V2Rocket

Do it!
Since you have some pretty serious mods there you may want to get with Lindsey/Rogue to make a custom chip, but you definitely will love having the MAF.

The MAF improves peak power but its real benefit is part-throttle power gains at all RPM, and freer-breathing at full throttle too.
The AFM is 100% holding you back.

Rogue tested his car with 4 degrees offset and I did mine at 2 degrees and got the same HP number, but I suspect there may be variation due to dyno accuracy, some kind of altitude effect (despite SAE correction).

I would think 4 degrees would give more gain than the 2 degrees. I only did 2 degrees to "play it safe", but intend to go to 4 after some more dyno time on 2 degrees where I am now.

nihil

First impressions are good!

Installation was simple and straightforward. The most difficult part was wrestling that protective plastic cap off the coil for the switched +12V feed to the MAF element. I also took an extra few minutes to run a longer wire around the engine bay along the factory harness, as opposed to the shorter one provided running across the front of the engine compartment.

Converting the DME from 24 pin to 28 pin was dead easy and offers up a convenient opportunity to re-solder any aging spots that may need it.

As a preventative maintenance item, I opted for the silicone J-tube (between MAF and TB) as mine was showing its age. Part is well made and fits great.

First start was a bit rough, and there was some stumbling with even minor blips of the throttle coming off idle. So far I'm assuming hot wire/hot film (given the switched +12V) type MAF, and have attributed this to the new MAF burning off oils/lube/whatever from the production process. The effect seems to have lessened greatly (even disappeared?) now that it has a few miles on it, though I've not yet done another cold start.

Before I get to driving impressions, I'll say that I had already suspected that my AFM was on its way out. The car performed well enough, but there was a minor yet definite pulsing hesitation in the upper RPM range when I'd plant the go-foot. This mimicked behavior I had observed in a VW with a similar flappy door AFM, and was one of my motivating factors in purchasing this kit instead of waiting until I'd have time to play with MS.

First drive, all I could say was "wow!". It's still not a fast car by any means or by modern standards, but power delivery is smooth and linear, and there is definitely more power on tap through the entire RPM range. It feels a bit like it knocked several hundred pounds off the curb weight. The butt-dyno is pleased.

Even knowing that I'll probably end up with MS within the next year, I would totally buy this kit again even if I had a brand new AFM that wasn't showing any signs of degradation. Well worth it, and I'm excited to install the offset cam key to see what further gains can be had.

Great job Rogue/LR, this is good bang for the buck.

harrisonrick

I've also heard good things about megasquirt for the S...which is better? Argh!

AZ520

I ordered a kit, it should be here today, installation this weekend. Results to follow.

odonnell

This would be a good question if NA-Tune was available for the S

When it is available, I have no doubt it will be just as much of an improvement as it was for the 8v if not more. How could it not be, with the 16v head capable of flowing almost 2x as much volume rate.

At this moment, there is a MS kit available for 944S that plugs directly into the factory harness. if memory serves you solder it yourself but you can order it already done for a little more. It's easy to do yourself though. It comes with a base map, but until you have it tuned on the dyno (or DIY tune it / autotune), the tune that will come with NA-tune is smoother and will give day-one results.

With that said, I've run both NA-tune and MS on my early car. Both made the car more drivable and added about the same amount of power everywhere, no surprise because both replace the AFM and add a little timing. However, being a tinkerer, I'm glad I went to MS because I can play with it and basically do whatever I want. A lot of people want a contained PnP kit that they can just plug in and drive, so it all depends how hands-on you want to be with your manangement.

harrisonrick

Hmm...I really don't want to tinker with a laptop, solder and program stuff, plug and play with HP improvement would be nice. Right now I'm running Russell Berry's MaxHP chip, and it improved acceleration and leveled out that flat spot. I think it added possibly 7-10% HP...something like that. Its been in there for at least 5 years or more.

By the looks of things, the MS and MAF are roughly the same cost, although I assume MS offers more custom tuning by the car owner.

odonnell

NA-tune uses all your existing gear except the AFM obviously. MS is a replacement for most of Motronic.

Replacing the AFM and existing tune is the main objective of NA-Tune. Replacing the AFM is more of a side benefit of MS, moreso than the overall objective of the platform (which is complete control over configuration and electronic control/signals).

2 very different products, MS can do what NA-tune does but you have to keep in mind you're not in kansas anymore as far as the rest of the electronics go. You really have to know what you're signing up for. If done correctly, it's very versatile, reliable, and limitlessly expandable. But I would strongly discourage it if you don't like to solder, tinker, and work out a bunch of details as you go. I'm cool with all of those, and it took me a month of car downtime to finish the install.

ideola

Mike, will LR be providing on-going support to Joshua's original customers should the need arise?


I think I acquired one of Josh's last units. I have it in my 88 924S SE. I've since added a skimmed (higher compression) head with fresh 5-angle grind, the complete ASR lightweight drive pulley kit with adjustable timing gear set to 4° advance, A/C delete, P/S delete, lightweight crank pulley, underdrive alt pulley, MSDS Gen2 header, and Dansk stainless cat-back with cat delete. This is a very potent combination that completely transforms an early 8v car, and all easily doable in stages. The NA-Tune + MAF conversion amplifies all of the other mods. One of my experienced 944 friends said it was hands down the most responsive 8v 944/924S he'd ever driven.

I hope to dyno the car at some point, just to see on paper what the results are. But I can whole-heartedly endorse the NA-Tune product as the best $$$ you can spend to improve the power output of your early 8v car. So glad to see the product being picked up and supported.

harrisonrick

I think I'll wait for the S MAF kit...I am handy, buy not that handy. It sounds more plug and play for the average dope like me. Tuning with a laptop is over my patience and skills.

I might do the S2 intake swap first, then add the MAF kit after...that'll give Rogue and Lindsey time to perfect a kit for us.

AZ520

Installed the kit this morning, first test drive I let it sit and idle for 5-6 minutes and settle in, then took it out for about 25 minutes. Butt dyno confirms more power, the only problem is its running too rich. I have an AEM wideband and I was seeing 10-11 part throttle, with some backfiring going on. I have the FQS set all the way counter clockwise in the stock position. Anyone else experience this? Will it settle in after a few drive cycles? Fuel system is all stock, injectors etc.

GoKart

Nice work!!

nihil

I will admit to having been skeptical, but as of this afternoon I now believe that long 2nd is good stuff.

JCBO

Does the kit work with 83-85 motors and DME? Those chips are soldered and I think have less free space around them.

AZ520

No it will not work with the early DME, You need to find a later DME and it needs to be converted to 28 pin socket.

Arominus

you need a late DME to do the conversion, the 24 to 28 pin conversion is easy.