Honda rods and Mahle slippers (pics)
#1
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Hi to all, here's a few pics of some of my engine's private parts. The new parts save over half a kilo per rod and piston. Plus I would also anticipate more saving from when the crankshaft is cut down for the journals and balanced for the lighter componants.
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/rod_comparison.jpg)
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/piston_comparison_top_view.jpg)
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/piston_rod_assemblies.jpg)
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/piston_rod_assemblies_side_view.jpg)
The rather eerie thing is somebody has etched the numbers 928 into the side of the rod cap, how is that?
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/rod_comparison.jpg)
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/piston_comparison_top_view.jpg)
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/piston_rod_assemblies.jpg)
![](http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/piston_rod_assemblies_side_view.jpg)
The rather eerie thing is somebody has etched the numbers 928 into the side of the rod cap, how is that?
Last edited by slate blue; 09-24-2005 at 03:29 PM.
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Damn, that is a short skirt. Do you expect more blow-by?
Cheers Greg
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Originally Posted by Greg Gray
The rather eerie thing is somebody has etched the numbers 928 into the side of the rod cap, how is that?
#9
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What size honda rod is that?
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Originally Posted by Sterling
ut oh... Brendan......
I'm just keeping tabs for when I put the GTS crank I have into a bored motor. That will be the monster.
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Quote:
I have total seal rings which I'm told are very good.
I had those in my engine. They caused problems with the alusil and scuffed the cylinder. Posted by Jim Nowak
I have total seal rings which I'm told are very good.
I had those in my engine. They caused problems with the alusil and scuffed the cylinder. Posted by Jim Nowak
As to skirt loadings, my rod to stroke ratio is about 1.85 to 1, so that is just considered a long stroke motor, 1.8 is considered the changeover point. I don't see any reason to machine the block as the crank's outer dimensions wont change. Rememer that the stock crank gets stroked out to about 86 mm, which means with these rods all 928 cranks can out stroke a GTS.
As to the 928 no, it is on all of the rods and it was put on buy hand, yes Errka I am familiar to what you are saying though.
These rods as far a power capabilty goes, are the bees knees, they would happily hold these pistons at 9500 rpm and 800 hp +. These are Nascar componants. Honda rods are actually stronger than the standard size rods by the fact that they are smaller. Less weight, but the bigend (circle) that holds the pins is stiffer because it is smaller, it is the crank if anything that would be weaker. (The other nascar componants are the valves, Ferea 7mm and the tappets have been micropolished by a Nascar guy, then to be DLC coated)
My engine will only rev to 7500 rpm so the mass forces will be less than that of the standard engine at 6500 rpm. Likewise the bearing speed will also be less and as such the frictional losses will be less. Honda rods are said to save 7 hp at 7000 rpm versus standard rods. This doesn't take into consideration that longer life due to less stresses and the revability of the engine due to lighter weights.
I would like to see somebody turning down 928 cranks and making these mini stroker kits, this is the reason I am publishing all the info to do this job. I think in all, 10 kgs could be saved from these engines which makes them pretty light when compared to the 4 valvers. Factory weight for the 2 valver is about 245 kgs and the 4 valvers are from 264 to 266 kgs if I am correct, so it could be 235 kgs, a saving of 30 kgs, that is quite a saving, I certainly wouldn't like it 30 kgs dropped on my toe.
#13
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Can you tell us more about the Total seal rings (as you suggest - normal gapped rings, but custom)?
Also, are the Honda rods off the sheft pieces - i.e, could this be re-created with basic directions? I forgot if you ground a stock S4 crank or something else.
Also, are the Honda rods off the sheft pieces - i.e, could this be re-created with basic directions? I forgot if you ground a stock S4 crank or something else.
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Hi Brendan, as to the custom bit, there isn't a off the shelf chrome ring made for 4.060" in 1.5 mm. So I had Total Seal make some up. Standard type ring but 1.5mm in chrome.
The Honda rods are off the shelf but can be expensive new, in the top brands like Carrillo and Lentz from about $1500 to $2500. These normally come with the reusable Carr bolts, which are a $400 upgrade over standard bolts. Somebody asked me some details about the rods and the big end diameter is 1.888" however I know Honda would never use such a size more like 48 mm. But as I suspect the guys in the U.S. have just decided to use something very close and call them Honda.
I don't know if scat or eagle make cheaper rods, I bought mine on Ebay, got lucky as mine are perfect but I have seen a few rough sets I wouldn't touch.
Cheers Greg
The Honda rods are off the shelf but can be expensive new, in the top brands like Carrillo and Lentz from about $1500 to $2500. These normally come with the reusable Carr bolts, which are a $400 upgrade over standard bolts. Somebody asked me some details about the rods and the big end diameter is 1.888" however I know Honda would never use such a size more like 48 mm. But as I suspect the guys in the U.S. have just decided to use something very close and call them Honda.
I don't know if scat or eagle make cheaper rods, I bought mine on Ebay, got lucky as mine are perfect but I have seen a few rough sets I wouldn't touch.
Cheers Greg
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Since I have been on the rennlist, I have not seen anyonetry building a stroker by this method.
Great idea. Have you gotten quotes by machine shops to turn down the crank so it will accept the honda rods? Any quantity discounts? See any problems with oil journals after turning down the crank?
The design for the pistons is radically different too. Were they modeled after the honda as well or some other design?
What is the proposed CR ratio on this unit, for potential boostards who may consider boost and a stroker?
Sorry for all the questions, but this is very intruiging.
Great idea. Have you gotten quotes by machine shops to turn down the crank so it will accept the honda rods? Any quantity discounts? See any problems with oil journals after turning down the crank?
The design for the pistons is radically different too. Were they modeled after the honda as well or some other design?
What is the proposed CR ratio on this unit, for potential boostards who may consider boost and a stroker?
Sorry for all the questions, but this is very intruiging.