Parts supplier troubles - what would you do?
05-10-2008, 11:31 PM
#92
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As suggested above, I'm not sure working on your own car would be the preferred solution in this situation. While better parts suppliers will readily replace defective parts that they inadvertantly might distribute, it is usually optional, particularly for electrical parts. Can you imagine the angst there would be if an untrained enthusiast trying to save a few bucks purchased an expensive Jetronic control module and accidently burned it out on installation? Who should be liable? Who can prove who burned the part out? That's a tough bullet to bite for everyone and the reason electrical parts are particularly vulnerable. It happens. I understand why there's usually a no return policy on electrical parts that have been installed.
If one wants labor charges covered in the rare chance of a bad part, a good approach is to just have a high end shop or Porsche dealership do the installation....WITH PARTS THEY PROVIDE...NOT WHAT THE OWNER PROVIDES. Then, the dealership is responsible for standing behind their work (and the part) and it's their responsibility to settle with their parts supplier or eat the reinstall labor cost (and the owner is out of a confusing loop). Their high overhead is adjusted for this. However, if you have a parts supplier that's trying to keep parts prices low (any of the big 3, etc.), a local shop doing the labor, and the cars owner providing the part....there are just too many opportunities for confusion over who's legitimately liable if the repair doesn't work out.
Porsche dealerships charge high labor rates to help cover periodic labor situations like this. In this case, I think the 928 parts dealer went above and beyond. How could Rog test each part in inventory? Should any of the big 3 be liable for labor related to a bad part when their supplier won't pay for the labor? No! Sometimes, crap happens.
It's a sensitive issue. As a buyer, I once bought a damaged part from a mail order parts dealer (not an electrical part). It was packed well but the parts dealer had overlooked a small but critical damage. I didn't attempt to install it and returned it as I received it. The parts dealer reluctantly replaced the part with a good one. Because of their reluctance to replace, I got the impression that they thought I had caused the damage. I seldom buy from there any more because I felt that my integrity was in question (and maybe they're pleased that I don't come back!).
In the final analysis, if a buyer is not happy with a parts supplier, a shadetree mechanic, or a high end dealerhip, they should vote with their billfold and look for a better arrangement elsewhere. In this case, using a Porsche dealership would have avoided this problem. You can't get Cadillac level service with a Yugo budget strategy.
Of all the parts suppliers, Rog is one of the most sensitive and conscientious in making sure that customers are pleased. He bends over backwards, but even he can only do so much as he has mouths to feed too. If anything, he's kind and trusting to a fault.
If you want to experience frustrating service, buy off of eBay....maybe you'll save money on the Chinese waterpumps, fuel pumps, and other parts passed off as Porsche or Bosch.
H2
If one wants labor charges covered in the rare chance of a bad part, a good approach is to just have a high end shop or Porsche dealership do the installation....WITH PARTS THEY PROVIDE...NOT WHAT THE OWNER PROVIDES. Then, the dealership is responsible for standing behind their work (and the part) and it's their responsibility to settle with their parts supplier or eat the reinstall labor cost (and the owner is out of a confusing loop). Their high overhead is adjusted for this. However, if you have a parts supplier that's trying to keep parts prices low (any of the big 3, etc.), a local shop doing the labor, and the cars owner providing the part....there are just too many opportunities for confusion over who's legitimately liable if the repair doesn't work out.
Porsche dealerships charge high labor rates to help cover periodic labor situations like this. In this case, I think the 928 parts dealer went above and beyond. How could Rog test each part in inventory? Should any of the big 3 be liable for labor related to a bad part when their supplier won't pay for the labor? No! Sometimes, crap happens.
It's a sensitive issue. As a buyer, I once bought a damaged part from a mail order parts dealer (not an electrical part). It was packed well but the parts dealer had overlooked a small but critical damage. I didn't attempt to install it and returned it as I received it. The parts dealer reluctantly replaced the part with a good one. Because of their reluctance to replace, I got the impression that they thought I had caused the damage. I seldom buy from there any more because I felt that my integrity was in question (and maybe they're pleased that I don't come back!).
In the final analysis, if a buyer is not happy with a parts supplier, a shadetree mechanic, or a high end dealerhip, they should vote with their billfold and look for a better arrangement elsewhere. In this case, using a Porsche dealership would have avoided this problem. You can't get Cadillac level service with a Yugo budget strategy.
Of all the parts suppliers, Rog is one of the most sensitive and conscientious in making sure that customers are pleased. He bends over backwards, but even he can only do so much as he has mouths to feed too. If anything, he's kind and trusting to a fault.
