Holy cow, an automatic S4 is a ton of fun around town
09-12-2017, 07:34 AM
#46
Rennlist Member
That Porsche change things is no surprise - why they would change such is of more interest.
When I acquired my 90 S4 I found the 2nd gear start most unsatisfactory and was very pleased when I modified the setup as per guidance from this list [back around May 1999] when I was battling the slipping front flexplate clamp.
My GTS was the same- start in second- that situation lasted about 30 seconds!
09-12-2017, 09:30 AM
#47
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Thanks for the links Landseer.
Very informative.
BTW, driving from a complete stop in my car in 2-3-2-3 is real fun!
This will give you to start in first gear (shift lever in 2), then go to the second gear (shift lever in 3 and back to 2 quickly to stay in second gear) then in the third gear (shift lever in 3).
Very informative.
BTW, driving from a complete stop in my car in 2-3-2-3 is real fun!
This will give you to start in first gear (shift lever in 2), then go to the second gear (shift lever in 3 and back to 2 quickly to stay in second gear) then in the third gear (shift lever in 3).
Last edited by Bertrand Daoust; 09-12-2017 at 11:20 AM.
09-12-2017, 11:24 AM
#48
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
My '84 starts out in 2nd when in D
Then your 84 needs adjustment, when out of adjustment it will exhibit 2nd gear start. We can discuss and debate, but at the end of the day the transmission should start on first from a stop when in D... neither installation of the shift kit that strengthens the 2/3 and 3/4 shifts, nor the B2 piston upgrade will affect this fact on 84,5,6, 6.5, or early 7 transmissions. BTW, the kit service parts mentioned fit all the 4speeds. The second gear start for the later S4 was actually a shift program change, ie, a (minor) change to the hydraulic logic in the valve body.
See attached word file excerpts from the 1988 MY service documentation. It states that the change to 2nd gear start ( under normal acceleration ) was slowly phased in during the 87 production year, and that prior 4 speeds all utilized first gear start.
( not trying to be a know it all, but spent my first 5 years in this sport reading the Morehouse CD ancillary obscure wsm documentation in order to fix t neglected cars. Had to do quite a bit of study to attempt to repair an 84 with broken parking panel and cracked case. Ended up replacing with an 89 that does start in second. Have forgotten lots of it, but this piece I remember.)
Then your 84 needs adjustment, when out of adjustment it will exhibit 2nd gear start. We can discuss and debate, but at the end of the day the transmission should start on first from a stop when in D... neither installation of the shift kit that strengthens the 2/3 and 3/4 shifts, nor the B2 piston upgrade will affect this fact on 84,5,6, 6.5, or early 7 transmissions. BTW, the kit service parts mentioned fit all the 4speeds. The second gear start for the later S4 was actually a shift program change, ie, a (minor) change to the hydraulic logic in the valve body.
See attached word file excerpts from the 1988 MY service documentation. It states that the change to 2nd gear start ( under normal acceleration ) was slowly phased in during the 87 production year, and that prior 4 speeds all utilized first gear start.
( not trying to be a know it all, but spent my first 5 years in this sport reading the Morehouse CD ancillary obscure wsm documentation in order to fix t neglected cars. Had to do quite a bit of study to attempt to repair an 84 with broken parking panel and cracked case. Ended up replacing with an 89 that does start in second. Have forgotten lots of it, but this piece I remember.)
09-12-2017, 12:48 PM
#49
My '84 starts out in 2nd when in D
Then your 84 needs adjustment, when out of adjustment it will exhibit 2nd gear start. We can discuss and debate, but at the end of the day the transmission should start on first from a stop when in D... neither installation of the shift kit that strengthens the 2/3 and 3/4 shifts, nor the B2 piston upgrade will affect this fact on 84,5,6, 6.5, or early 7 transmissions. BTW, the kit service parts mentioned fit all the 4speeds. The second gear start for the later S4 was actually a shift program change, ie, a (minor) change to the hydraulic logic in the valve body.
See attached word file excerpts from the 1988 MY service documentation. It states that the change to 2nd gear start ( under normal acceleration ) was slowly phased in during the 87 production year, and that prior 4 speeds all utilized first gear start.
( not trying to be a know it all, but spent my first 5 years in this sport reading the Morehouse CD ancillary obscure wsm documentation in order to fix t neglected cars. Had to do quite a bit of study to attempt to repair an 84 with broken parking panel and cracked case. Ended up replacing with an 89 that does start in second. Have forgotten lots of it, but this piece I remember.)
Then your 84 needs adjustment, when out of adjustment it will exhibit 2nd gear start. We can discuss and debate, but at the end of the day the transmission should start on first from a stop when in D... neither installation of the shift kit that strengthens the 2/3 and 3/4 shifts, nor the B2 piston upgrade will affect this fact on 84,5,6, 6.5, or early 7 transmissions. BTW, the kit service parts mentioned fit all the 4speeds. The second gear start for the later S4 was actually a shift program change, ie, a (minor) change to the hydraulic logic in the valve body.
See attached word file excerpts from the 1988 MY service documentation. It states that the change to 2nd gear start ( under normal acceleration ) was slowly phased in during the 87 production year, and that prior 4 speeds all utilized first gear start.
( not trying to be a know it all, but spent my first 5 years in this sport reading the Morehouse CD ancillary obscure wsm documentation in order to fix t neglected cars. Had to do quite a bit of study to attempt to repair an 84 with broken parking panel and cracked case. Ended up replacing with an 89 that does start in second. Have forgotten lots of it, but this piece I remember.)
