mark kibort

I am 8 races into a 14 race season with SCCA. Currently in 2nd place down by 6 points to the very fast and getting faster C5 Zo6 vet, and ahead of the S2000 by 15 points after his DNF this past Laguna Seca weekend.

This means that the S2000, if he doesnt break the rest of the year, will end up winning. The vet and I would be battling for the next 4 weekends, or 6 races.
Its possible that if i beat him at Infinion and Thunderhill and he only beats me at Laguna, he might still win, or get 2nd in the championship. the S2000 would be able to catch me by averaging a place or so ahead each of the remaining races and probably get 2nd.

So, since Ive had a great season so far, but kind of sick of 2nd place in the championships, would it be worth it to start on the engine transplant to the 6.5 liter with 4 weeks before the next single race weekend at Thunderhill?
I probably could get it in and get it broken in and dyno'ed before the next weekend.

I probably could use this race to shift at 5000rpm max, get a 2nd or 3rd place and get it race tested so that the next weekend i could start going all out.

I might even be able to win at 5000rpm shifts, if the hp is near 360rwhp!

Im also struggling about taking the engine out of the Holbert machine. Another factor on my mind is taking the Holbert components off and putting them on the new motor, but I dont have much choice there.

I think, worst case, the Holbert engine comes out, gets torn down to a short block and stored for a rainy day as a backup.

101 race days last race weekend. Kind of a miracle car!

mk

pcar928fan

First of all I do not understand this statement at all: Currently in 2nd place down by 6 points to the very fast and getting faster C5 Zo6 vet, and ahead of the S2000 by 15 points after his DNF this past Laguna Seca weekend.

This means that the S2000, if he doesnt break the rest of the year, will end up winning.

You are ahead of him, but if he just finishes the rest of the races he wins???? HUH? I must have missed something.

As to the engine transplant, it is not like you are throwing the old engine away! Put the damn 6.5L in and kick these guys A$$E$ dude! If/when you want to sell the Holbert (nee Kibort) car either give them the original engine or put it back in and keep the 6.5L for whatever your next 928 race car is... No biggie.

The only concern is can you actually get the engine in, tuned and broken in BEFORE the next race?! If you can't do that then you just have to keep running what you have now...

Good luck and keep us posted!

dr bob

Over 11 people tossed money into the pot to get a more competitive engine built for your toy. My guess is that the intent was to have the engine put in the car, not use it as an expensive parking bumper. Is there a time better than now to get the edge needed to win?

mark kibort

If he doesnt break, he ends up winning races (thats what I ment) . He is now 2 seconds faster than me and 1 second faster than the C5 Vet at up to 395rwhp and 2400lbs. More than likely, if he doesnt break, he will win most of the next 6 races.

I think you guys are mirroring what the other racing fans are saying. "Just Put the engine in and do it NOW, like this weekend!"

Ok, so do we have any takers to try and get this thing out of the holbert car.
I'm thinking we need to get this thing built back up. (i can finish the long block during the week) and put this back in by the 2nd weekend of July. then, 300-500miles and ill dyno it and hope it is ok on fuel ratio. Then, its race time!!

Heck, I built that euro 5 liter, ran to tahoe and back and then raced it in a brutal POC race at buttonwillow the next weekend after a quick dyno run!

Mk

mark kibort

I think you are right! However I thought it would be available to swap out in the off season. However, it might even be worth taking the chance that might cause a missed race, or find another car to race. (rental?? borrow my buddies M3, etc to get driver points). Hmmmm. Bill, still have my old Black '79?? kidding!

mk

Mako 928

A couple of ways to look at it:
1). If you are asking the question you already know the answer. In other words Pull it now while you are motivated to do it and "get er done".
2). Since you have been "runnin the snot out of it" you run the risk of blowin something and will be forced to pull it and re-build it anyway and we all know that never hapens when we want it to.
So it seems now is the time.

Bill Ball

This weekend is booked. I can make time almost any day next week. Let's do it.

mark kibort

Thanks Bill!! Ill get started on as much as i can do on my own.
(crack the crank bolt, pull the headers, and get the radiator out.)

Maybe next Saturday??

Thanks,

Mark

Charley B

Possible scenario.

You miss one race then win the last five.

I don't remember SCCA point structure.

Where does that leave you?

Hilton

James hit the nail on the head.. pull the holbert engine, put in the new one, and while you're at it, document the inside of the holbert engine for all 928 fans and performance enthusiasts - for all we know, its no different to the clubsport and SE blueprinted engines, but at least we'd know Rebuild it at leisure, and if/when you want to sell, put it back in fresh (and original).

If you can get the stroker in before the next race, broken in and tuned, do so. Otherwise, hold off until there's a gap big enough between races. A lot of us get a real kick out of a 928 stroker or SC kicking *** and showing what Porsche could've done with the platform

Edit: Just read the rest of the thread..

jon928se

What he said - go for it now - even if it needs some tweaking to get it up to scratch this season thus you get worse results than you may have got with the holbert engine you'll only have forsaken a 2nd place in the O/A results and will have some race miles on the new engine under your belt ready for next season ready and rarin' to go.

SeanR

At first I was leaning towards voting for using the Holbert engine the rest of the season but after thinking about it. Yank that thing. It's a piece of history and I'd hate to see it blown up. I'm sure there are a few people that would love to take some measurements of the internals while it is in decent shape.

Get the stroker in there and don't blow up either one.

cold_beer839

I agree, pull the Holbert engine and preserve it now before something bad happens.

Put in the stroker engine, run the hell out of it, and win the championship.

hacker-pschorr

Pipe dream

Unless Mark hires someone who really knows what they are doing to tune this motor, doing a mid-season swap is a disaster waiting to happen. Wait until the off season when you have plenty of time to not only assemble the motor, but tune it PROPERLY.

Excuse me for being a dick, but when I say tuning it properly that means someone other than Mark. Great driver yes, engine tuner he is not (neither am I).

This engine will need a different fuel and ignition curve to reach it's full potential. Last time I checked Mark does not own and has yet to even use a Shark Tuner. I wouldn't use a $10,000+ motor to practice on.

Someone will probably bring up Mark A and Joe F's car. Good example, they PAY SOMEONE ELSE to tune their cars. Not a bad idea.

Few weeks ago I was helping out with a friends race prepped ZO6 at the dyno with one of the best tuners I've ever met at the helm. This is a 2001 with a new 7 liter race engine under the hood. Nothing in the stock map was retained by the time the tuning was over. This was performed on a brake dyno, going from cell to cell, changing the load while finding the "sweet spot" for each area in the curve. Once the fuel is dialed in, you start all over with the ignition.
Doing any other way is half assed.


Mark,
Have you talked to Todd about building the motor? What size oil cooler are you going to install? Have the lines yet?

JEC_31

+1

Exactly why I voted "finish the season with the Holbert motor".


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Mark,

I hereby offer my services in assisting with the post-tear-down investigation of the Holbert Motor. I run Coordinate Measuring Machines and can perform 3D scans into CAD data (reverse engineering).

- Josh