If you want to experience frustrating service, buy off of eBay....maybe you'll save money on the Chinese waterpumps, fuel pumps, and other parts passed off as Porsche or Bosch.
H2
05-11-2008, 01:14 AM
#93
Team Owner
Did you know that Roger knows his way around the Rolls Royce Merlin Engine, and he is an aircraft mechanic by trade......... Plus his passion is to assist others in keeping their machines in top condition.......... Thanks for being such a stand up guy Roger, you clearly put others before yourself, that is a characteristic that some people are not blessed with.
Rogers path is filled with integrity............... Integrity is what happens when no body is watching !
Rogers path is filled with integrity............... Integrity is what happens when no body is watching !
05-11-2008, 01:23 AM
#94
Hell, I work for the guy and didn't know that 1st part.
05-11-2008, 01:41 AM
#95
Team Owner
we got started on why my screen name is Mrmerlin and it just took off from there.........
05-11-2008, 03:00 AM
#96
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Quick search of DMV turns up no licensed dealer under California Classic Cars which is a violation of numerous California laws. No one may broker or sell cars with the intent to make a profit without the proper license ,a zoned place of business for retail auto sales, very complete record keeping and compliance with numerous required forms and disclosures. Over the years I have found that people who expect others to be dishonest usually base that on their own behavior.
05-11-2008, 03:05 AM
#97
05-11-2008, 04:25 AM
#98
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we need to keep this thread front and center for a bit, IMHO.
This is a typical situation of unrealistic expectations.
Did the OP ever pay for the switch? We all know how Roger will wait to send an invoice.
This is a typical situation of unrealistic expectations.
Did the OP ever pay for the switch? We all know how Roger will wait to send an invoice.
05-11-2008, 05:48 AM
#99
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ok, i'll bite
in the interests of bumping the thread, if you want to share...... why mrmerlin, anything to do with the engines?? and who is the lady in tresamores sig??
Geoff
in the interests of bumping the thread, if you want to share...... why mrmerlin, anything to do with the engines?? and who is the lady in tresamores sig??
Geoff
05-11-2008, 01:50 PM
#101
Team Owner
Well a long time ago when the I net was getting started for the masses, I really like the P51 Mustang and since I am a Pilot I thought that a screen name that had something to do with the Mustang would be cool, so it took about 12 different names before this one was acceped so there you have it.
My other screen name is Petie3rd, do a search........ WW2 P51 Mustang from the Blue nosed Bastids of Bodney.
This one came about since i was playing the Fighter duel puter game, it has a Blue nosed Mustang on the box that had Petie2nd on it so i tried Petie3rd and it worked , then a few months later i am scanning through a WW2 aircraft magazine and there is this most awesome painting of Petie3rd Taking off from Asch Germany and shooting down a FW 190 as the wheels are coming up. Needless to say the framed Pictures hanging on my wall.
And then i got to chatting with Roger and then he started telling me about his exploits with English aircraft and such........What an interesting backround he has
My other screen name is Petie3rd, do a search........ WW2 P51 Mustang from the Blue nosed Bastids of Bodney.
This one came about since i was playing the Fighter duel puter game, it has a Blue nosed Mustang on the box that had Petie2nd on it so i tried Petie3rd and it worked , then a few months later i am scanning through a WW2 aircraft magazine and there is this most awesome painting of Petie3rd Taking off from Asch Germany and shooting down a FW 190 as the wheels are coming up. Needless to say the framed Pictures hanging on my wall.
And then i got to chatting with Roger and then he started telling me about his exploits with English aircraft and such........What an interesting backround he has
05-11-2008, 02:03 PM
#102
Owns the Streets
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Wow. I know Rog isn't young but never knew he worked
with RR prepping the awesomely massive engines for war.
Thanks Rog. Without the Merlin, I doubt if WWII would have turned out
the way it was.
Can't wait till Rog moves the firewall and cabin back, do a backseat delete and
shoehorn a Merlin into the 928 engine bay. Probably need to split the radiator
to get the engine in.
with RR prepping the awesomely massive engines for war.
Thanks Rog. Without the Merlin, I doubt if WWII would have turned out
the way it was.
Can't wait till Rog moves the firewall and cabin back, do a backseat delete and
shoehorn a Merlin into the 928 engine bay. Probably need to split the radiator
to get the engine in.
05-11-2008, 03:35 PM
#103
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I did my techical apprenticship at Dehavilland in Hatfield England. Which became Hawker Siddely and than BAe. Spent most of the time in the flight test hangers where I worked on the only flying Mosquito at that time. It was owned by John "cats eyes" Cunningham - Chief Test Pilot. I had the pleasure to fly with him often. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Cu...m_(RAF_officer)
Flew on a lot of the first test flights of the Hawker Siddeley Trident and HS125 aircraft.