Thanks for the info. I am by no means well versed on the proper/intended operation of the auto. And no doubt my car is somehow improperly adjusted. It sat for 10 years before I bought it and got it running earlier this summer, so that would not surprise me. I will say however that it shifts very smooth, and 2nd gear starts don't bother me knowing that if I want 1st gear launches I just move it into "3" or "2" and go.
Your last bit got me thinking. I wonder if my car possibly has a later build tranny? The car came with absolutely no mx history. Is there a way to identify the build of the transmission while in the car from underneath? Is the build number visible?
09-13-2017, 04:48 AM
#52
Rennlist Member
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...ivities-3.html
That should help explain how to decipher which automatic is in your 928.
09-13-2017, 12:32 PM
#53
Nate, check out posts #29 and #30 here:
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...ivities-3.html
That should help explain how to decipher which automatic is in your 928.
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...ivities-3.html
That should help explain how to decipher which automatic is in your 928.
09-13-2017, 01:10 PM
#54
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I have always said that it's best to have one of each.
I also agree with the comments about the auto adjustment.
It took me quite a while to get my 87 auto set up correctly.
Truly an amazing difference once you get it all dialed in...
09-15-2017, 10:16 AM
#56
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: May 2007
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Have to say I'd love an automatic now that I'm in my sixties, my manual box car was just great when I was much younger/fitter ( car owned 26 years) always feel I have done a very hard work out when I have driven it now.., but now all the symptoms you get when older are creeping in and therefore reckon the auto box is the one for old guys.
Ken
80 928 S
5 Speed
UK
Ken
80 928 S
5 Speed
UK
09-15-2017, 06:12 PM
#57
Chronic Tool Dropper
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My car ('89 Auto) came to me while we lived in the Los Angeles area. In that environment and regular driving duty, the auto trans was a blessing. Yes there were some times doing mountain touring when I longed a little for a manual, but those were few times compared to the rest of the driving duty.
The '89+ auto boxes with the higher gear ratio don't do first-gear starts just with a kick-down bypass. But a swift push on the pedal below maybe 20 MPH causes a first-gear launch without having to use the shift handle at all. That said, the first gear with the higher final drive is a pretty brutal launch. It shifts up a little below redline on its own. These days, with less real city driving (same as: none), I'd almost rather have a 2.20 final drive for touring. I sort of have an eye out for one, but the want isn't great enough yet.
The '89+ auto boxes with the higher gear ratio don't do first-gear starts just with a kick-down bypass. But a swift push on the pedal below maybe 20 MPH causes a first-gear launch without having to use the shift handle at all. That said, the first gear with the higher final drive is a pretty brutal launch. It shifts up a little below redline on its own. These days, with less real city driving (same as: none), I'd almost rather have a 2.20 final drive for touring. I sort of have an eye out for one, but the want isn't great enough yet.
09-21-2017, 10:54 AM
#58
With my earlier model (86.5), I have an additional kick down button in the dead pedal, branched from the OEM kick down button that I press from standing start or slow rolling start that helps ensure avoiding an early shift to 2'nd. The additional button also provides the means for downshift on demand without turning on the fuel tap. The wire to the additional dead pedal button should be fused as close to the original button as possible.
09-21-2017, 05:03 PM
#59
Nordschleife Master
Same realization for me. Had 84 row 5spd into which Jim Doerr and I installed a late model 5speed. Fun hot rod, but always cumbersome in true comuter traffic.
For some reason the 944/951 5spd is really well geared for comuting, we have a couple of these that might become my in town ride.
Best combo I have now is 84 automatic using an S4 89 rogerbox. Gear reduction compensated for the lower power.
For some reason the 944/951 5spd is really well geared for comuting, we have a couple of these that might become my in town ride.
Best combo I have now is 84 automatic using an S4 89 rogerbox. Gear reduction compensated for the lower power.
09-21-2017, 05:31 PM
#60
Rennlist Member
Bob,
My 89 starts in first gear and I love it! That said, with the lower final drive, it's probably as important as with the earlier cars. I'm about to put a brand new tranny in it from Porsche, so it will be interesting to see if it still starts in 1st. I did play with the cables some, a few years ago, but not sure if that's why it's starting in first.
My 89 starts in first gear and I love it! That said, with the lower final drive, it's probably as important as with the earlier cars. I'm about to put a brand new tranny in it from Porsche, so it will be interesting to see if it still starts in 1st. I did play with the cables some, a few years ago, but not sure if that's why it's starting in first.
My car ('89 Auto) came to me while we lived in the Los Angeles area. In that environment and regular driving duty, the auto trans was a blessing. Yes there were some times doing mountain touring when I longed a little for a manual, but those were few times compared to the rest of the driving duty.
The '89+ auto boxes with the higher gear ratio don't do first-gear starts just with a kick-down bypass. But a swift push on the pedal below maybe 20 MPH causes a first-gear launch without having to use the shift handle at all. That said, the first gear with the higher final drive is a pretty brutal launch. It shifts up a little below redline on its own. These days, with less real city driving (same as: none), I'd almost rather have a 2.20 final drive for touring. I sort of have an eye out for one, but the want isn't great enough yet.
The '89+ auto boxes with the higher gear ratio don't do first-gear starts just with a kick-down bypass. But a swift push on the pedal below maybe 20 MPH causes a first-gear launch without having to use the shift handle at all. That said, the first gear with the higher final drive is a pretty brutal launch. It shifts up a little below redline on its own. These days, with less real city driving (same as: none), I'd almost rather have a 2.20 final drive for touring. I sort of have an eye out for one, but the want isn't great enough yet.