of pictures and mark every wire connection before you remove them. Drop the clutch and flywheel, start unbolting the bellhousing bolts. Disconnect the hydraulics for the clutch. Remove the oil pressure sender assy. Go get the engine hoist and arrange for the engine stand if you don't have one already.

Then when Bill gets there the assembly and install will go a LOT faster.

Just a thought. Pulling the radiator and loosening the headers sounds like a look in the right direction, but there's plenty to do. Get in touch with the Professor and book some Sharktuner time with him if there isn't someone closer. Gentle break-in miles on the way to his place, right?

pcar928fan

So, what you guys are saying is hope the S2000 breaks so you don't have to end up 3rd or 4th, vs. getting at least a few extra HP that might help you retain where you are at now and do some big time tuning along the way.

If you are confident you can make the engine run ok and make more HP than you are currently making that will help you out right away...in time you will be able to tune the thing more and more.

I have never built and engine, so if building this thing with the best ability you have will result in LESS HP until a FULL tuning is done then yea, stick w/ the Holbert motor, I was under the impression that in building this engine you were confident you would have more HP right out of the shoot. That is what you need and if you plan to finish on the podium you need to be proactive about it.

Great rewards require great risks, going the slow and steady way will put you in 5th place! SUCK!

Jim bailey - 928 International

The real ISSUE is Mark must take the Holbert engine apart down to the short block and then BUILD the new engine up from the short block BEFORE any installation. He needs to cannibalize the Holbert engine down to where all it is is the block crank rods pistons....so IF he takes it that far apart it is not just a swap back it in should he NEED IT.... At this point in time he needs to BUY an S-4 engine with thrust bearing failure and use THOSE parts to make an engine out of the stroker short block. That keeps the running Holbert engine a COMPLETE SPARE ENGINE. Anything else it just plain STUPID!! His running Holbert engine has value . Iit RUNS best to keep it that way. The comments about preparation , oil cooling , tuning are very valid as well. If he rips apart the Holbert engine throws together the stroker and stuffs it it the car in a mad thrash takes it out to the track with no cooler , no tuning , little running time, what if he blows it up !!!!!! He then has NOTHING and no running Holbert engine. Season lost ,stroker lost, Holbert engine lost .... STUPID ! He might have just enough of his "shoestring" racing effort left to hang himself.

mark kibort

Since all of us have to drop one race, and the Vet hasnt missed or broken, the S2000 has broken 2 times, but when running it wins. If i miss a race, and win the remainder, Ill end up where I am today, placewise . Probably 2nd or 3rd.
Points are 28 for 1st, 26 for 2nd, and so on. 14 race season, with a couple counting for double points.

Mk

Charley B

Since one race is dropped you probably have more like six weeks to play with if needed.

Jim's point of using a different 5.0 to cannibalize is a good one.

I doubt that a Dyno and Shark Tuning is critical to tuning the new engine to run safely and strongly, unless there is something that fragile about a 928 stroker I've never heard of. Certainly it's needed to maximize the potential, but not safety and strength.

Four to six weeks should be plenty of time for a good install plus tuning.

All easy for me to say, of course. I don't have much invested.

Mako 928

After thinking about this and then reading others posts I am torn. As jim pointed out there is MUCH lost if all things do not go right. Time seems to be the biggest factor. The heads should be re-done and that puts you on someone elses schedule. A rushed job is an invitation for problems and these could be very bad problems.
Having said that I will be happy to lend a hand with the install, weekends work for me. Let me know.

Bill Ball

There are soon to be 2 Sharktuners available for tuning in the local area. Didn't a lot of strokers get built and run very well w/o Sharktuning? This isn't going to be anything like the ~575RWHP Tim Dey's Beast or Louie's monster. We should be able to run it with 24-30lb injectors w/o any serious tuning, but if we have 6 weeks, Shaktuning should be feasible. As to where to get the heads and other parts to compete the motor, and whether he needs a complete back-up motor, that's up to Mark.

Jim bailey - 928 International

Remember guys how LONG it often would take for DEVEK to build a stroker. And 6 weeks is what 12 weekend days , last I checked Kibort was still working a regular job, has a wife and children ... I have seen cars taken to the track without any shakedown time and it OFTEN is not pretty. Very nice of all of you to offer your help and it probably can be done but a lot of things have to happen for it to be right. Running 2nd or 3rd is far better than not running at all !! Mark do you have a gasket set ?? the correct head gaskets ??

Ispeed

I would say don't even attempt this until after the season. A bunch of people helped pitch in for the new engine and it would be wrong to gamble damaging anything because you are in a hurry.
Otherwise, do it now and don't worry about hurrying and making the next race. If you can't win anyways, then who cares about your finish in the points. Use your time now to get tuned for next season. Maybe even save some money for new tires...

I raced motocross for 20+ seasons, and I would never go to the track with untested stuff. It had to be bulletproof, fast and feel right. Just my .02c

Bill Ball

Most of time involved was waiting for the crank and whatever pistons and rods were picked for whatever target. In this case, isn't the shortblock completely assembled already?

Personally I don't care if Mark does this now or later. But if the shortblock is done, then this is doable. Yes, he should get a gasket set, injectors, etc. Of course, if he wants to do any other mods, like an I-J windage/scraper and/or pan spacer, then I'd say hold off too.