I was on a test flight of a HS125 and he was demonstrating short take off and landing capabilities to some customers. The claxton that warned you to put down the undercarriage was annoying everyone so he stuffed a rag in it. On our final approach for landing we nearly did a belly landing because he forgot to put the gear down and it was only a screamed warning from the tower that prevented it happening.
In the linky above it refers to him hitting a car on the peri track. What it does not say is that his wife was in the car and IIRC she was killed.
Flew on a lot of the first test flights of the Hawker Siddeley Trident and HS125 aircraft.
I was on a test flight of a HS125 and he was demonstrating short take off and landing capabilities to some customers. The claxton that warned you to put down the undercarriage was annoying everyone so he stuffed a rag in it. On our final approach for landing we nearly did a belly landing because he forgot to put the gear down and it was only a screamed warning from the tower that prevented it happening.
In the linky above it refers to him hitting a car on the peri track. What it does not say is that his wife was in the car and IIRC she was killed.
__________________
Does it have the "Do It Yourself" manual transmission, or the superior "Fully Equipped by Porsche" Automatic Transmission?
George Layton March 2014
928 Owners are ".....a secret sect of quietly assured Porsche pragmatists who in near anonymity appreciate the prodigious, easy going prowess of the 928."
Does it have the "Do It Yourself" manual transmission, or the superior "Fully Equipped by Porsche" Automatic Transmission?
George Layton March 2014928 Owners are ".....a secret sect of quietly assured Porsche pragmatists who in near anonymity appreciate the prodigious, easy going prowess of the 928."
05-11-2008, 03:58 PM
#104
Just read this thread and can't believe anyone would trash Roger. FWIW I've spent a decent chunk of money with him and the service has been just the best, fast and accurate, not to mention friendly and helpful. And I only have to pester him for invoices once in a while. 
Roger you're a great asset to this community, thanks for all you do!
Roger you're a great asset to this community, thanks for all you do!
05-11-2008, 04:40 PM
#105
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Unlicensed auto dealers are rampant in SoCal. It's become an established institution in that area. There are books that instruct you on how to become a "curbstone" seller and skirt the law.
In this case, you will notice how all the cars are displayed in a public parking lot or on the road. You will notice how he describes some of them as his own cars. You are allowed to sell a limited number of personal cars in CA, of course; however, if there is intent to make a profit (and the webpages in this case expose this intent), the number is ZERO. You will notice none of the vehicles are identified by license plate or VIN, as is required by state law. You will notice there is no business address, only an email address. There is no mention of a state dealer license. State laws require disclosure of dealer license in ALL forms of advertising, such as his webpages.
I got burned by an unlicensed dealer in SoCal a long time ago on a purchase of a 560SL. I eventually got my money back and he got put out of business. Depending on the number of vehicles involved, the fines can be stiff and there can be jail time. Things get MUCH more serious for the curbstoner if no sales tax was collected and paid on the sale by the business as this brings in the State Board of Equalization. There are a host of other requirements which California Classic Cars does not appear to be observing. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d05/vc11713.htm
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d05/vc11713.htm
CA DMV and Department of Consumer Affairs have taken a greater interest recently in combating unlicensed dealers.
http://wardsdealer.com/ar/auto_dmv_eases_off/
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/newsrel/n...06/2006-22.htm
http://test-www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/news...06/2006-31.htm
In this case, you will notice how all the cars are displayed in a public parking lot or on the road. You will notice how he describes some of them as his own cars. You are allowed to sell a limited number of personal cars in CA, of course; however, if there is intent to make a profit (and the webpages in this case expose this intent), the number is ZERO. You will notice none of the vehicles are identified by license plate or VIN, as is required by state law. You will notice there is no business address, only an email address. There is no mention of a state dealer license. State laws require disclosure of dealer license in ALL forms of advertising, such as his webpages.
I got burned by an unlicensed dealer in SoCal a long time ago on a purchase of a 560SL. I eventually got my money back and he got put out of business. Depending on the number of vehicles involved, the fines can be stiff and there can be jail time. Things get MUCH more serious for the curbstoner if no sales tax was collected and paid on the sale by the business as this brings in the State Board of Equalization. There are a host of other requirements which California Classic Cars does not appear to be observing. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d05/vc11713.htm
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d05/vc11713.htm
CA DMV and Department of Consumer Affairs have taken a greater interest recently in combating unlicensed dealers.
http://wardsdealer.com/ar/auto_dmv_eases_off/
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/newsrel/n...06/2006-22.htm
http://test-www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/news...06/2006-31.htm